For years, the old-style Nosler solid base spitzers were, in my humble opinion, one of the best thin-skinned game bullets around. Then came the introduction of the Ballistic Tip, and there's been much water under the bridge since then. But, in limited calibers and weights, the solid base spitzers are back, and I already have a few boxes ordered. I still have a few of the old red-and-black boxes hoarded away and can't wait to compare performance & accuracy. So who else will be giving them a whirl again? ANd who will be using them for the very first time?

I used the 55 grain in my 22-250, and the 165 grain in 30-06. Both worked well even when I smushed the tips.

In today's market the old Nosler solid base is a ho-hum bullet. There's a lot of choices for deer and a lot of better options in the bonded and premium lines.

I think there's little reason for Nosler to reintroduce this bullet. It really offers nothing new.

I would agree they offer nothing new,but new is not important. Gives you another option. I like to pick a bullet weight and find the bullet of that weight a particular rifle shoots best. The solid base nosler is another one to try...tj3006

Vapodog-I still remember the good ol' days, when it didn't take a bonded, premium bullet or a half-pound of powder to kill a whitetail or mulie. For that purpose, the Nosler Solid Base performed wonderfully.

quote:

Originally posted by Bobby Tomek:
Vapodog-I still remember the good ol' days, when it didn't take a bonded, premium bullet or a half-pound of powder to kill a whitetail or mulie. For that purpose, the Nosler Solid Base performed wonderfully.

No question about it.....but so did the interlocks, the core lokts, the power points, the sure shocks, the hot cores, the game kings, the ballistic tips, the SSTs the ....., the ....., the.....etc.

One of my all-time favorites.

A bit of trivia:
The first competition 'one-hole group' as in .000" was shot with Nosler Solid Base bullets although I believe under some scrutiny, the gropu was actually measured to be like .003" because of minor paper shredding around the hole.

-Spencer

I am glad the solid bae is coming back. The ballistic tip was and is not half as good a bullet. I am going to stock up on 150 grain .308 and 60 grain .224. Outstanding accuracy and perfect bullet performance on deer and large varmints. If I didn't have 1000 hornady interloks in .277 I'd get some solid base bullets in that diameter and weight.

When I went to there proshop last month I asked the guy when are you going to start making them for the 6.5 again he told me the only reason they are making them again is because Federal asked them to. So I put in my request and asked him please start making them for the 6.5 in 120's.

I hope they make a flat base as well as their boat tails.

-Spencer

Good bullets, don't get me wrong. But I can still remember the day I shot my first elk. Pretty sure it was an 06 with 150 remmy core lockt's. I do understand that they won't die with those bullets now but it was a great memory at the time.

rickt300-You may want to check out Nosler's Pro-Shop for seconds. They're a great deal, and I believe they at least have the .30/150 right now -- and at $9.95 or thereabouts. I recently purchased some Accu-bond seconds for 11.95 per 50, and I could see no difference ranging from the chronograph, targets or terminal performance.

quote:

The ballistic tip was and is not half as good a bullet.

Just makes me grin everytime I hear someone say that. Same Jacket and Same Core but, different tip and some say they aren't 1/2 as good . Hasn't been the case IMO. Both great bullets for thin skinned game but, I can't say one is by any means far better than the other. Sure the NBT is a tad bit more expansive but once you get past the tip they are the exact same bullets.

Reloader

Guess it depends on your definition of "same". I really liked the solid base bullet and had worked up good loads for a 243, (100gr), 25/06, (120gr), 264, (120gr), and 270, (130gr). "Course the BTip for the 243 is a 95gr, and the BTip for 25 cal is 115gr. So they are not the same. The 120gr 264BTips performed very differently in my 264 (both accuracy and terminal ballistics). I still have a couple of boxes for the 270 and the 243. And I still haven't forgiven Nosler.

olarmy,

Never said they where exactly the same bullets, I said they have the same Jacket and same Core. Once you get past the tip they are identical. The NBTs tip will make the Bullet more stream lined hence the better BC which, in most cases aids accuracy. Your the first I've heard say that the solid base shot better than a NBT, most of the time it's the other way around. I've had great accuracy w/ both. They are both good bullets.

Reloader

I'd like to see them brought back, I remember using them with very good results many yrs ago. I shot some very good groups, not to say they out do BT's, but good memorys of hunting and etc. I'll buy um.

I killed my largest bull elk and best whitetail deer with an '06 using the solid base bullet. I had loaded the 180's pushed out the barrel with Hercules ReLoader 21 somewhat over 2700 fps. Worked very well on everything I shot from coyotes to elk, but many other bullets probably would have as well. I don't particulary care for the 50 round boxes, so I'll use up what I have and doubt I'll rush to buy more.

Reloader

quote:

Never said they where exactly the same bullets, I said they have the same Jacket and same Core.

The jacket is the same before they trim it. To keep the weight the same the jacket on the Ballistic Tip has to be longer/heavier and the core shorter/lighter to have room for the tip.
So the jacket and core are not the same but close.
The performance of the solid base is similar to the Accubond. Nice mushroom, good retained weight and very good penetration. The Ballistic Tip is more explosive and does not retain as much weight.
They are all great bullets but there are differences. Each has it's place.
I designed or drew the tooling for for all of the Nosler products up to but not including the Accubonds. I was the tooling engineer for over 6 years at Nosler.
The Nosler Pro Shop has a pretty good selection of Solid Base seconds but as far as I know, they do not intend to produce them for the retail market. So buy those seconds.
Joe

Joe-Thanks for pointing that out. I was going to mention the differences in a reply but figured I'd just stir up some folks who would argue the point. With your credentials, it should go down as gospel.

I've sectioned many bullets over the years and am amazed by generalizations I hear, especially regarding the Ballistic Tip. "Thin jacketed" is what comes to mind first and foremost. But if those individuals who believed such would actually section one, they'd see the hunting weight BTs indeed have a substantial jacket.

I shoot single shot pistols quite a bit, and the available window for proper expansion with the BTs truly excels, particularly with calibers such as the 6.5mm JDJ, 7mm BR, 7mm Bullberry and the various medium-capacity quarterbores.

Used as their designers intended, the BTs perform admirably. But when the varmint weight BTs are used on game, or someone pushes them at warp speed from a super whiz-bang ultra-thumping magnum, problems arise -- and unfortunately, the bullet gets the blame when in fact shooter error was the true culprit.

But it's time to step back off the soap box...

quote:

-- and unfortunately, the bullet gets the blame when in fact shooter error was the true culprit.

Now don't go start throwing reason and logic out at people, they'll get all mad and such. We all know that most people (not me for sure!) never make mistakes on bullet choice (or placement)!

I was surprised when I bought a box of Nosler Ballistic Tips,
got them home and discovered they were solid base. I had only used them in .24 and .243 and all were boattails. They're amazingly accurate bullets for the price. I had heard
some unhappy grumblings about the Balistic Tips not being strong enough to do the job in the larger calibers. I guess this return to the solid base is to satisfy some of the unhappiness. The bullet jackets were coming apart. I understand the jackets have been made a bit thicker as well as using a solid base. I don't know how this will affect Noslers other lines of bullets. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

The biggest problem I saw when they phased out the SB's in favor of the BT's is that they did away with the flat base option.

There are lots of good guns out there, many of mine included, which just can't stabilize a boat tail bullet.

To me, a boat tail really only comes in handy for loading purposes and if you plan on shooting at high velocity or long range.

Flat base bullets are generally more accurate at closer ranges at least in my experience.

-Spencer

quote:

Originally posted by Joe Cullison:
...I designed or drew the tooling for for all of the Nosler products up to but not including the Accubonds. I was the tooling engineer for over 6 years at Nosler...

Hey Joe, I was wondering if you were going to show up in this thread, glad you did. It gives me a chance to say "Thank You" face-to-face (so to speak) with at least on of the guys responsible for the continual accuracy improvements being made by Nosler. And the other Bullet Manufacturers as well.

I just happen to have a good many of the original Nosler Solid Base bullets in various sizes on the shelves. Killed a bunch of Deer, Hogs and Bear with them back when they were made. Never had one "fail" as a lot of folks seem to have with any bullet named. Excellent bullets for their era.

Now move forward a few decades and compare the original Solid Base bullets with the bullets being made today and the results are quite enlightening. The groups I can shoot with bullets produced from recent lots, using many manufacturers are simply more accurate "overall".

The good news as I see it is that when the "new" Solid Base bullets get into our hands, I'd expect Joe's efforts (as well as the other Nosler folks) to show up as improved accuracy with them as well.

Just remember how they are "Designed to work" if you intend to Hunt with them. I'll predict that if a Hunter puts them into the part of the animal appropriate for that Design, they will work fine, just as they always did.

That said, there are "other" Designs which will just work better on some animals and at specific Points-of-Impact. Some things never change.

quote:

The performance of the solid base is similar to the Accubond.

Once initial impact has taken place and the tips shed, the NBT and SB are the exact same bullet. If someone diagrees, take the two side by side and grind about a 1/4" off the tip then grin them down about half way on the sides for a good side profile, you won't be able to tell which is which.

quote:

I've sectioned many bullets over the years and am amazed by generalizations I hear, especially regarding the Ballistic Tip. "Thin jacketed" is what comes to mind first and foremost. But if those individuals who believed such would actually section one, they'd see the hunting weight BTs indeed have a substantial jacket.

I agree 100%, there are too many folks that believe they have a varmint bullet paper thin jacket but, that's just not true. The jacket gets quite thick towards the base, it's actually much thicker than your traditional cup-n-core bullet jackets that every one raves about. I've found the NBT to penetrate much better than some of the traditional cup-n-cores out (ie Sierra, Coreloct, etc.) due to the base and thicker jacket.

I've seen run of the mill thin jacketed bullets totally shed their jackets and leave nothing but shrapnel. On the other hand, the very few NBTs I've recovered from game animals had the solid base, a good portion of jacket, and a nice little chunk of lead sitting on top of the base every time. I'm sure many will dispute that but, I tend to believe much more in what what I actually see and experience on my own.

Have a Good One

Reloader

quote:

Once initial impact has taken place and the tips shed, the NBT and SB are the exact same bullet. If someone diagrees, take the two side by side and grind about a 1/4" off the tip then grin them down about half way on the sides for a good side profile, you won't be able to tell which is which.

A better way to evaluate the bullets is to clamp them in a vise and cut them in half, lengthwise with a hack saw. Then clean them up with a file and maybe some sandpaper. It will really expose the internal construction and if you get very close to the centerline, will show a direct comparison.

Reloader you are right but you are overlooking one piece that you even mentioned. "Once the initial impact takes place" It is the initial impact and the action of the tip that causes the Ballistic tip to expand more rapidly than the Solid Base bullet. Right, exactly the same bullet from point X down but different in the expansion characteristics from point X forward.

Personally I think the Ballistic tip is a fantastic bullet for specialty pistols and single shot handguns. The expansion/penetration works great. But then again I am a shoulder shooter with any gun. If someone is shooting heart/lung then the BT works great from a rifle.
As said earlier in this string it is a matter of bullet choice for the shot taken at what game at what distance, at what angle, at what velocity.
For any situation the Partition is almost perfect and the Solid Base is also an excellent choice.
Do not expect to see the solid base on the shelf at your local reloading store. As far as I know they do not intend to make it a retail product. The only source will be the Nosler Pro Shop.

The solid base has always been a boat tail and finally evolved into the Ballistic Tip.
The only flat base, that I know of, from Nosler was the Partition Gold.

Use what works for you and realize that nearly any bullet made will do it's intended job if placed properly, at the appropriate velocity.

Joe

quote:

The solid base has always been a boat tail and finally evolved into the Ballistic Tip.
The only flat base, that I know of, from Nosler was the Partition Gold.

Re-examine the history of the Solid Base and you will find that a few of the more benchrest -type calibers and weights were offered in both boat tail and flat base.

What bullet manufacturers need to understand is that not every gun shoots well with boat tail bullets yet that is what is continually pushed onto the market year after year.

If you want to look at a company who realizes this, look no further than Barnes who offers most of their X-bullets in both BT and FB.

-Spencer

ShopCartRacing, I agree with you 100%. I shoot everything from simi-auto pistols to long range handgun to big game rifles and I feel that a flat base is appropriate for everything I do. I would prefer to use flatbase on everything but since I live here in Bend and I have loads for a whole bunch of guns worked up with Nosler bullets, I'll stick with the boat tail for now.

I'll take your word on the old Nosler flat base bullets. They certainly could have been made before I started there in '95. I don't have the entire history memorized. I remember more about how they are made and how they are constructed since '95. But now that you mention it Maybe I do remember reading or hearing about flat bases in the benchrest calibers and weights. I'll check my old manuals and see what I can find.

Thanks and keep shooting those flat base bullets.
Joe