Mr. Bob Hagel died just before Christmas 2005.

Mr. Hagel was one of the Greatest Reloaders and Gun Writers I have ever been fortunate to read. His ability and skill at passing along his first-hand Reloading and Hunting experience through his written word was truly excellent. His Books continue to provide some of my greatest pleasure.

Mr. Hagel's books and articles concerning Reloading, stress the importance of watching for all Pressure Indicators. He was a champion for Case Head Expansion and Pressure Ring Expansion as Methods anyone can use to ensure their Loads will be SAFE.

When you read Mr. Hagels words concerning Elk and Deer hunting, it takes you right there on the hunt with him. Plenty of details to draw a mental picture of what he had seen and done first-hand, and how the reader can accomplish the same.

I could go on and on, but those of you who are familiar with his writing already know how enlightening, exact and entertaining his writing was. For those of you who do not recognize Mr. Hagel's name, though some of the Data in his Books was totally accurate for the time it was written, it is appropriate to understand some of the information is a bit Dated from todays perspective. It is still some of the very best reading you can find anywhere when recognized in that context. And I recommend any of his writings that you can find.

A friend of mine mentioned he had seen a notice about Mr. Hagel's passing on another Board. I rarely go there because I simply do not like some of the people who post there. But, I took a look and as usual, howl took the opportunity to trash Mr. Hagel.

EDIT in a Correction: And I noticed a glancing blow concerning Mr. Hagel from john barsness(posts as mule deer). That was a total mis-reading of John Barsness post on my part and I stand corrected below by Don.

I had considered PMing Savage 99 and Mark Dobrenski for calling howl on his comments, but decided to post here and publicly say, Thank You Don and Mark.
-----

Trashing dead people is the standard mode for howl. He has done it before concerning Mr. P.O. Ackley on Hunt America and when I called him on it there, marshall the site owner, gave me a bit of grief for saying howl is the scum of the earth. So I told marshall what he could do with his Board.

A few months passed and howl made the same personal attack about Mr. Ackley on the Reloading Board right here at AR. Needless to say I once again felt it appropriate to defend the deceased Mr. Ackley and tell howl what a totally worthless scum of the earth he is. I have absolutely no doubt at all howl is driven to trash the dead because he is jealous of their accomplishments and world wide recognition. The only recognition howl deserves is for fooling lots and lots of folks, the PT Barnum of the Firearms Industry.

howl's esteemed doctorate is in Theology, but you would never know it from the way he constantly berates and belittles the Beginners, or anyone who disagrees with him. I can’t imagine a religion that considers howl as one of their own. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with Mathamtics, Physics, Engineering and certainly not Ballistics, as he tries to fool people into believing.

howl's only firearms knowledge comes from other peoples sweat and their first-hand experience, he has contributed nothing to the Firearms Industry that is entirely of his own doing, he has never had an original thought and that includes the line of howl cartridges.

howl does have the distinction of having the "howl C.A.R.E.T. Factor" named in his honor. It stands for howl's ability to Complicate Any Relatively Easy Task. The Term originated when he "tried to describe" how to Anneal a Case on Hunt America many years ago. By the time a Beginner got through trying to understand the fiasco method he outlined, it was obvious they would just not do it at all.

Yes indeed, howl is the scum of the earth.

So, why am I ranting about howl? Simply because he is still showing he is the same totally worthless scum he has always been, I want you all to know it, and I won’t be able to do it after he is gone.

read a lot of bobs stuff in the 80's. i have two of his books
Along with ken waters they made the reloader magazine back then.
his theory on case head expansion was the same as P.O's , and Ken's it was the rule . we didnt have pressure trace and and an engenering staff at our disposal.

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:
But, I took a look and as usual, howl took the opportunity to trash Mr. Hagel.

Gollleee, Hot Core! Sounds like this guy should be on a wanted poster. Wuold it be an understatement to say he got under your skin? on him roger

There were others who spoke up about the unappropriate things said about the great Bob Hagel. I would also like to thank Allen Day, Kutenay and others who did just as much or more. Also I feel that John Barness's statement on Hagel was quite positive to say the least. In fact it was Barsness who turned the tide on that topic and it was Dober, Day, Kute and others who nailed it down.

Ken Howell suffers from a dibilatating stroke and he does not feel well at all. This should be understood reading him. It's not an excuse but it may be the reason why.

I did not belong to HA when Howell did but I do recall Howell trashing others on 24HR including Carmichael and Seyfried.

Don is correct about John Barsness comments, I read them wrong and have gone back to my original post and Edited that out.

Don is also correct that another person should have been given a Thank You - Kutenay.

It is one thing to disagree with someone openly for all to see - when they are alive. Only the absolute scum of the earth - howl - defames the dead.

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:
.... Wuold it be an understatement to say he got under your skin? ...

Hey Roger, Yes "understatement" is an apt description. I was so HOT by the time I got to John Barsness post that I totally misread it and even forgot to Thank Kutenay for calling howl on his scuminess.

Still gets me cranked up to think anyone gets duped into respecting the opinion of people like howl.

It all goes back to when he was Editor at Handloader and he had "me fooled" into thinking he actually knew something concerning firearms and ballistics. Once howl joined HuntAmerica I thought it would sure be wonderful to get some wisdom on more advanced Ballistics issues.

But once I got to see how he talked "down-to" the Beginners and anyone that disagreed with him, I realized I had been fooled into thinking howl was a Man of Character and Knowledge, by a worthless scum of the earth.

I dislike seeing anyone fooled, and especially me!

howl was trashing Mr. Ackley long before he began sniveling and whinning about being sick.

I am new to all this reloading literature so maybe you could fill me in on some of Mr. Hagel's books on reloading. I would love to read some of his stuff.
Thanks
Steve

A lot of folks associate the golden era with African hunting and Mauser, but I think it really was in the post-war era of Ackley, Hagel, Keith, O'Conner, and Ken Waters. Not only did these men bring guns and hunting into our homes, they imparted knowledge. I can't honestly say any of the new crop of writers has influenced me much at all, and at times it seems you aren't bona fied if you don't have a wildcat.

hot core i wish you would just let go and tell us how you really feel.

i too thought that was a real cheap shot on mister howls part. like grandma always said, "if ya can't say something nice don't say anything at all". mr. howl merely belittled himself and slipped down a notch or two on everybodys respect list including my own.

buckshot: those guys you mentioned all had at least one wildcat that they perfected with the exception of mr. o'connor. he was a hunting machine.

quote:

Originally posted by steve4102:
I am new to all this reloading literature so maybe you could fill me in on some of Mr. Hagel's books on reloading. I would love to read some of his stuff.
Thanks
Steve

Hey Steve, I'm at a loss to give you good directions on where to find his writing today. Maybe at some Gun Shows where they have some Book Dealers represented.

Back when I took Rifle and Handloader, they were owned by Wolfe Publishing and they would occasionally provide reprints of Mr. Hagel's books. You could try contacting them.

I don't know if Amazon has anything of his or not, but that would be a place to look too.

By the way, if you want excellent information on Reloading, I can also recommend Mr. Ken Waters.

Latch on to anything you can find by either of those true Experts and you will appreciate their writing.

And I'd include Gary Sitton as an excellent writer that I always enjoyed reading.

Hey Stinger, The more you read from howl, the more you will understand why I feel the way I do.

Why ANYONE would go to him for information is confusing to me. If they prefer to kiss a heiney to get a long drawn out fiasco of an answer, then howl is the place for them to go.

howl is the scum of the earth, as anyone can clearly see for themselves.

quote:

Originally posted by buckshot:
A lot of folks associate the golden era with African hunting and Mauser, but I think it really was in the post-war era of Ackley, Hagel, Keith, O'Conner, and Ken Waters. Not only did these men bring guns and hunting into our homes, they imparted knowledge. I can't honestly say any of the new crop of writers has influenced me much at all, and at times it seems you aren't bona fied if you don't have a wildcat.

Hey Buckshot, Excellent post!

I think anyone who is looking for Bob's books should contact Wolfe Publishing Co. , or check out the Rifle/Handloader website , and they should be able to fix you up . Also back issues of the magazines that contain Bob's articles . When it comes to the nitty gritty , nuts and bolts handloading knowlege , Bob's articles were just superb and contained information I have not seen in any other commonly available mediums .

I loaned out my copy of Game Loads and Practical Ballistics to a neighbor years ago , and the son of a gum never gave it back . So I need to get on a new copy of that must have classic myself.......

quote:

Originally posted by steve4102:
I am new to all this reloading literature so maybe you could fill me in on some of Mr. Hagel's books on reloading. I would love to read some of his stuff.
Thanks
Steve

steve

you can find books by hagel and waters at http://www.abebooks.com. after just a cursory check i found quite a few.

good luck

Bob Hagel was one of the most informed gun writers of the 20th century. I have all of his books and had him personally sign them. Back in the 70's and 80s I had regular calls to Salmon Idaho to Bob Hagel. He always would take time to share his thoughts. He was the real Mcoy. Craig Bodington can't even fill Bob Hagel's shoes. Bob had been in poor health for the last ten years. He will be missed but not forgotten.
May his 7mm Mashburn and his 300 Win Mag go with him to heaven.
Longshot

Hot Core; Why are you doing your bitching here
and not on "Gunwriters". You are notible due to your lack of presence. That is where Ken Howell could reply. A duel between the two of you would be interesting.
Good luck!

hotcore glad to read your post.that is calling a spad apad or in this case a jackass
thanks ed in idaho

quote:

Bob Hagel has died

May he rest in peace.

Hey Ed, We have lost a real Master Reloader, Teacher and exceptional Writer.

quote:

Originally posted by hawkins:
Why are you doing your bitching here
and not on "Gunwriters".

Mr. Hawkins, That is a fair question and I have two answers for you:

1. If you read my first post I included an explaination about why I choose not to post there.
2. To expand on it a bit, I prefer to spend what free time I have with the exceptionally knowledgeable Hunters and Reloaders that frequent this Board. After five decades of Reloading, I find the folks here are often able to share "First Hand Experience" concerning issues that I trust as reliable information and that I can still occasionally learn from. There are a lot of folks who's "opinion" I respect - here.

The people that have been here a long time have the ability to provide aid and assistance to the Beginners and Rookies without posting in a condescending tone. They also feel comfortable trading non-malicious barbs with each other. An atmosphere is created where I look forward to coming to the site and seeing what they have to share.

Occasionally some fool stumbles in and is discovered. Some immediately begin posting in the howl manner with the air of superiority when they really don't have a clue what they are posting about. But, that old dog don't hunt here.

quote:

You are notible due to your lack of presence.

Excellent, just the way I want it.

quote:

That is where Ken Howell could reply. A duel between the two of you would be interesting...

Went through arguing with him many times before and nothing was accomplished.

howl really has nothing to say I'm interested in and the reasons for that are also covered in my first post.

If you are into arguing, howl is just the guy you are looking for. All you have to do is look at any post he makes and disagree with it. It becomes quite a fiasco, especially when "you" are speaking from actual First Hand Experience and howl is simply quoting something he saw someone else say they did.

Best of luck to you. Come to think of it, perhaps howl could help you understand "Headspace".