Hi all!!!

I am new to reloading Rifle ammo , in fact my next cartridge will be the first...


I have been reloading Shotshells since 1972 , but Brass loading is a different matter...

I am loading 308 and have purchased 2 types of Powder ; IMR 4895 & IMR 4831 also Winchester Regular and Magnum Primers......

For the last few weeks , I have been researching this site to try and get some info on what is involved in reloading 308 brass...

I have tumbled , deprimed , trim/deburred and resized the brass , according to info from this site and videos on Youtube..

Also I have a reloading manuel to get the load data according to those guys...

My questions are :

(1) Does anyone have a special load data that works best when they use these two powder types using 308 Brass ????

I am using 155 gr. Sierra Match BTHP bullets for paper punching..

(2) Is there an overall cartridge length specs. or certian depth for to set the bullet safely????


Thank you in advance for any advice , all is appreciated...

Cheers from the Rock!!!

Robert

( Newfoundlander )

Newfoundlander
What manual do you have? Most good manuals have all the specs that you would need for any particular ctg. To get a good load for your particular rifle you will have to work up a load yourself. Often a load that would work great in any other rifle may not be any good for your rifle. The following link should help you a bit. Be sure to use IMR 4831 data and not H4831 as they are not the same.
Actually 4831 is a bit slow for .308 Win.
Good luck. Get a good manual such as Hornady,Sierra, etc. They all have a great explanation on how to reload safely. After you follow the link below just enter Rifle and 308 and hit get data.
http://www.6mmbr.citymaker.com/f/Sierra308Win.pdf


http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

I can't help you on the powders since those aren't ones I use for my 308 Win. loads except to say that the Nosler manual lists various suitable powders for each cartridge and also indicates what the most accurate loads were.

The factors you have to consider for cartridge length are:

1. The cartridge has to be short enough to fit in the magazine if your gun has a magazine.

2. The bullet should not be actually engaging the rifling; just off the rifling is good.

3. The bullet has to be seated deeply enough to hold it securely. A rule of thumb is to have it seated at least a bullet diameter deep.

Your choice of Sierra Match bullets is good because if any bullet will be accurate in your gun, they will be. Once you've developed an accurate load with them, you can substitute a jacketed hunting bullet with the same load if need be.

The Winchester WLR primers should be quite adequate in a 308 Win. but WLRM should be OK as well.

The 2 Books that I have available are very vague in my opinion...

Hodgdon basic reloaders manuel 2000 , soft cover book which gives a load for 150 grain Nosler BT Bullet as 45.5 grains and a 168 grain Sierra HPBT as 43.5 grains of 4895 respectifully....

I also am thinking that this manuel is referring to Hodgdon 4895 Powder , I don't know if there is a difference in IMR and Hodgdon Powders for both types of 4895...

Also I has a softcover IMR handloaders guide for Smokeless Powders which is equally as vague in the data it shows..

It only lists a load data for Remington 150 grain PTD. SPCL with a charge of 44.5 grains IMR 4895...

I thought that the 4831 would be of not much use in the 308 , but I am planning on loading for 300 Magnum in the future , so I can use it then...

As a point of interest , I tried to deprime Military Crimped in Brass and broke the pin on my RCBS die after trying to decap the first Case...

I am now knocking out primers with a Lee decapper and base set until I can receive additional pins from the Dealer...

500 Military Cases gone in the Trash , as I am sticking to the Common Factory Brass from now on...

Lessons learned along the way , even the hard way...

Thanks thus far for the informative comments , I look forward to hearing from others on this subject and other topics which arise in my venture..

Robert

( Newfoundlander )

NOOOooooo!!! You didn't throw the military brass away.

Military brass is some of my favorite. The brass is thicker so it's tougher and since it's thicker takes a bit less powder to get to a given loading pressure than commercial brass. I know, deprimeing it is a bit tedious and you may break a decapping pin once in a while but decapping pins are cheap. Then there is removing the crimp for the primer; a bit of a bother but not too hard. I also inspect military brass for eccentric primer flash holes and if it's off center, dischard that piece of brass. Once you've done all that, it holds up very well and produces quite accurate loads.

As far as loads are concerned, you can go to Hodgdon's web site and get bunches of loads. You can also get loads from www.stevespages.com. Also, Hodgdon publishes a reloading magazine yearly that gives various loads for Hodgdon, IMR and Winchester powders.

What Grumulkin said. In spades.

The punch and base is the correct tool for decapping crimped primers. If you retain the brass, be sure to try it in the chamber after sizing but before loading it. Machine gun brass can be deformed from running in a loose chamber. Besides removing the priming crimp, it may need extra resizing before loading. It is tough brass, though.

I retrieved the Military Brass at our local Gun Range , and for a fact I know that it was not fired from a Machine Gun or even Semi Auto...

It was put through Bolt Action Rifles by the Local Canadian Ranger Home Guard...

After breaking the Pin in the Die , I just threw the Brass out in discust with no plans of using it again in the future...

Not knowing that it was a common thing to break pins from those Dies , I just figured it was too much of a hassle for to bother keeping the stuff....


Being located in Newfoundland , Rifle Loading supplies are not readyily available , and has to be ordered from Western Canada...


I just recently gotten into loading Brass , and didn't order extra pins due to not knowing that they were available and easily broken..

I guess that it is a learning experience as I go through the deal of loading..


Thanks much,

Robert

( Newfoundlander )

quote:

Originally posted by Newfoundlander:
I retrieved the Military Brass at our local Gun Range , and for a fact I know that it was not fired from a Machine Gun or even Semi Auto...

It was put through Bolt Action Rifles by the Local Canadian Ranger Home Guard...

After breaking the Pin in the Die , I just threw the Brass out in discust with no plans of using it again in the future...

Not knowing that it was a common thing to break pins from those Dies , I just figured it was too much of a hassle for to bother keeping the stuff....


Being located in Newfoundland , Rifle Loading supplies are not readyily available , and has to be ordered from Western Canada...


I just recently gotten into loading Brass , and didn't order extra pins due to not knowing that they were available and easily broken..

I guess that it is a learning experience as I go through the deal of loading..


Thanks much,

Robert

( Newfoundlander )

Don't know where you are ordering your components from. Perhaps you get them from here http://www.higginsonpowders.com/ If not check them out prices are good on a lot of things and they are great to deal with.

quote:

Originally posted by Newfoundlander:
I retrieved the Military Brass at our local Gun Range , and for a fact I know that it was not fired from a Machine Gun or even Semi Auto...

It was put through Bolt Action Rifles by the Local Canadian Ranger Home Guard...

After breaking the Pin in the Die , I just threw the Brass out in discust with no plans of using it again in the future...

Not knowing that it was a common thing to break pins from those Dies , I just figured it was too much of a hassle for to bother keeping the stuff....


Being located in Newfoundland , Rifle Loading supplies are not readyily available , and has to be ordered from Western Canada...


I just recently gotten into loading Brass , and didn't order extra pins due to not knowing that they were available and easily broken..

I guess that it is a learning experience as I go through the deal of loading..


Thanks much,

Robert

( Newfoundlander )

Looking at the dates of your postings, I wonder if you could still get those 500 cases out of the trash it would be worthwhile (unless next week another 500 cases is going to show up again).

Once the primers are out and the crimp in the primer cup is removed (with an inexpensive tool) the brass will be just fine for lots and lots of firings.

Depriming pins are not fragile or easily broken, it's just that crimped-in primer cups in miltary brass is tougher. Once the crimp (shoulder) is removed, normal primers will fit tightly in the brass just as in civilian brass. (Remember what Grumulkin said about the primer flash hole. For best accuracy, it is best to ensure the primer's flash hole is centered and uniform in size from casing to casing-even in premium brass, as well as uniforming the primer cup depth, that is, if you are a stickler for controlling every variable.)

Once that brass is fire formed to your gun's chamber it will probably last forever, as future "working" of the metal will be minimal, especially if you just do "neck sizing".

Good shooting.

Lost Sheep

Good shooting.

Hi Lost Sheep , thanks for your input and Merry Christmas...

I am using Sierra 155 grain bullets , and am wondering what the total length of the cartridge should be in order to be safe...

I notice that when I tried to set the bullet to my Lands in the Chamber Gaugeing sequence , the lighter 155 grain bullets were shorter than the 180 grain hunting bullets which I also have...

I read that seating the bullet out to the lands will give more accuracy..

Is there a difference in length between Hunting and Match Cartridges , and what are the maximun lengths that can be reached safely????..

Thanks again in advance,

Robert

( Newfoundlander )

Robert:

Since you're obviously new to reloading, before you get all excited over the military brass as some have recommended, check to be sure it is boxer primed. Many older cases, such as the EXCELLENT Portuguese surplus are Berdan primed which is essentially not reloadable. Simply look down inside a fired case and see if there is one centered hole or two offcenter ones. The latter are Berdan primed. Many, many depriming pins have fallen victim to Berdan brass......

I've never reloaded the 155 MKs in the .308 but 4895 is one of the old standbys for the 168s. Here is some loading info I copied from Hogdon's website......this doesn't display well but the 2.775" is OAL, the 43 gr is a starting load and the 46 is MAX.

155 GR. SIE HPBT Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.775" 43.0 2735 42,000 CUP 46.0 2873 49,700 CUP

Hi Gatogordo..

I am new to reloading brass , in fact I haven't finished a cartridge yet , and hope to get more info before I feel comfortable with it..

I have been loading Shotshells since 1972 , and know the importance of keeping within the limits of Barrel Preasure , and the such to keep all in one piece...


The Military Brass was stamped WCC 95 and had a ( plus sign inside a circle ) stamped on the bottom..


Hope that this helps in telling what type it was..

This stuff is readilly available here , and if it is a better quality brass than the Factory stuff , I will make an effort to obtain more..

Thanks for your reply , Happy Christmas,


Robert


( Newfoundlander )

Robert

What you are descibing as manuals are not reloading manuals, a manual is a hard cover book with about 900 pages, Hornady,Nosler Sierra, Barnes, Speer. These are all bullet manufacturers that publish data for their bullets with various powders you can use. Lyman also make a well regarded manual. At the start of each caliber in these books they show you all the measurements including cartridge over all length.

Do you own a set of calipers for measuring?
If not there is a digital model that most Canadian Tire stores carry.
The Sierra manual has data for IMR 4895 powder with a starting load at 39.8 gr going to 43.7 gr. Over all lenth maximum is 2.810 inches.
Good luck FS