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I'm getting ready for my April Nyala and bushbuck trip so I tried a couple of different bullets in the 375 H&H. The first two groups, (across the top) were with the CEB 235 grain Raptor ER and 79.5 & 80 grains of Reloader 15. The first group was from a clean barrel and was a fouling load. The middle group was with the CEB 230 grain Raptor ES and apparently my gun hates that bullet as it went into 3+". The lower left group was back to the 235 grain ER bullet (79.5 grains of R15) and went into a neat .575" group. And the lower right group was back to the 230 grain ES bullet and was so bad that I took an extra shot to make sure it was not a fluke. it's an honest 5.4" group. The 79.5 grain load with the 235 grain ER bullet shot at 2963 fps and an extreme spread of 8.1 fps, SD of 4.7 fps.  Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | ||
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Are ya sure, sure, sure you want to take that .375 along? Told y'all Frank knew what he was doing (with any caliber.) Have fun! _______________________ | |||
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Did you mean to say the 235gr bullet here? That's really fast but a quick check with a few resources shows that velocity is not out of the ordinary for a 235gr bullet in the 375 H&H. Looks like you found a good long range load for your rifle. . | |||
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Yep, thanks, corrected. 375 H&H, 235 g Raptor ER 2963 fps 2400' elevation, 77 deg F & 10 MPH wind Calculated Table Range...Drop....Windage..Velocity (yd)....(in)....(in)....(ft/s) 100.....1.8.....0.9.....2708 200.....0.4.....3.8.....2467 250.....-2.3....6.1.....2352 300.....-6.7....9.......2239 350.....-12.8...12.5....2129 Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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Interesting groups, especially that 5.4" group, which really opened up. How far off the lands is the bullet ogive? . -------- There are those who only reload so they can shoot, and then there are those who only shoot so they can reload. I belong to the first group. Dom --------- | |||
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I don't have an exact measurement. I seat bullets to fit the magazine so with the plastic tip, these both have a long jump to the lands. But the 230 grain ES bullet looks rounder at the front so it may have a shorter jump. What I find is interesting is that the 235 grain ER loads show a slight tendency to horizontal dispersion and the groups with the 230 grain ES bullet show a lot of vertical dispersion. Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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Thanks for the info. Just seems to be either good or terrible on those loads; rifle sure don't like those 230s. I don't think any amount of difference in bullet jump short or long is going to magically turn them from those groups to moa. -------- There are those who only reload so they can shoot, and then there are those who only shoot so they can reload. I belong to the first group. Dom --------- | |||
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I've had excellent results with the Barnes TSX in the 235 gr load. Less than 1/2" groups for 5 shots at 100. I haven't as of yet tried the CEB's in the 235, just the 270 Raptors. | |||
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hi lads, im doing a 200gr .375 pill now as well, it really flattens the 375 h&h out. im now using this as my go to every day bullet here in aus | |||
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I tried to go out Sunday morning to the ranch to try these loads at 300 yards but we had a freak storm come through just as I got set up. It was raining hard with thunder and lightening so I had to pack it up and go home. Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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I got the 375 H&H out this morning but could only shoot it at 200 yards. The sagebrush has grown up so high that I couldn't see the target frame at 300. Here's the 235 grain CEB with 76 grains of Reloader 15 (2850 fps), a nice 1.2" group @ 200 yards.  Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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The 375 is a good all round cartridge. Loaded right it is legal for dangerous game in Africa and plains game as well. If it is accurate also, the plan truly comes together. 5 Shots at 100 with a GSC HV 200gr bullet at over 3000fps.  Another 5 shot group with the same rifle and load at 300.  | |||
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Like any game dept. is actual going to crony a load to see if it meets the energy requirements. | |||
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Does anyone have experience with these, or other, light 375 bullets on game that one intends to eat? | |||
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p dog shooter, In South Africa it is just the caliber that matters and not the energy. You can use a handgun too, as long as it meets the requirement. Stupid, I know, but that is how it is. Brice, I cannot speak for other manufacturers but tests that we did on small animals with a 375H&H and the 200gr HV bullet were very good. This page has some of the detail. This page also has the 200gr 375HV bullet. There was less meat damage than with jacketed bullets yet the 200gr 375 opens to double caliber from 1600fps impacts. We even did testing with the 265gr HV and a 375H&H on springbok. Karoo springbok weigh about 30lbs to 35lbs dressed out. It is a lot of power to apply to such a small animal. We were very happy with the result there as well. See slightly below the middle of this page. | |||
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I've used both the Speer and Barnes 235's on deer. Both were very accurate with velocity high enough that they would destroy a fair amount of meat if shot placement was less than ideal. Tried the 250 Barnes TTSX and it would not group in my rifle so never hunted with it. Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
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I agree with Blacktailer, judicious shot placement will help with blood soaked meat. Definitely an elk hammer but you don't want to take a shoulder shot. | |||
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Fastest 375 H&H load I have shot and chronographed was SAX Munition KJG-SR Factory ammo. 154gr bullet at 3507 FPS. Accurate and very well made ammo, but . . . I prefer 300gr A-frame at about 2600 fps. With compressed load of RL-17, it is accurate enough for 300m+ shots. No problem to hunt anything from small deer to very large game and there is a very little meat damage. With lighter and faster bullet, there will be significant meat damage, especially at smaller game. Just my two cents. Jiri (I use laser rangefinder binocular and rifle scope with ballistic turret, so I don't have to care about bullet drop at all) | |||
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Speed as a factor is not a significant contributor to meat damage. Fragmentation of the bullet is the major factor. We have done testing on plains game where speed differences of 1000fps between cartridges made virtually no difference to meat damage, because the fragmentation of the bullets used were very similar. The faster a bullet is driven, the more a bullet will fragment. Jacketed lead core bullets fragment easier than monometal bullets. the trick is to get monometal bullets to open easily and then arrest the opening of the bullet at a certain point. GS Custom has refined this initial opening and then arresting the expansion, better than most with the HV type bullet. With GSC solids, the FN type bullet, this is also a factor and there GSC has done much research and shot a large number of animals, to arrive at the configuration of this bullet. As one would not expect similar performance from all jacketed bullets, one should not expect similar performance from all monometal bullets. | |||
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Gerard, How did you actually do this?? I thought expansion is a function of the hollow point and how deep it is. At least that is how we control how a bullet expands and penetrates. | |||
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Gerard I agree with your point of view, but partially. I think also that hydrodynamic shock and the creation of hematoma or bruise is function of velocity (i.e. non expanding 3500FPS FMJ will do higher damage than the same 2500FPS FMJ). Second effect is maybe caused by accelerated bone particles etc. Time ago, I neck shot a hare with 375. Hit the spine and there were no damage around at all. Seen similar sized game shot by .223 Remington and half of the venison was "blue". But I think it could be very interesting experiment to compare meat damage with same bullet and different velocity ;-) Jiri | |||
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Saeed, I spent a couple of years between 1995 and 1997 researching this aspect and have been refining it since then. There is a lot more to it than the volume of the hollow point. At this stage, GSC can do a new bullet and usually we get the shape and dimensions right on the first or the second try. We did a bullet for a 230 Ackley recently and of course we did not have a rifle with which to do the testing. After some research, we sent a test lot to the owner of the rifle, he tested and, in this case, we made a small adjustment and made the bullets. He has hunted with this bullet and it works perfectly on close as well as long shots. Not only have we made bullets for small calibers, we have done new bullets as big as a 2700gr .700". The good news is that this service does not cost the customer, he only pays once we have a bullet that gets the job done and he buys a box (or more) of them. Jiri, I hear you. We did testing by shooting springbok with a 223Rem at 3700fps, a 22-250 and a wildcat 224 at 4700fps, using the same 40gr bullet for all of them. At the end of the shoot, the landowner could not tell which carcass was shot with which cartridge. When a bullet takes into account, simplistically, only the speed at which it will strike, I understand your statement. On calibers, as an example, we go further than most as well. How many manufacturers do you know that makes a different diameter bullet for a 375H&H and a 378 Weatherby, a 7x57 and a 7-08 or for a 6.5x55 and a 260Rem? We do it as a matter of course, this is normal where we are concerned. Most manufacturers make caliber specific bullets and some do not even go there. GSC makes cartridge specific recommendations and not just caliber recommendations. The bottom line is that all manufacturers cannot be bothered to make these differences. We do and more good news is that we do not charge more than some other makes. In fact we are priced below many other mainstream manufacturers and less than other small manufacturers. GSC asks very respectfully that we are not lumped together with other manufacturers. Follow our guidelines and enjoy the results. | |||
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Interesting. We only have one design of our Walterhog bullets - I just scale them up or down for different calibers. We have been using our 300 grain 375 caliber in Africa now for many years, and they all perform great, at any distance. | |||
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Scaling up and down is good where the bullet is used in similar cartridges. When one also has to accommodate different twist rates, the ratio of case volume/barrel volume and so on, we find that designs have to differ in more aspects. We consider many different aspects of a cartridge. I have to count but it is more than 12 that are important to us. | |||
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Talking about meat damage by high velocity. I built a wildcat by necking the full length 404 Jeffery case down to 270, and if I remember rightly we were getting about 3500 fps out of it. I only shot one animal with that cartridge, and due to the intensive meat damage, I stopped using it. The animal was a bushbuck. He was quartering away at quite an angle, and the bullet hit him just ahead of the rear leg, going forward. The whole body was blood shot!! In fact, we have never seen anything like it, before or after. He looked like someone had gone over him with a sledge hammer, as there was nowhere where one can actually see normal meat. | |||
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 Out of curiosity, Saeed. what bullet did you use and at what distance was the anumal? rogerOld age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone.. | |||
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I think the bullet was Barnes X and the animals was about 180 yards away. | |||
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It is more than likely that the bullet tumbled. High meat damage with a mono only comes from a tumbling bullet. What was the weight of the bullet and the twist rate of the barrel? Here is a picture of a blesbuck where the HV bullet (of course it is a mono) was completely stable but the impact speed was about 4400fps. The distance of the shot was about 120 yards.  | |||
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The number 1 reason I use barnes bullets is because I've experienced much less meat damage/bruising than from any other bullets. That is just my experience, but I'd like to hear what others have seen. | |||
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