I have had a couple of people Email me asking me what a Seafire is, or what does the name mean.



So lack of Any Place else to post it, ( not that anyone was concerned, LOL)



My handle is named after a WW 2 British Fighter Aircraft.

More people are familiar with a Spitfire, which was to Britain in WW 2, what the P 51 Mustang was to the USA.



A Seafire was the Navalized Version of the Spitfire.



My other interest besides Hunting and Shooting and Reloading, is in Aircraft, particularly WW2 aircraft.



The B 17G in my name is what I was going to change my handle to and drop the Seafire, but it did not happen.



So for the 2 or 3 people who had " inquiring Minds" Now you know. Sorry to bore the rest of anyone who wasted the time reading this explanation.



Cheers and Good shooting.

Seafire

I think it's kinda interesting that the aircraft that the Supermarine Spitfire evolved from was originally a float plane built for air races. today, we'd probablly think the floats would cause too much drag for a racer!

Also interesting that the Mustang originated as a response to a BRITISH needs specification, but ended up being the U.S.'s top WWII fighter!

I got a ride in a 17G last year, the Collins Foundation has a 17 and a 24 that they travel around in , and finance a lot of their upkeep with rides. 350.00 bucks a trip, maybe 45 min. I have no idea how those people spent the time in them that they did. It is one shaky SOB. I tried to get in the 24 but by the time the 17 got back their day was done.
Its worth the money. Bob

Seafire,

If I recall my history channel correctly, wasnt the powerhouse for the awsome P-51 Mustang a british built Rolls Royce?? Same as the Spitfire??

Good stuff!

I thought the P-51 had a unique engine, that was far more engine than the others. The problem was it was water cooled and one shot could bring it down, where the P-47 could go on with more holes than a democratic foreign policy.

The P-51 had Allison engines at first,the RR Merlins were added later.These engines were built in the states under licence.The heart of a fighter is the engine,and these Merlins added power and fuel ecomomy.

Ok the P-51's(early vs) had a powerplant of one 1,520hp Packard(rolls-royce)V-1650Merlin piston engine with a max speed of 439mph @ 30,000ft.. The later vs. of the P-51's had a powerplant of one 1,400hp Packard V-1650-3 Merlin in-line piston engine with a max speed of 438mph @ 30K..





There also was a P-51D that had one 1,510hp Packard V-1650-7 (U.S-built Rolls-Royce Merlin 61) inverted-vee 12-cylinder inline water-cooled piston engine max speed of 445mph @ 25,000ft..

6.5 Bandit

Here is the spitfires power plants...

Spitfire MK I had one 1,060hp Rolls-Royce Merlin III liquid cooled piston engine.. Max speed is 360mph @20,000ft.

Spitfire VA had one 1440hp Rolls-Royce Merlin 45 Vee piston engine.. max speed is 374mph @ 13,000ft

Spitfire Mk XIVe had one 2,050hp Rolls-Royce Griffon in-line piston engine.. nax speed is 447mph @ 26,000ft

Spitefire MK IXE had one 1,565hp Rolls-Royce Melin 61 liquid cooled piston engine.. max speed is 407mph @ 25,000ft

Spitefire Mk 1A had one 1,030hp Rolls-Royce Merlin III liquid cooled V-12 enging.. max speed is 363mph @ 19,000ft

Yes I am a airplane junky to!!!

6.5 Bandit

Yeah Western, It sure was. It was an awesome engine for its time. Have seen several up close and personal. Truly an impressive engine, particularly for the time.

Cheers and Good Shooting
Seafire

Sean, Amen. While the P 51 had the glamour, the P 47 did one hell of a job. It was a tough aircraft. It is also my favorite American fighter of WW2.

Considered that seriously for a handle also.

But I like too many of the aircraft. Like guns, Never met one I didn't like.

Cheers and good shooting,
Seafire

Glad to see so many guys are also into Aircraft besides hunting and shooting.

Good facts guys. I have been lucky enough to climb in a B 17, B 25, B29 and others. A real treat was when I was in High School, I worked at the Smithsonian Museum building models and displays.

I am originally from Virginia.

One thing that was fantastic working for the Smithsonian was having access to Silver Hill. For those not in the know, Silver Hill MD is basically the Smithsonians garage. It is where they store all their STUFF. It was a Logistic Center during WW 2 but after the war it was de activated and given to the Smithsonian.

All of those Captured WW 2 German and Japanese Experimental planes that were brought back to the USA for testing after the war were all donated to the Smithsonian.

I was even allowed to climb all thru the Enola Gay, with no one looking over my shoulder. It was AWESOME.

My dad was an Air Force officer, so I lived in England from 1963 to 1966 where I was living around all of these bases from WW 2 that the AF still had alot of around, in case something broke out with the Russians.

IN 1965 when my school needed an Auditorium, the AF let us have access to one building across the street from School that had been a briefing room during the War. On stage, covered under I bet 10 inches of dust, was the map of Northern Europe on the wall, and all the information, coordinates etc, from the last Bombing Mission the 303rd BG flew over Germany in 1945. The war ended and it was just locked up. I marveled at that. We even had a few left over hulks of B 17's still on the base. We kids use to sneak out of school during lunch or recess and go play in them, even tho they were in an off limits area. All that ever happened is that we were told to stay out of there, and "can't you stupid kids read a sign??"

It was hard not getting caught up in all of it. History and nostalgia were all over the place.

As 6.5 Bandit said, Yeah I am an airplane junky.

I can see I am in GOOD Company. Thanks for the response guys.

Cheers and good shooting.
seafire

My wifes Dad was a 17 pilot initially, then flew his own B24 over to Britain. Flew about a dozen combat missions before the war ended.

I got a ride on one of the CAF B17's about ten years ago. I agree! What a shaky, and noisy, rattletrap! But tremendous sounds, smells and sensations too! Really takes a person back to what it may have been like.

I SO repsect those brave souls who flew back in WW2. I have known several over they years but we are losing them quickly.

FN in MT

Yeah, WWII vets are getting fewer and fewer.



An uncle drove truck on lend/lease route through Iran and Iraq till D-day, and across France thereafter. Survived the war and now gone.



Another relative was an artillery scout in the 4th Armored Division. Surivied the war and now gone.



Another relative was a B-17 flight instructor untill the program shut down in the wanings days of war in Europe. He was then posted to Tinian as a B-29 co-pilot. He was involved in the world's second nuclear mission as a bit of decoy. The plane carrying the bomb crossed the target at 20,000'(no contrail) while the flak plane (decoy, carrying several waist gunners and 2 British observers) crossed at 40,000'(easy to see contrail) a bit behind the bomb plane. In addition to drawing AAA, the flak plane was also tasked with taking on any fighters which rose to meet them (hence the extra gunners). They did spot 2 Japanese fighters taking off way late to interfere with the bomb run. After the drop, both B-29s dove and accelerated away from groundzero. He's still kicking and good for a story every once in a while.

I always liked the name of the reconnaisance plane I worked on while serving in the Navy. RA5C Vigilante . Held both top speed and altitude records until the SR71 came along. Originally designed to drop A bombs. Matter of fact the squadron insignia was a tiger smoking a cigar blowing a mushroom cloud smoke ring.
I never considered using it as my username though...some folks might get the wrong impression.

Just happened upon your thread and have to say that I really enjoy it. I always liked airplanes too, but never developed as great an appreciation for them as you fellows. My father certainly did not encourage me as he was in the Airborn and was always jumping out of the things....

Just a little added info on Seafires here, they are quite a bit rarer then Spitfires, as most of the RN and RCN's use consisted of launching the fighter off the rear deck of a convoy escort ship when needed, then crashlanding in the water and trying to hoist the plane back aboard before it sank. There was a local boy who was rebuilding one (a Seafire) a few years back, I had the good fortune to both sit in the plane and muck about a bit with the Merlin engines (he had a spare for parts). Very interesting airplane. I should have had a camera. - Dan

Frank, guys like your dad are real hero's in my book!

I've never flown in a B17, but have been in one... I was amazed at how small the plane really is. Also sat in the cockpit of a Sptifire once... it's my all-time favorite fighter... an absolutely gorgeous creation.

You can add this airplane junkie to the list. I like almost all the fighters of WW-1 and WW-2 and someof the Korean war as well. The current flying blowtorches don't thrill me overmuch.
I likesome of the more oddball planes in between the two major wars. The Grumman Duck, and amphibious biplane is one. Watch reruns of the Black Sheep Squadron, or the movie Murphy's War to see one if you don't recognize the bird. AKAIK, there are only two of these aircraft left in existance. Pity. The German Stuka is another favorite. Love the Mustangs in all configurations. There was an article I read long ago about the P-47 Thunderbolt. According to the article, it was thought that it might have been the first plane to break the sound barrier. It was done in a dive from high altitude, but they'll never know for sure as the plane disintegrated while in the dive. Pure speculation, but I've always wondered. Seaplanes and flying boats have always been a big love of mine.
I grew up as a kid in San Francisco during WW-2, and I can remember the Martin Mars taking off from San Francisco Bay. They always took off at night and the roar of the engines was awesome, and our house was about six miles from the takeoff point. PBY's are still a big thrill when I see film of them.
P-38s are cool too. When I was in the Air Force (where else?)My C.O. of the wether detachment I was assigned to was a P-38 pilot during WW-2. Even more interseting is the fact that he was one of the pilots that shot Admiral Yamamoto down. he's not sure if he hit Yamamoto's plane or the escort plane that was with Yamamoto (both Betty's) but he was there. The Zero is another plane I like.
Here's one thing. If you ever get to see a Mig-15 up close and personal, you'll be amazed at how small those things are.
If any of you get to Tucson for anyreason, take the time out to go to the Pima Air and Space Museum. You'll see several hundred aircraft from WW-2 fighter (sorry, no Mustangs, at least they had none the last time I went) to big assed B-52s, the SR-71 Blackbird and even presidential aircraft. Some planes are one of a kind. Well worth seeing. Hell! let me know you're coming and I'll go with you.
Paul B.

I too am a prop plane nut. At the end of the Korean POLICE ACTION I was working on F4Us, F8Fs, and AD4s(later to become A1s). In Korea and later in Nam the Abel Dogs(A1s)were the grunts favorite aircraft. It's my favorite also and next it's predecessor the JUG (P47).

My Marine son still flies prop jobs KC130s. He was active in Desert Storm and the Latest Iraqy war. Now those are old tough planes. I could go on a long time on planes but I won't. roger

Great thread. I am also a admirer of the WW II aircraft and had an addiction to the Discovery/Wings channel. Ref to the note that Paul B had on the B-36--I was raised in San Antonio,TX and remember as a kid the B-36 leaving Kelly AFB and flying over my house at 5,000 feet or less. He is absolutely correct in the distinctive sound those engines made and how the windows rattled and everything in the kitchen that wasn't affixed shook all over the place. Had a school chum whose father was a M/Sgt at Randolph AFB in charge of the parachute rigging/repair and we used to watch the B-29's do touch-and-go's as the runway was right in front of us. Good memories of childhood. My thank you to those who served and those serving now.

Ol' John

"Just an observation on my part, but were all or most of the prop planes powered by Rolls-Royce engines faster than with other powerplants?"
The Hawker Fury/Sea Fury 460 mph Centaurus radial Engine

P51D Mustang 437 mph Packard V1650

F4U Corsair 446mph R2800 (Pratt & Whitney)

P47 Thunderbolt 428mph R2800

F8F Bearcat 423mph R2800

Another thing to consider is for instance ,in the case of p51 compared to p47, the51 was 11000 lbs vs the47s 19400lbs.the F4U was almost 15000lbs. Pratt and Whitney made a good showing when compared to Rolls. Engine horsepower alone didn't determine a planes speed. Case in point when they changed the prop on the P47 there was one heck of an increase in useable torque and top end speed.This is only one of many factors that is significant.

And yes this is a great thread. roger

My bad, I was supposed to type 352nd Fighter Squadron, which was part of the 353rd Fighter Group. There are a few websites about them, the best one I like is :

http://www.netherhall47.freeserve.co.uk/

Ah, here is the info, towards the bottom of the page.

http://www.fleetairarmarchive.net/aircraft/Seafury.html

"Fleet Air Arm Hawker Seafury y F.B. 11 O-114 of 802 squadron (HMS Ocean) flown by Lt P "Hoagy" Carmichael on 9 August 1952 shot down a MiG-15 was the first such kill by a piston-engine fighter, and the only kill by a British pilot flying a British aircraft during the Korean War."

British, not Australian.

"Battle Honours and Operational History


"Fleet Air Arm Hawker Seafury y F.B. 11 O-114 of 802 squadron (HMS Ocean) flown by Lt P "Hoagy" Carmichael on 9 August 1952 shot down a MiG-15 was the first such kill by a piston-engine fighter, and the only kill by a British pilot flying a British aircraft during the Korean War."

So it was a Brit in a Sea Fury. Ain't the internet great?

Day late and a dollar short.

Seafire, one of my friends in TX flew both the P-47 and P-51 in Italy. He liked the P-47 much better! Said you were much more likely to get home alive in the P-47 than the '51!!

thanks to all the guys who responded to this, and added some great memories to share with us. thanks to Mark White and JlHeard especially for those websites. I added all three of them to my favorites bar on my windows explorers.

I am going to have to do a web search for my favorite fighter group, the 56th FG, which was the only unit in the 8th AF that did not convert to P 51s later on. Flew them right up to the end of the war, with the P 47 M model. Not only were T/Bolts able to absorb all sorts of combat damage, they could also dish it out, a lot more than the P 51. We just made some good stuff in those days, I have to admit, I hardly ever met a combat aircraft from WW 2 that I did not LOVE.

I also love the old P 40 and Hurricanes. Believe it our not, the allied air craft that shot down more enemy aircraft than any other was not the Spitfire, or the P 51.. For the British it was the Hurricane, and for the US it was the P40s. They were around early in the war, when a more target rich environment existed with enemy aircraft in the skys. When the Mustangs,and Later Spitfires became available in numbers, the Axis supply of aircraft was already stretched thin,. That is why the Hurricane and the P 40 are the Enemy aircraft destroyed in the air, winners. Crazy huh?

Whoever mentioned the B 58 at Chanute Ill, I have seen that Air Craft on a static display there, but the last time I was there, it was no longer on base. I am sure the AF moved it elsewhere since there are very few of them in existance, very few were even made. I think they only equiped two maybe three specialized bomb wings, but for its day, WHAT AN AIR CRAFT!!!

Cheers to all....
Since this has been popular, maybe Saeed will start a section on this subject also.?

Seafire

Seafire. When I was stationed at Nellis AFB in Nevada, we had a B-58 declare a "Broken Arrow" emergency. It came in and they parked iw way out in the middle of nowhere on the base and covered it up with a tarp. It was about 5:30 AM while I was on duty that that bird took off. Damn thing literally went straight up in the air and broke the sound barrier on the way up. Bloody spectacular.
When they made that movie ENOLA GAY, that B-29 they used was parked right out the front door of the weather station.
I was working the graveyard shift when they fired that bird up. Those thing were load as hell. They were flying the plane to New York state someplace, and then to somewhere in England to be a static display, never to fly again. Somehow, I found that terribly sad.
I grew up as a kid during WW-2 and I remember seeing all those beautiful old warbirds. A couple of years back, the wife and I were working out in the backyard when we heards what sounded like two different planes. I said to my wife, "One of those planes is a Mustang and the other is something with a big radial engine." Finaly we caught sight of the two planes and one was indeed a Mustang and the other a Corsair flying in formation. Made my whole damn day.
Paul B.

I was coming out of work one day and I heard the drone of what sounded like 2 warbirds. I was looking for them when all of a sudden 4 texans in low wedge formation come right over our building. MAN that was a pretty sight. they then banked and climed a bit while they formed a diamond and left heading west. had a smile on my face the rest of the day.

One of the best parts of making the Annual SCI convention in Reno/Vegas would be to run into Chuck Yeager. A few years ago I came armed with all of my Father in Laws info from his time in England with the 8th AF; photos,maps,some copies of flight orders,etc.
Seems that Yeager used several of the same area strips for refuel/rearm from time to time. He really enjoyed the pictures and especially the old orders and maps. Really brought back the memories for him.

There was a brief reference to Karens Dad in a book written by another 8th AF Aviator, dont recall the name right now. It regarded he and his crew flying around Scotland in their B24 on their "Single Malt Search and Destroy" missions after the war had ENDED. They were finally tracked down and basically told to GO HOME.

The old WW2 acft and the brave men (and in some instances LADIES) who flew them are so interesting. Many heroes.

My Dad joined the Marines the day after Pearl Harbor. His initial posting was at the Panama Canal Zone guarding the Canal. They searched ships as they entered the locks,etc. VERY good duty as the Govt basically forgot they were there. Then a year into it someone finally figured out that there was nothing but a few platoons of Marines guarding the Canal and they sent in literally hundreds more to multiply the force. The fun ended then he said and it turned into the USMC again. I recall as a kid seeing many shots of my Dad in his pith helmet, shorts and a 1911 .45 standing by a palm tree, or by the Locks. He was a happy looking skinny kid.

His fun quickly ended when he was sent to Saipan, then later as first wave ashore on Iwo Jima with the 5th Marines. He did a month and a half on Iwo Jima later helping to build some of the quonsett huts around the airfield. He would speak fondly of his Marine Corps duty except when it came to Iwo Jima. He seldom spoke about Iwo Jima other than to comment on the anniversary of the battle that "X" amount of years ago he was there and never thought he would come home again,etc.
I always remember one single photo. Taken by another Marine of my Dad and several others as they were on their way off of Iwo. My Dad no longer looked like the kid I recalled in those earlier photos from Panama. He looked about ten years older.

He was always very proud of his Service time and when we buried him in 1998 a victim to cancer, as per his request we put both his NY Yankees ballcap and his old Marine Corps cover in his coffin.

Semper Fi to all you old Marines out there.

FN in MT