The combined effort of all the members of the AR family should be invaluable in setting up a sort of loading manual for the 404 Jeffery (other unusual calibers later). Over the last few years, numerous discussions in the reloading and the African hunting forums has produced much good and reliable load data on this caliber. I would like to see a compillation of the experiences other loaders have with this caliber with respect to some of the newer powders as well as the old stand by's, something that could be printed off the computer and added to a ring binder. Any takers?????The combined effort of all the members of the AR family should be invaluable in setting up a sort of loading manual for the 404 Jeffery (other unusual calibers later). Over the last few years, numerous discussions in the reloading and the African hunting forums has produced much good and reliable load data on this caliber. I would like to see a compilation of the experiences other loaders have with this caliber with respect to some of the newer powders as well as the old stand by's, something that could be printed off the computer and added to a ring binder. Any takers?????

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ALF,

"...Now he may claim he sees no pressure signs on his cases, i'm not so sure if that is a valid arguement in determing safety of a load?..."

I presume that the loads in reloading manuals have been pressure tested, otherwise they would not have published them.

If that is the case, I can assure you that we have had rifles here that have object to loads that are well below book maximum.

We have also have also had rifles that will digest several grains more than published data, and we use those loads without any problems whatsoever.

Loading manuals don't seem to agree with each other anyway, and I sure am not going to take what they say as the final words in load development.

We use loading manuals as a reference ONLY, after the first load is chosen, we do our own load development.

In lots of cases we do not even look at loading manuals to start our own load development. We use our own experience with similar size cases, and pick a suitable powder, and take it from there.

At the end of the day, the safety of the load is only determined in the particular rifle it was developed in.

A few days ago I was talking to a friend who had a custom made 300 Winchester rifle. The first ammo he tried in it was made in South Africa - not sure of the name PMP or PMC. He had to hammer the bolt open!

He then tried Federal ammo, and had absolutely no problems at all.

In my own experience, ammo made by Hirtenberger in Austria has ALWAYS been far too hot.

So do we assume both the above mentioned ammo makers are selling ammo that has been tested way above what we consider normal?

As the disclaimer indicates in all reloading manuals. The pressures are only true for the test bed used in the pressure measurements from a single source. The value of such data, statistically, is dubious.
Many rare calibers, 404J, 9,3x64, 6.5x65, etc.------ are not described in the reloading manuals and therefore are left out. Wouldn't it be nice to see some "recipies" for some of these calibers? It could possibly keep someone from getting in trouble with experimentation! All loads would bear the same caution as the other loading manuals. CAUTION Load with care and go slowly.

"...The pressures are only true for the test bed used in the pressure measurements from a single source. The value of such data, statistically, is dubious..."

Precisely!

I would certainly contribute some data. I have fired about 300rds now using (4) bullets & (6) powders. It would be nice though if someone had a pressure/strain guage system to measure pressures.