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Okay, I searched all the .45ACP posts and while I found some helpful hints, I couldn't puzzle this one out exactly. I loaded 400 rounds of varying makes of brass, using a Lasercast 200 gr. SWC. All case lengths are .892", and they won't chamber in my Kimber Eclipse. I measured and measured. Finally it became apparent that the crimp had bulged the case wall just below the mouth outward in a sort of "fat roll". Next, I tried resizing them (Hornady dies) to no avail. I pulled the bullets, emptied the components, re- belled the case mouths, and then worked my way from no crimp on down to a heavy crimp. The damn things wont chamber with anything less than a very heavy crimp. It appears that my step of re- belling the cases didnt go far enough to take the "memory" out of the brass, thus retaining the "fat roll" originally encountered. I am hesitant to open the case mouth any further, and I doubt it will help. Has this happened to anyone, and what did you do? Thanks. Merkel 140A- .470NE Beretta Vittoria- 12 Ga. J.P. Sauer & Sohn Type B- 9.3x64mm ArmaLite AR-10A4- 7.62x51mm Franchi Highlander- 12 Ga. Marlin 1894 CB Limited- .41 Magnum Remington 722- .244 Rem. and many, many more. An honest man learns to keep his horse saddled. | ||
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Did you re-size the brass after pulling the bullet? You'll have to literally start from scratch on all the cases. Use a bullet puller, save the components to re-use and then re-size the brass as though you had fired it, etc. Then you should be fine. ***BE VERY CAUTIOUS ABOUT DE-CAPPING THOSE LIVE PRIMERS... it can be done but be really gentle about it*** I'd use a very slight roll crimp - almost none - for that kind of load. Very gradually increase the crimp from zero to the point where it grips the bullet just slightly. The .45 ACP headspaces on the case mouth, so you can't roll it into the crimping groove or you may have problems with headspacing. .22 LR Ruger M77/22 30-06 Ruger M77/MkII .375 H&H Ruger RSM | |||
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I understand it as you`ve over crimped the mouth bulging the case wall behind the crimp? If so you`ll have to resize the case to get the wall back down to size, re-bell and load the cartridge. I haven`t been unfortunate enought to have this happen to me but from what I`ve heard from others who have, a Lee factory crimp die may fix the problem. The die as I understand it both sizes and crimps the case in the same step. This should take the case wall back down and allow it to chamber. Maybe someone that`s used the die can verify this. ------------------------------------ The trouble with the Internet is that it's replacing masturbation as a leisure activity. ~Patrick Murray "Why shouldn`t truth be stranger then fiction? Fiction after all has to make sense." (Samual Clemens) "Saepe errans, numquam dubitans --Frequently in error, never in doubt". | |||
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Thanks, gentlemen! I forgot to mention that I did in fact resize before the belling operation. I removed the decapping pin from the die so I dont worry about primer detonation. I think I probably did'nt iron out the original case bulge enough. Merkel 140A- .470NE Beretta Vittoria- 12 Ga. J.P. Sauer & Sohn Type B- 9.3x64mm ArmaLite AR-10A4- 7.62x51mm Franchi Highlander- 12 Ga. Marlin 1894 CB Limited- .41 Magnum Remington 722- .244 Rem. and many, many more. An honest man learns to keep his horse saddled. | |||
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3584ELK, I can't see how it would not chamber properly once you fully resize the case... The Lee Crimp die does not size the case, it only does a crimping operation. Remember don't crimp the bullet much at all, the mouth is where the case headspaces in the chamber... Friction fit should work just fine in this cartridge. PS: In fact how about you go step by step here and eliminate each step one at a time... Size the empty case, then chamber it in the gun and see if it drops into place. It should... Then seat the bullet and try it again, etc. .22 LR Ruger M77/22 30-06 Ruger M77/MkII .375 H&H Ruger RSM | |||
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I will NOT post the way I would solve the problem (if I understand the issues) . . . . . . . . . BUT . . . . . I will say there is NO reason to decap the brass. Just pull the decaping pin resize and reload as if it all started from fired brass. Don't limit your challenges . . . Challenge your limits | |||
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the lee crimp die does have a carbide "ring" inside of it to size the OD of the case to proper size and get rid of bulging. my suggestion. back off on the bullet seating die so that it only seats the bullet and doesnt crimp.. the pick up the lee die (its cheap enough) and use that to crimp. I have it set up in my turret press like this and it works great. you can also run all the previously loaded ammo through it and it should fix it without pulling the bullets. Unstable Boy | |||
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TC is right, that was a "DOH!" on my part, no need to decap in this circumstance. Just remove the decap pin from sizing die... Is the carbide sizing ring unique to certain Lee Crimp dies then? The only Lee Factory Crimp dies I have are for .458 Win and .375 H&H and they have no sizing ring, so perhaps it's only found in certain straight-wall cartridges. .22 LR Ruger M77/22 30-06 Ruger M77/MkII .375 H&H Ruger RSM | |||
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I believe, remember I don`t have one, the Lee factory crimp die for TAPER crimping has the resizeing ring. It`s a slick set up from the little I know of them when problems like 3584elks`s occur. The ring resizes the case while crimping the bullet in place. There are quit a few pistol shooters that use them to insure feeding in tight chambered semi autos. ------------------------------------ The trouble with the Internet is that it's replacing masturbation as a leisure activity. ~Patrick Murray "Why shouldn`t truth be stranger then fiction? Fiction after all has to make sense." (Samual Clemens) "Saepe errans, numquam dubitans --Frequently in error, never in doubt". | |||
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I use the Lee taper crimp dies for all my 38, 44, and 45ACP loads. They work great, the only downside being they add an extra step to the loading process. | |||
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In the past I have corrected crimp "booboo's" by running the loaded case into a resize die. It will flatten bulges, just dont jamb it in and stick it. Good luck! | |||
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Thanks again for the enthusiastic responses. I set up the crimp die, and ran the remainder through the crimp die. They all chamber now, and while I have a heavier crimp, it does work. I am fully aware of the concept of not heavily crimping 45 ACP rounds, and so once this run of ammo is shot up, I will change my methods back to a light taper crimp. Merkel 140A- .470NE Beretta Vittoria- 12 Ga. J.P. Sauer & Sohn Type B- 9.3x64mm ArmaLite AR-10A4- 7.62x51mm Franchi Highlander- 12 Ga. Marlin 1894 CB Limited- .41 Magnum Remington 722- .244 Rem. and many, many more. An honest man learns to keep his horse saddled. | |||
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Hi folks. Newbe here and if I may point out a few items. Roll crimping and semi-auto pistols really don't mix. Roll crimping is good for wheel guns. Most caliber semi-autos need to be taper crimped due to as been stated that they head space on the mouth of the case. Roll crimping and then resizing could if you are loading close to max. bring the pressures beyond max. safe. Just a thought. I have a bit of experience with 1911's both building and loading and the two major areas considering that the charge is proper is the crimp and cartridge overall length. The bulge behind a roll crimp won't allow the round to be chambered in a decent chamber though it can in a loose chamber and if the COL is off you will have timing problems. Just my $.02 Don | |||
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An extra step is not a downside when it benefits your finished ammo! I use a seperate taper crimp die on most of my handgun ammo. Works for me. Rick | |||
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NO! Do Kimbers have a tight chamber?? I don't crimp my .45 ACP rounds at all. My seating die removes the bell, but that is about all. You need as much case mouth as you can get, for accurate, consistent headspacing. If headspacing is not consistent, you can forget accuracy! Try this. Make sure the resized, primed cases will go into the chamber freely BEFORE you bell them. Then use ONLY that tiny amount of belling that permits you to start the bullet without the base hanging up on the case mouth. I often use such a slight bell that you have to use a bullet base to make sure there's indeed some belling there, since it is so slight you can't really see it! "Bitte, trinks du nicht das Wasser. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen." | |||
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El Deguello, That's exactly how I bell all my case mouths - so slight that it's hard to tell it's even belled. Saves the life of the case... .22 LR Ruger M77/22 30-06 Ruger M77/MkII .375 H&H Ruger RSM | |||
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when i seat lead swc i leave about .020 of shoulder out of case and crimp as a separate operation using a lee factory crimp die. nra handloader's guide,3rd. ed., says that a roll crimp means that about .020" of the case mouth is rolled over, with case mouth reduced to .460". also i found that the lyman multi-expand die does the best job of expanding the case mouth and you can buy expanders for all the handgun calibers, i use it with a ohous duo-measure to charge and expand case. | |||
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Kimbers have VERY tight chamber. A buddy of mine has a H&K USP 45 and it will take anything. My Kimber is very picky about what you feed it. I get the best results by just lightly crimping, or no crimp. Also, if you are exanding the case mouths, just do it enough to get the bullet to seat. I ran into trouble once by expanding the mouths out to far, and the dang things wouldn't chamber  | |||
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Yeah, this gun is a picky, although that pickiness does translate to very good accuracy. I made everyone marvel when we shot to qualify at our CCW class. That Kimber made one ragged hole in the bullseye! Merkel 140A- .470NE Beretta Vittoria- 12 Ga. J.P. Sauer & Sohn Type B- 9.3x64mm ArmaLite AR-10A4- 7.62x51mm Franchi Highlander- 12 Ga. Marlin 1894 CB Limited- .41 Magnum Remington 722- .244 Rem. and many, many more. An honest man learns to keep his horse saddled. | |||
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I was looking at a guy having trouble at the range with his Kimber. It would not close and he was at a loss (this guy is selling reloads to others claming to know what he is doing) what I discovered was his hard cast round nose bullets had a shoulder on them and they were head-spacing on the bullet shoulder. I suggested to him that he seat the bullets deeper and when he had shot them up to get ones with no shoulder on them. The Lyman Round Nose mold that I use has no shoulder. I have shot HG# 68 bullets through my Kimber Classic Stainless with no problem. BTW Kimber is an excellent gun from the factory and I enjoy shooting mine more than the other 4 Colt Gold Cups that I owned. The second one would rattle when you shook it so I sent it back they went through it and made a fine gun out of it. One of my friends needed it and I needed the money. The other 3 Colt Gold Cups were loose as well. Good luck and keep trying you "will" get it right. Swede --------------------------------------------------------- NRA Life Member | |||
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I've used the Lee Taper Crimp die for exactly this concern. Loaded up a mess of Rainier plated loads, and didn't drop any of them into my Wilson case gauge after loading. Once I did, none would easily fit, bought the ($10?) die, adjusted it, and ran ALL my loaded rounds through it. End of story. I use it on every auto pistol round I load now, in conjunction with the Wilson gauge. | |||
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I used to have a lot of problems w/ 45acp cases, until I started trimming. Lot of folks don't take the time, as it's a real pain, but there is no way to get a consistent crimp, w/ brass that varies from .885 to .898. I trim mine to .889, give or take .002. My loaded round reject rate has dropped off to 0% since. Regards - GCF "Sometimes you make eight - Sometimes you hit dirt" | |||
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And I have used the .454 Lee roundnose 220-grain bullet (sized to .451", of course) that is intended for the Ruger Old Army in my .45 ACP with great results - 8 grains of HS6! "Bitte, trinks du nicht das Wasser. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen." | |||
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Has anyone noticed there's a slight taper to the .45 acp case?,,,There's .003" taper between the mouth and head.IMHO it should not be roll crimped like a straight wall case.I don't on mine,never had a problem.Clay | |||
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"varying makes of brass" this could be some of the problem as the wall thickness is different with each lot or brand. Always taper crimp 45acp | |||
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Calling the thing we do to the mouth of 45ACP after bullet seating " crimping " is very misleading . Just return the case mouth to the size it needs to be ( IMHO .469 - .470 at the very edge of the mouth ). There should be no obvious visual sign of a " crimp " at all. Yes, the 45ACP is slightly tapered. Travis F. | |||
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