Has anyone ever had the Point of Impact change after attaching a Harris bipod? I was dialed in at 100 yds but after attaching a Harris bipod and shooting from the prone position my POI dropped 1 1/2 inches straight down. Same tight group but straight down....any suggestions?

Your barrel is either not floated, or your forearm not stiff enough. Yes, that does happen. (Injection Molded) synthetic stocks are often good candidates for this.

Exactly where your POI will move is probably anybody's guess, although straight down might seem a bit surprising...

- mike

mho,
You are correct on both accounts. The barrel is not floated (a pressure point at the end of the forearm) and it is a factory synthetic stock. The rifle in question is a Remington 700SPS-synthetic stock/stainless steel barrel. Are there any remedies or is it better to learn the quirks and adjust? Thanks

I would recommend free floating the barrel AND stiffening the forend...I bed a piece of 1/4-5/16 allthread in those wiggly synthetic stocks. I've even milled pieces of alum/steel to fill the full channel space.

It helps some but the twisting/bending usually starts just in front of the magazine cutout and the only way to cure that entails making an outside structural piece and epoxying the stock into that...a lot of work but intersting...those experiments always get a lot of strange looks, questions and comments at the range ...the easiest is just to buy a nice wood semi-finished stock or one of the Kevlar offering.

The problem becomes compounded if you have to take off the Harris for any reason and haven't free floated...your POI will change and not always consistently.

The same thing can happen if you first sight in on a bench using something soft under the forend then in hunting situations, have the forend sitting or touching on something hard.

I've seen POI changes between standing with head/neck/back straight looking through the center of my glasses and sighting in on the bench, slightly scrunched up and sprawled all over the place and looking through the tops of my anteojos.

An alternative I've done on many occasions is to install the stiffener rod AND full bed the barrel in steel/alum epoxy...seems to work best on #1 contour barrels I've built for walkabout.

Consider the fact that the barrel vibrates like a guitar string everytime it is fired, no matter what the size, contour, fluted or not, and the bullet exits the muzzle at a different vibration point every time unless everything is tuned to perfection, having ANY part of the barrel touching the barrel channel will cause a POI change.

The best and easiest way to stop that is to freefloat and make sure there is PLENTY of clearance between the barrel and the forend depending on the caliber size and amount of recoil flexing that happens with those plastic POS's. Usually the first thing I do to ANY rifle stock...and the first step if I want to full bed anyway.

I have upwards of 1/4" clearance on most of my varminters and many of my hunters, plus slots cut in the sides and bottom channels on some...for cooling more than anything.

I usually don't keep a plastic synthetic stock around for any length of time unless it is VERY stiff to begin with, has a blind magazine AND a nice fat, wide forend.

Luck

The guys are correct. I can go back & forth form HBP to bench w/ my M700 & have no shift of POI out to 300yds (furhtest I have tested). The bbl is heavy varmint & generously free floated.

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:
The best and easiest way to stop that is to freefloat and make sure there is PLENTY of clearance between the barrel and the forend depending on the caliber size and amount of recoil flexing that happens with those plastic POS's. Usually the first thing I do to ANY rifle stock...and the first step if I want to full bed anyway.

I have upwards of 1/4" clearance on most of my varminters and many of my hunters, plus slots cut in the sides and bottom channels on some...for cooling more than anything.

Yup!

Or get a McMillan.

- mike

It is an accident if you can get any rifle to shoot to the same point of impact with and without a bipod that physically attaches to its forearm, particularly one which attaches to a sling stud. Sling studs weren't made for that purpose, you know.

Other than playing like you are G. I. Joe, what purpose do you find in wagging such a contraption around like some metallic cancer growing from your rifle's otherwise pristine stock?

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
Other than playing like you are G. I. Joe, what purpose do you find in wagging such a contraption around like some metallic cancer growing from your rifle's otherwise pristine stock?

I can't speak for Craig, but in my experience the short bipod is SOP on any rifle that is packed around in a pickup in Montana.

Without it you will at least put big scratches in the hood of your pickup. The rubber feet not only protect the paint, but the height gets it up off the hood so there is little chance of shooting through the other fender on a close shot.

Jim

As usual...most contraptions have limited usefulness, one mans garbage is another mans gold and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Once a rifle is setup correctly I've never had any trouble keeping zero with or without bipods mounted to the sling stud or on a separate mount or even using wide 3"-5" wide home made "sleds" attached to the forend sling stud to fit my various rifle forends and "elevation devices" either on a p/u hood, bench or other support.

You can get bounce off a p/u hood metal and the wind will play hobb with the cross hairs and your buddies will mess with you especially if there is a Nasau on the outcome of the days shooting...just like in pool, golf, bowling, target shooting, fast cars or women...or any thing else for that matter.

Having problems with bullet flip???? You might take a tip from spring type air gun shooters, the kind that have a double shuffle recoil and use a soft foam block, the type used in mattresses and re-learn your trigger, grip and recoil control.

McMillans are definitely nice stocks, but I'm way to cheap to buy one. A $50 semi-inletted piece of nice Walnut from one of the suppliers or a laminate suffices for me.

Besides I have the enjoyment of shaping, inletting and final finish...all except doing those little diamond pointy things...my hands are cloven hooves when it comes to checkering.

Hey...what's wrong with playing at or BEING G.I. Joe??????

Besides....There ain't NUTT'N' pristine in this world!!!! Hahahahahahahh

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
It is an accident if you can get any rifle to shoot to the same point of impact with and without a bipod that physically attaches to its forearm, particularly one which attaches to a sling stud. Sling studs weren't made for that purpose, you know.

Other than playing like you are G. I. Joe, what purpose do you find in wagging such a contraption around like some metallic cancer growing from your rifle's otherwise pristine stock?

My POI did not change on my 2 guns that have them.

Stonecreek I guess if you just hunt from one of them boxs you don't need one.

The long one are worth there weight on a Antelope MD hunt.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
It is an accident if you can get any rifle to shoot to the same point of impact with and without a bipod that physically attaches to its forearm, particularly one which attaches to a sling stud. Sling studs weren't made for that purpose, you know.

Other than playing like you are G. I. Joe, what purpose do you find in wagging such a contraption around like some metallic cancer growing from your rifle's otherwise pristine stock?

Great topic as I have had experience with this as of yesterday's Precision Rifle Match. One of the stages is a "know your limits" where you shoot progressively smaller and smaller targets stopping when you feel your luck may run out!

Usually we all have bipods attached and shoot everything off of them. The match director had us shoot the stage without the bipod, prone, simply taking a rest off of your backpack.

My POI was 1.5" low at 100 yards as compared to using the bipod.

I assume you are using glass (scope). What caliber are you shooting. Off your "pack rest" are you using a fore end hold that is different than your bipod hold. (I tend to let her go on anything 30-06 and below off my bipod and use my non trigger hand to squeeze the bag.) I KNOW I get rise out of this technique (or lack of it). I assume your scope is paralex adjusted for the 100 yards. In the prone, I have a different "mount" than from the bench.
Do you shift POI's WITH the bipod when you go from the bench to the prone? rc

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
It is an accident if you can get any rifle to shoot to the same point of impact with and without a bipod that physically attaches to its forearm, particularly one which attaches to a sling stud.

I'm not sure. True, I have little experience with bipods and currently only one in use, mounted on my AICS Rem 700 in .308 Win. POI doesn't vary whether I shoot from bipod or rest.

Although I appreciate everyones comments, whether to have the bipod or not was not the question posted. Thanks anyway....I guess.

Depends on the rifle some change pt of impact some do not. I set all my rifles for bipod use.

The ones that don't shoot well off a bipod get rebedded until they do.

After a proper bedding job they shoot well with or with out a bipod.

First off, you need to learn how to shoot with a bipod. Your field position should be good enough that you are merely resting the forearm on the bipod. It's a added support to what should be a fundamentally sound field position.
If you're leaning into the bipod or twisting it around, of course, it's gonna put uncommon stress on your forearm and if your forearm isn't stout enough, it's gonna cause unusual pressures on your barrel. I've shot rifles with bipods attached for a lot of years -with pressure points I might add-- without a change in my POI.
Simply stated, if your POI is changing by adding a bipod to the front of your rifle, you're doing something wrong.
Take your rifle to the range with the bipod attached. Shoot it acrost sandbags with the bipod merely attached, not resting on anything and see if your POI changes.
FWIW, The only rifle I've ever shot with a plastic stock and a bipod is a 700SV with the composition stock that is stout enough to drive post with.

quote:

Originally posted by craigcampbell:
...whether to have the bipod or not was not the question posted. ...

I was just making that same observation.

As long as your rifle is shooting well with the Bi-Pod and since you intend to use the Bi-Pod - leave the Bedding and the Stock alone. Just sight-in using the Bi-Pod and go enjoy your Hunting, after practicing various positions with the Bi-Pod in place.

Also agree with "mho's" initial post that the Point-of-Impact might have gone anywhere. But as long as it is consistent, it dosen't make a jeffee.