I have never reloaded. I've been reading quite a bit (books and forums) over the last year to get some idea of what I'm getting into before I do it.

I love my 358 rifles, and want to start reloading for them. My question is about reduced loads and the powders used to achieve it.

I did find this recipe for a 358 reduced load: .358 Winchester - 200 grain Win. ST bullet, 29.5 grains SR 4759 powder, WLR primer, Winchester case. COL 2.765". MV 2170 fps in 25" test barrel. MAP 52,000 CUP. (Based on the IMR Smokeless Powder Reloader's Guide, April 2004

As I understand it, that 4759 powder burns slower and IMR states that powder works great for reduced loads. But I see the pressure numbers from that slower powder are up quite a bit.

Other places have mentioned using a smaller amount of fast burning powder for making reduced loads, or something like this (for 358Win): 20 grains of 2400 under this 290 grainer will break 1500 fps for near 1500 ft. lbs of muzzle punch. Yet it is an easy load with around 10 lbs of recoil. 10 grns of Unique will go around 1250 fps and near 1000 lbs of energy, again a fine training load or just for woods loafing, yet it can easily knock over a deer or black bear...

How does the burn rate of powder effect the felt recoil and muzzle noise amount?

If using slower burning powders, and you have your bullet almost up a the lands, are you risking too much pressure?

Do you use smaller amounts of fast powder for reduced loads, or just use a slower powder? I'm confused on what to do with that.

Thanks for the help- learning this stuff is really interesting to me

Welcome to the Forums. As far as loading for reduced loads, I can only counsel you to be careful. I have never loaded one because I read 20-plus years ago when I started into it that reduced loads can be dangerous. I'm a member over at www.ammoguide.com-- a website so loaded with juicy info about reloading, you'll wonder how you got along without it. It's just $18 a year. I'm on my second scrip, it's so good. The site has 20,000-some loads for 750-some cartridges. I'm sure you can find a reduced load for your .358s over there. I can't give you the info for liability reasons. Just check it out-- it's a great site. There is a ballistic calculator that plots the arc of fight, provides data at the intervals you want; a ballistic comparator that can set up to eight rounds side-by-side, a visual comparator for up to eight rounds and a tool to see if you can rechamber your gun to another cartridge. Lots of other neat stuff, too. One I really like is a "filter" that will give you all the loads for a particular powder or bullet-- whichever you want. I always plug the site if I get the opportunity. I am not homebrewer over there, so I get nothing for recommending the site...

Black Frog: I would consider loads made with SR 4759. For .358 winchester Lyman 49 lists lists 17.5 grains with a 195 gr cast bullet running at velocity of 1536.

In my old Speer 9 there are SR 4759 reduced loads for every caliber in the manual. 358 Winchester wasn't in Speer 9. Remington 350 Mag and Norma 358 Mag with SR 4759 loads, but, not 358 Win.

358 Win is in Speer 10, but, Speer stopped publishing the SR 4759 loads in Speer 10 due to lack of interest.

I shoot SR 4759 in all my 30's and in my 45-70 if I want easy shooting. It's accurate, cheap, and easy.

Just my 2 cents ... thanks rc

SR4759 burns faster than the powders normally used in the .358 for full power loads.

So the answer is for reduced loads you use less of a faster burning powder. SR4759 was designed for reduced loads and is much more bulky than most powders. Because of this it takes up more space per grain than most powders. When used for reduced loads it fills the case better.

When you use a reduced load you get lower velocities, less recoil and muzzle blast.

You can check out the relative burn rates here with this chart.
The burn rate chart is only part of the story with reduced loads. The bulkiness of the powder is also significant.
Relative burn rates

358 Win.- "How does the burn rate of powder effect the felt recoil and muzzle noise amount?" The same muzzle energy will give the same recoil & noise. Less powder, less energy.

"If using slower burning powders, and you have your bullet almost up a the lands, are you risking too much pressure?" Bullets seated into the land will raise pressure. Close dont count.

"Do you use smaller amounts of fast powder for reduced loads, or just use a slower powder? I'm confused on what to do with that." Yes,you use smaller amounts of fast powder for reduced loads. Smokeless powder needs to make pressure to burn correctly.If you take a listed load using slow powder and cut the weight of the powder charge in half, the powder would not burn correctly and the low pressure may not push the bullet out of the barrel. The reduced load you have posted, 2400 & Unique are for cast lead bullets.These type of loads are listed in Lymans cast bullet manual. For jacketed bullets use loading data that is published online at Hodgdons website. Hodgdons list a starting load. They also have some reduced loads for other calibers, but none for the 358. The 4759 powder burns FASTER. The 52,000 CUP is NOT a reduced load. Hodgdon site Always use published data from a good source like Hodgdon's website.

Here is Hodgdons reduced load data. Its a PDF file type. No 358, but you can get an idea if you compare it with there other data. Hodgdon Reduced Loads Powder burn rate chart. 1. is the FASTEST powder. 117 is the SLOWEST powder. Burn Rate Chart

i wouldn't pay too much attention to powder burn rate charts... they are all over the map...

case in point.... look at all the locations of W 748 on those charts.. it migrates all over the place..

As far as the SR 4759 loads mentioned.. less powder gives less recoil...

SR 4759 is a fast powder, not a slow powder..

one really has to pay attention to what he is doing, because mistakes.. particular double charges can take place..

reduced loads, means reduced velocity.. not necessarily reduced pressure...especially if you are using the max load for that powder..
but like on SR 4759, you can load substantially less powder and still have a workable load..

SKIP HODGEDON'S REDUCED LOADS WITH H 4895..you will find their idea of accuracy is about minute of dump truck at 50 yds...

look in cast bullet manuals also.. they have a lot of good reduced loads using cast bullets that work just fine with regular jacketed bullets..

learn to load one case, and seat a bullet before going on to the next one..this will eliminate the chance for a double charge...

Hey Black Frog, Welcome Aboard!

There is one Basic Rule to Reduced Loads which should never be broken - Only use Reduced Loads which come from a Powder or Bullet manufacturers Manual.

The Hodgdon Reduced H4895 Loads work fine in everything I've tried them in as well as my Reloading buddies. The daughter of one of them Killed 6 Deer with one of those Reduced H4895 Loads in her 270Win last year. All one shot Kills, all inside 100yds.

There are plenty of good Manuals which list Reduced Loads. The old IMR Guide is an excellent source for guidance.

Best of luck to you.