This holiday weekend, taking 500 new Win. .223 brass through my prep. system....comments invited from BR, accuracy shooters. All for M700 Lilja barrel,
*NK size
*1.750" case trim
*inside/out mouth debur
*flash hole debur
*tiny 1mm throat cut into case mouth with .224 Forster reamer (for FB bullets)
*neck turn (using Sinclair tool for first time)
*weight segregate into 0.5gr +/- lots
What do you think?? I have lots of time r in s.

ray

Looks like you got it covered.

I'm not sure you really have to segregate into .5 gr lots. That's only 1/2 of 1% variation. But, if you have the time, go for it. You may end up with more lots than are manageable.

I shoot BR and have to say that i've never heard of the 1mm throat cut. What does it do?

Finally, after all your work you probably won't find a whole lot of improvement in accuracy unless you have a match grade barrel with a match grade chamber and reload with match grade tools.

Have fun.

Ray

Dean Grennel was a beloved gun writer and wrote many articles on all aspects of firearms sports. I ream that tiny cut into mouth so that solid base bullets have a firm 'perch' before they are pushed downward. Of course for boattail bullets, not necessary but do it anyway. Rifle has a 5.56 NATO chamber, 1:14T, stamped up to 52gr. bullets, so 'smith really knew his stuff. I have short supply of Lapua and since that is $39/100, thought I would try everything I know of for a consistent cartridge case I bought for $10/100. r in s.

quote:

Finally, after all your work you probably won't find a whole lot of improvement in accuracy unless you have a match grade barrel with a match grade chamber and reload with match grade tools. unless you're already shooting real 1/2" ten shot groups.

I modified the comment somewhat but agree with the original as well.

I've never found these things to be important to do unless one is a serious "groupie"....even varmint rifles don't get much of an assistance from the typical case prep procedures.

If your gun isn't shooting honest 1/2" groups, then these activities don't generate much of a return on investment and if you're already at 1/2" and you need better, you should have bought a BR rifle day-1!.....

For varmint rifles we quickly reach diminishing returns after about 1/2" groups and hunting rifles start diminishing in value at 1" groups.

When these milestones are reached our best investment is in practice..trigger time...range estimation, and gaining shooting skills.

Good job r in s!

I would uniform the primer pockets and anneal the case necks after fireforming to your chamber. Then neck size only with a bushing neck die only about 1/2 the neck length.

About all I would do is weigh all the brass out of curiosity since i have never used any Lapua.

Then key the data into Excel and graph it.
Look at the distribution of the data.
Sort the high and low outliers out if they amount to much and use them for load development. The rest would be my shooting brass. I would not invest the time in what you are doing until I understand how good the brass is.

Ray,

I have a couple thousand rounds here all boxed up to ship to you to get that treatment... just need an address to ship it to...

Bet that brass is feeling like a new Cadillac now!!!

quote:

Originally posted by ray in seattle:
*inside/out mouth debur
*tiny 1mm throat cut into case mouth with .224 Forster reamer (for FB bullets)

Seat a FB Bullet and then Pull it. Look to see if there is any obvious signs of a portion of the Jacket being "pushed-off" on the Base during Seating. And look for scratches along the length that was inside the Neck.

If you don't see a problem, you are good to go. If you do see something that might affect the Flight, Polish the Inside of the Case Necks. You simply wrap a small wad of "0000 Steel Wool" around a worn out 22 Bore Brush, stick the Brush in a Handle(non-power) and give it a couple of twists in the Neck.

Then try Seating another Bullet, Yank it out and see if you can see any difference between them. If you can't, just forget Polishing. If you can, add it to the process.

quote:

*weight segregate into 0.5gr +/- lots ...

With 500 Winchester Cases, you should be able to lower the 0.5gr segregation. But it really depends on how many you want in each Lot.

I've always done what "ireload2" mentioned about doing a Pareto Analysis on the Lot, but I've done it manually. I can see where it would be a REAL ADVANTAGE to use Excel though. Plus you can print out a few sheets of the results and cut the cases into any size groups you desire.

Oh yes, you do not need exactly 20, 50, or 100 in a Lot. Occasionally a case will be lost to something else and you do not end up with that exact same amount anyhow.
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When you do get to shoot the cases, if you have an Un-explainable Flier, mark that case. If it does it a second time, remove it from the Lot.
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If we ever get to shoot together, leave these Cases at home.

Depending on the size (capacity) of the cartridge, I usually do not trim until after I have fired the cases once (fireformed them to the chamber). That's because it seems to me that some large cases vary considerably in length after fire-forming.

I do, however, measure them all with a "C" gauge before loading them for fireforming, just to make sure none are starting off too long for my chamber(s).

Very good suggestions everyone, thank you. Looking into the annealing mention, over at 6BR.com, a gold mine of information, but looking at the strict temp. requirements, I believe I may not do that. Will check on that base etching soon. Nearly finished turning, next step to segregate into lots, load and test fire.......r in s.

quote:

Originally posted by ray in seattle:
...looking at the strict temp. requirements, ...

Hey Ray, There seems to be a group of folks who try to make Annealing much harder than it is. In fact, the old fool "howl" was awarded the howl CARET Factor(Complicating Any Relatively Easy Task) for a bunch of totally wasted time and effort he recommended.

Just use the "Find" feature above and wham in Anneal or Annealing. It really isn't complicated or hard to do at all.

Best of luck to you.

Oh I did Hot Core.........maybe I'll check into that, BTW I did not know DaMan was a shooter.......life is sweet! r in s.

I understand a lot of people do not believe you get much with case prep…

I perform the same regiment, + Primer pocket Uniforming, for my 30-06 (700BDL) and 338 WM (MGA) and did see positive results in both Rifles.
The last thing I added was the neck turning and I do admit I saw no difference there.

In addition I weigh every Charge & weigh and sort the bullets which in my mind also helps…

I am the first to admit that my approach was unscientific so it may all be in my head…

There is one advantage with all the weighing and sorting… when I weigh the completed round I know the weigh range +/- .4 Gr…

It may just be I have more time to load than to shoot.

quote:

Originally posted by ray in seattle:
...BTW I did not know DaMan was a shooter...

Just a talking down-to the Beginners preacher. Or at least that's what his doctorate is in - preaching.

By the way, If you burn your fingers, you are holding onto the Case Head just a bit too long.

500 rds. into Match brass report........OK, Labor Day's over & so is my case prep. Weight distributions: 20%--91gr, 60%--92gr, 20%--93+gr. First (5) today into a .328 MOA @ 100 yd. very nice to see. As I segregate weights, cases remain in that marked box. Noticed all my turned case necks, nice and clean after firing (perfect seal?) whereas non-turned case necks, same load were somewhat smokey, even Lapua. Need to read more about annealing before I try it.....r in s.

ray,

Annealing a case neck is very important for releiving stress incurred from working the neck opening and re-sizing. I anneal after every third firing.

My procedure:

1) Use a small propane torch kit.

2) Have a small bucket of tap water next to the torch.

3) I hold the case in my hand and rotate evenly in the flame until a cherry red. At about this time you will feel the case head heating up.

4) Drop in the water bucket.

5) Either air dry or put in the oven at under 200F for an hour or so. You do not want to anneal the case body. Just the case neck.