I've had it! Had this M77 MKII for a year now. I have worked up just about every load possible for this rifle. I'll work up a load, shoot 2 or 3 groups with excellent results. I'll come home, work up a good batch to zero in at the range and what happens you may ask, I'll tell you. It's back to 1 1/2" groups! Everything is tight, all my loads are very carefully made, I bought a Hogue stock with pillar bedding, good Bushnell 3x9 scope. One time I'll get groups in the .6 to .8 range and the next time wamo! I do know the fundamentals of shooting so I know it can't be all my fault. I tell you, I have a H&R .22 Hornet that I load for and I consistantly get 1" or less with it. I'm going to sell the Ruger that I have over $600 invested in and get me another H&R in .223. For less than $200 how can I go wrong. Thanks for letting me rant.

I would try another scope on it before you give up on it.

Hornet, I'm thinking your current Ruger is a 223? The Remington VS I've got did the same thing, nice group and like you said, wham over an inch, then I worked more on loading and started shooting at 200yds. and shooting 10 shot groups, the groups were 1.25"-1.50", and I thought, hey, thats 3/4moa or better for 10 shots, whats wrong with that, now I won't have to throw it in the junk pile. Jay

What do you mean by excellent results,do you NS,P-FLR or FL. Bushnell scope?Is the rifle is able sometimes to shoot two shots in the same hole?(2 out 3 shots)...

quote:

Originally posted by .22 HORNET:
I've had it! Had this M77 MKII for a year now. I have worked up just about every load possible for this rifle. I'll work up a load, shoot 2 or 3 groups with excellent results. I'll come home, work up a good batch to zero in at the range and what happens you may ask, I'll tell you. It's back to 1 1/2" groups! Everything is tight, all my loads are very carefully made, I bought a Hogue stock with pillar bedding, good Bushnell 3x9 scope. One time I'll get groups in the .6 to .8 range and the next time wamo! I do know the fundamentals of shooting so I know it can't be all my fault. I tell you, I have a H&R .22 Hornet that I load for and I consistantly get 1" or less with it. I'm going to sell the Ruger that I have over $600 invested in and get me another H&R in .223. For less than $200 how can I go wrong. Thanks for letting me rant.

Some folks have delightful groups with their Rugers. As for me....well, the only Rugers in this house are a couple SAA revolvers.

I had two M77s in a row "whizz me off" and then the infamous #1 that wouldn'y hit a bull in the ass from inside the barn. Finally after the third time returning it to Ruger and I demanded to know what the accuracy level was that they controlled to and was told that their standard was 1 1/2" groups at 50 yards.

What????? A heavy barrel varmint model #1 is guaranteed to shoot 1 1/2" at 50 yards? Yes was the reply from their service desk.

And that's why there's no Ruger long guns here!!!!!

I have had bad luck with Rugers as well. It has been hit or miss with me. Mostly miss.

Telly

Strange isn't it. I've used Ruger's for years and had nothing but excellent results from them. Yes, I have had them tweeked by a gunsmith, one who knows and likes Rugers. My gun safe has a couple of No. 1's, both sub-MOA and yes they occationally put 2 or even 3 bullets into the same hole. I've got a couple of old tang safety M77's that will do MOA or so with the right bullets. The only Rugers that have given me a fit were a 22 Hornet in a N0. 3 action, bad barrel, and a 22 mag, not the most accurate rim-fire to start with.

Over the years I've owned and shot many Ruger's in my personal "gun-of-the-year" program. (I just get a caliber I've never worked with, develop a load, maybe shoot a doe with it, sell it and get a new rifle of different caliber or action just for the hell of it.) I've also owned Remington's, Marlin's, Savage's, Mossberg's (yes they made, or rather marketed rifles), Brownings and Winchester's. The only rifles I could honestly say were complete piece of shit's (POS) were a couple of Winchesters that simply would not shoot straight for any reason.

The Ruger integeral mounts are a likely problem in my experience. Ruger mounts are a good idea, but you'd better be sure they are locked in correctly. It's suprising how easy it is to not get them on square and tight.Try putting teach mount one individually, not attached to the scope. Tighten them down slowly and gently, wiggle the mount with each tightening motion. You might find that the scope will not sit square in the mounts because the mounts are not aligned! If this is the case take the rifle to a gunsmith and have the mounts lapped in true. Might work, it turned a couple of #@!!%^&*#@!!! rifles into sub-MOA barn burners for me.

quote:

Originally posted by .22 HORNET:
I've had it! Had this M77 MKII for a year now. I have worked up just about every load possible for this rifle. I'll work up a load, shoot 2 or 3 groups with excellent results. I'll come home, work up a good batch to zero in at the range and what happens you may ask, I'll tell you. It's back to 1 1/2" groups! Everything is tight, all my loads are very carefully made, I bought a Hogue stock with pillar bedding, good Bushnell 3x9 scope. One time I'll get groups in the .6 to .8 range and the next time wamo! I do know the fundamentals of shooting so I know it can't be all my fault. I tell you, I have a H&R .22 Hornet that I load for and I consistantly get 1" or less with it. I'm going to sell the Ruger that I have over $600 invested in and get me another H&R in .223. For less than $200 how can I go wrong. Thanks for letting me rant.

This is the second scope I've had on it. I know I'm not buying top of the line but a $150 scope (twice) shouldn't be the culprit I wouldn't think. Buy the way, I only neck size my brass. I have a FL die but just never felt I needed to use it. Last week I shot a .658 and a .718 group consecutively with the following load:

25.6gr Benchmark
55 v-max
Rem brass
BR-4 primers
COL = 2.280

I've tried all load ranges, COL's, primers brass etc. One hour I will be so impressed and happy and then I'm ready to trade it for another H&R. Which by the way, I'm serious. Tomorrow it's going to the gun shop to get a new home.

If it's got open sights on try that before trying a different scope.

My 77 SS is sensitive to the cleanliness of the barrel, after say 25 rounds it does not shoot as good as before..300WM is the caliber

I gave up on Ruger rifles a few years ago. Had several and never was pleased with the groups after much work. I had one in 257 improved that always shot a foot high from one trip to the range to the next. Never could figure it out. Intersting note. I and a friend were at the NRA Annual meetings in 2000 at Charlotte, NC and we ended up at a party talking with John Wooters. My friend was talking to him about a Ruger 280AI he had put together and was complaining about erratic groups. When Wooters got a chance to comment all he said was, "Typical Ruger". BTW, my friends rifle wore a Lothar Walther barrel, was put together "right", sythetic stock, bedded, meticulous handloads etc. Whats the problem. My suspicion is it has something to do with the angled front action screw. Just my 0.02
Doug

When you get loads to work real well in a rifle and then they are off and then they are on is usually not the fault of the rifle. I am not taking up for any brand rifle. I have found the same trouble with Remington also but after checking all the mounts etc, I found out it was something I was doing in my reloading. One bull barreled Remington .233 would do just what you are talking about until I removed the front bipod and it begin driving tacks. I hear a lot of "not accrute" from Ruger and as I only own one, A M77 Mark 2 .260, I wouldn't know. Also I had one Remington .233 that loved military rounds. I shot some sorry rounds in every other rounds. Then I duplicated the military round using W-748 powder and it came around. Don't do like the man last week did. He bought a new Savage in WSM 300 and couldn't hit the side of a barn with it. He sold the same day for about 1/2 what he paid for it. The person who bought it cut back on the powder load and nailed the bulls eye every time at 100 yards. As a reloader you will find some rifles will not shot well but 9 times out of ten it usually is something you are doing. I had one remington that no matter what I did it wasn't accruate until I changed primers and used Remington brass. Stay calm and start over after inspecting all mounts, etc.

You can keep the scope and the stock, wadda ya want for the Ruger?

My Ruger 30/06 is on the way out as well, the whole Ruger thing just does not work for me, there best guns seem to bet the #1's and the big safari rifles.

I am going to trade on a heavy barrelled cz .308 as I have heard they shoot great........................or a m70 stainless .375 H&H have not quite made my mind up yet

Like Steve said, "you can keep all the pretty extras" how much do you want for the Rugers? I am not especially a Ruger fan, but believe I could get them accrute enough. How much for those Rugers boys?

Hey PC how accrute do you want a rifle to be? We just got through shooting an old Remington 742 .308 and it filled a tuna fish can at 300 yards with 150 grain Remington bronze pionts. You don't need to buy some outragious rifle with an outragious price to get one that is accruate. Through a lot of patience and good solid work I have my old 1940 Jap long barreled rifle shooting .375 groups with 44 grains of IMR-4064. What do you want for your no good Ruger? I mean it can't be worth much if you say it is no good.

quote:

Originally posted by ricciardelli:
You can keep the scope and the stock, wadda ya want for the Ruger?

If you want the factory original stock, I will take $300 or trade for a good scoped H&R

quote:

Originally posted by .22 HORNET:

quote:

Originally posted by ricciardelli:
You can keep the scope and the stock, wadda ya want for the Ruger?

If you want the factory original stock, I will take $300 or trade for a good scoped H&R

I can email pic's if anyone wants to see the rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by .22 HORNET:

quote:

Originally posted by ricciardelli:
You can keep the scope and the stock, wadda ya want for the Ruger?

If you want the factory original stock, I will take $300 or trade for a good scoped H&R

You are asking too much...I buy ANIB for around $175 to $195. (Just bought 4 of them, all 1968 to 1972 77's, and 1 bicentennial ANIB.)

Blob 1,

I will get around $650AUS for it............it has been a serviceable rig, but I no would rather hunt with my cz 9.3 or marlin 45/70 for all round rigs. I have been using my Ruger 30/06 for shooting from the ute window while spotlighting, now the light barrel and boat paddle stock has meant that after a couple of shots when she warms up accuracy goes from acceptable to un-acceptable, as I may shoot 50-100 rounds on a busy night. I feel I will get better consistency from a cz 550 Varmint in .308 with similar knockdown power to my 30/06.

I also love the set trigger of the cz 550 rifles. I intend my .30 cal spotlighting load to consist of 125 gr ballistic tips or maybe the speer 130 gr HP's which apparently are explosive on varmints.

Recheck you mounts ,replace the scope and bed it.If that dont do it rebarrel it.
or just pass it on to some one else.
some times you get a rifle that wont shoot
accurately and are not worth the money to trouble shoot them unless ths stock is outstanding.And that is not a common occurance in a factory rife.

I have owned 20 or so rugers over the last 30yrs
and have not had a bad one I have a M77r
in 6MM Rem that I had to bed & put a little pressure on the bbl at the end of forearm to make it consistant hot or cold

Hornet, Can you tell us the load you're using?.6-1.5" isn't really that bad for a Ruger, I know Remington accuracy standard is 1.5" for a Varmint rifle. Jay

quote:

Originally posted by tsturm:
I have owned 20 or so rugers over the last 30yrs
and have not had a bad one I have a M77r
in 6MM Rem that I had to bed & put a little pressure on the bbl at the end of forearm to make it consistant hot or cold

Please tell me more about the "pressure" on the end of the barrel.

Some barrels, usually skinny ones, shoot best with a little pressure towards the end of the forend of the stock, not the barrel. Heavy barrel rifles like to be free-floated, usually. Jay

Dump the barrel - get a medium-heavy, first rate after market barrel (e.g., Krieger, Shillen, Hart). You'll be happy. Factory barrels usually SUCK on all makes of guns.

Before you give up on any rifle take it to a gunsmith that actually has some experience with that maker and doesn't say, "Oh yeah, X"s are crap." Little things can make a big difference.

Regards the angled front screw on the Ruger: This could also be a singificant problem if the stock has warped. This will cause the front to never quite tighten down, no matter how much your romp on it. I had a Ruger walnut stock that got very wet and warped. I took the action out to dry things out and when I put it back the previously very accurate rifle "suddenly" shot like hell. I had the area reamed out, along with the barrel channel and glass bedded and "suddenly" it shot like a dream again.

I would suggest that this could be a problem with any wood stocked rifle of any manufacture, not just Rugers. It is also possible that the stock could warp because of changes in humidity, lack of aging of the stock wood, etc. Fiberglass and "plastic" stocks are not without problems, I just don't have any personal experience with them since I stay away form them for aesthic reasons.

Some fellows say, "I paid good money for this why should I have to tinker with it!" Good point, but if you lay out under $750 for a rifle these days it's going to be mass produced and there will be problems, on occation. Now, if you were talking about a $6000 Dakota, well I'd be pissed as hell if it didn't shoot right out of the box.

Regarding getting Ruger stocks wet, DON"T! Oh, they put a nice heavy finish on the outside, but Ruger does the most PISS POOR job of sealing the interior portions of their stocks. Whenever I buy a Ruger rifle, be it a #1 of Model 77, the first thing I do it remove the stock and give it a proper sealing job with several coats of varathane. I have seen at least two of those rifles that had no sealing at all. be sure to get under that rubber butt pad as well. JMHO.
Paul B.

You guys seem to have forgotton.
"I bought a Hogue stock with pillar bedding, good Bushnell 3x9 scope."[/QUOTE]

Thanks Jay, I was just about to say that.

My last say on this subject. Most of the time if a person doesn't like a rifle no matter the reason, he won't ever like it! Chunk it for something else if you don't want to spend some time working on it!

I have 3 of the them in my safe, ranging from an early tang safety .250 Savage, to two faily recent MKII, one .22-250 the other .257 Roberts. All have been tinkered with as I'm an incurable "fiddler", but all are well under MOA with several loads. I have most brands represented in my "battery", and Rugers are becomming my favorite.

Synthetic stocks can have there own problems. I worked on a friends Ruger with one of their "plastic" stocks and found that the fron screw hole did not line up properly and so put some twist on the action. After that was corrected I found that the action did not lay flush in the stock after the front screw was tightened up. (There was a tinny gap between the rear of the action and the stock at that point.) I glass bedded the action and guess what, the rifle shot fine.

I have no experience with Hogue stocks but this might still be a factor with the accuracy problem. Does the front screw hole line up perfectly? ( With a padded clamp place the action into the stock, tighten it down and if the front screw won't go in cleanly, you've got a problem.) Next check the rear line up. (Tighten the front screw down fully and see if the action beds firmly in the rear, if not then the action will be under tension when you tighten the rear screw.) If this is the problem then glass bed the action.

Still have problems? Well, it could be that the rifle is a POS, it happens in EVERY make of rifle, so lighten up PC. I've had good luck with Rugers over the years, good luck with Marlins, great luck with CZ but only so-so with Remingtons and you couldn't give me a Winchester of any vintage, but that's JUST my experience. I know that there are shooters out there that justifiably love their Winchesters or Remingtons or whatever and frankly I believe them, wish them well and wish that my experience with those brands had been possitive also.

I'll repeat my comment. It's not all those other things mentioned - it's your barrel. Get rid of it and get a decent, stiff barrel! Trust me, I've been there with this problem a million times. Dump the factory barrel - get a medium-heavy, first rate after market barrel (e.g., Krieger, Shillen, Hart). You'll be happy. Factory barrels usually SUCK on all makes of guns.