Some say to quench the case in cold water and a few say no. Is there a stander way?
THANKS
Jerry

It is explained well at Varmint Al's web site.

I have only annealed 1 case in any volume being .22 Hornet that I am reforming to .17 Ackley Hornet. I quench mine mainly as I dont want the heat travelling down and annealing the lower area of the case and quenching arrests that. I use water.

I was told & have only done it once so I don't know if it really works. Use a candle & heat the case up until its too hot to handle. Then let it cool naturally. Cases annealed!

Has anyone else tried that?

The reason I have some doubt is that I've seen the cases that have been heated by a blowtorch in water up to nearly the necks. They're glowing red, obviously I get to nothing like that temperature.

Another way I have heard is to dip the necks into molten lead but I don't fancy the health consequence in doing it that way & you have to flick the last bits of molten lead off before it solidifies.

Regards
JohnT

Dear Jerry:

I started annealing 7x57 AI cases four years ago to extend case life. I obtained the process from the "Any Shot You Want" A-Square Handloading and Rifle Manual, 1996.

I stand them in a pan with approximately one inch of water to keep the case head cool. Then I propane torch them to light red color. After heating them, I knock them over into the water. No splits after 7-10 reloadings.

I never tried the hold them 'til they're too hot approach.

Does the annealing work; don't know yet. But the chapter on annealing in his book is informative.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

This has a pretty good discussion.

http://www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html

I like to reload in fairly large batches. A few years back, I bought 500 Remington empty cases to load for my .308 Win. About three month after loading this ammo, necks were splitting. I lost almost one-fourth of that batch of brass, had to break down the rest and anneal the neck to save the rest of the brass. I can only figure that this was brass from a lot that was not properly annealed from the factory. Normally for the .308, I neck size for 4 reloadings, anneal the necks and full length resize for the fifth loading. That batch of Remington brassis on it's twelvth reloading. it might be good for one more if I'm lucky, but the primer pockets are starting to get a bit loose.
I anneal by holding the neck in the flame of a propane torch and drop them into a bucket of water to quench. I an of the thought that letting them air cool might make the base area way too soft for safety and don'r recommend it.
Paul B.

Draw cold tap water from your facuet and go to work.

I use Yales method!!!!

I've used the method discribed by Yale for over 40 years with never a problem.

John T
This method will harden brass. Brass's properties are very different from iron/steel.

muck

Without something like the Ken Light machine chances are that you will do more harm then good with any of the jury rigged methods. The neck must be heated evenly for the entire circunfrence, whick is difficult if not impossible with a propane torch, not to mention getting the right temp.

quote:

Originally posted by b beyer:
Without something like the Ken Light machine chances are that you will do more harm then good with any of the jury rigged methods. The neck must be heated evenly for the entire circunfrence, whick is difficult if not impossible with a propane torch, not to mention getting the right temp.

Hey Bob, How do you believe people Annealed "prior to" the Ken Light or other machines?

I do agree there is a short learning curve, but I've used three of the above mentioned Methods for quite a long time and did not find any of them impossible. They all work well.

I don't see how the "candle" trick could possibly work, but if he is able to use it and not have Neck Splits, I'd be surprised.

Good Hunting and clean 1-shot Kills.

Posted 24 April 2007 20:38
From what I've read and practiced over the years there is a whole bunch of bad misinformation regarding annealing brass . Now don't jump down my ass ,I'm simply going to attempt to explain a bad method !.

When brass becomes work hardened it becomes brittle . Heating brass then dumping it in water does the same thing !.

Only the neck and a touch of the shoulder ( assuming rifle cases and there is a shoulder ) is to be heated to 660 degrees . Then set aside to cool not chill quenched by liquid !. Now 660 - 750 degrees works but 665 is Ideal and is extremely close to factory annealing in most cases ( No Pun intended ) .

Someone told me about a turn table with a two torch set up ( one inside one out side ) of the turn table suspended above the cases . Small precise tips direct heat evenly . It would need to have an empty slot or indexing station . So as to fire the torches start the rotation of the table and turn X number of times . Depending on the size or capacity of the table and or size of cases to be done . Once temp. is reached shut off . Portable infer red temp gun could be used to monitor the cases furthest away from torches . So as to correctly know case temp. and not have to guess !. This would only heat the neck and slightly on the shoulder . Not down to the case head

Does anyone know of this unit or if anyone even makes it ?. My friend said he didn't remember where he heard about it or saw it !.

If no one has it !. I may just put a retired tool and die buddy of mine on building one !.

After all he used to build proto type machines for Japanese company's !. Before CAD designing Computer hard ware for HP . Then making some of the stuff for them to boot !.He has the talent and then some !. ... salute


Dr.K Carbon

Let me also add if your cases turn orange or red you've ruined them !. As that is in the 900 degree heat and above range for brass !.

Metallurgy says 665 is IDEAL !. Up to 750 will work but shortens use full life of case !.

I checked with a Friend in that line of work he agreed 665 is the correct temp. !...

Hey Doc

Here is the Ken Light annealing machine.

Other info also.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr.K:
Posted 24 April 2007 20:38
From what I've read and practiced over the years there is a whole bunch of bad misinformation regarding annealing brass. ,I'm simply going to attempt to explain a bad method !.

Hey Dr.K, You are correct that there is a "lot of bad misinformation regarding annealing". The problem is you are the one putting out that bad information and that is not intended as jumping on you at all.

quote:

When brass becomes work hardened it becomes brittle.

Correct

quote:

Heating brass then dumping it in water does the same thing !.

Wrong-O! Brass has totally different Mechanical Properties than Steel or Iron. You can find the specifics concerning this unique feature of Brass in a Machinists Handbook.

The wonderful thing about all of this is it is relatively easy for anyone to prove to themselves by simply doing the Annealing and letting three Air Cool and quickly Quinch three other Cases with cold Water. Then reload, shoot, reload, shoot, etc. to see which cases have Split Necks first.
---

Best of luck with your Annealing Dr.K.

From the old 'Norma Gunbugs Guide'Stand them in a pan of water,to about 3/4 of their height.The primers should be removed,permitting water to enter the case. Heat the case necks to cherry red [with a propane torch],at which temperature the brass has reassumed it' maximum softness.As soon as the the correct temperature has been reached tip the case into the water to cool quickly.....They ought to no better than most on how to anneal brass !!

Varmint Al's annealing system works very well. But annealing cases as in muzzleloading and reloading is full of opinionated, ham-handed, hard headed individuals who won't explore the basic metallurgy of the work, never develop a feel for a press handle, break ramrods consistently, and would get upset over mere opinions. N.S.