I noticed some posts about h 870 being discontinued etc. Then I began to wonder. I think that alot of Hodgdon's ball powders are virtually duplicated by winchester powders, and the guys posting here from Australia say that the Hodgdon stick powder is made by a company over there. IS THERE REALLY A HODGDON POWDER MANUFACTURING FACILITY?? Or do they buy there stuff and relabel it.

Re the h 870 it sure saddened alot of people but the one and only pound I bought was about 200fps slower than it should have been, burned dirtier than sin, and still somehow split case necks!!

No, Hodgdon has never owned or operated a powder manufacturing facility, with the exception of their involvement with Pyrodex, perhaps. I am not clear on the relationship of the Hodgdon Powder Company with the Pyrodex manufacturing faclity, but Hodgdon did have (or has) an exclusive distribution right to Pyrodex. You'll perhaps recall that it was in an explosion at the Pyrodex facility that Dan Pawlek, the Pyrodex inventor, was killed.

Originally, all of the Hodgdon powders were military surplus. Most, if not all, of their "sperical" powders were manufactured by Olin as military powders, or later by the St. Marks (former Olin) facility. Some of their commercial stick powders came from Scotland for a while (can't remember the manufacturer), and now from Australia. They may have used some Nobels at one time.

As with the Accurate Arms Company, Hodgdon is a distributor, not manufacturer.

I live, literally, just down the street from Hodgdon's headquarters. I believe what Stonecreek said is accurate, with most of the powder coming from Australia.

If you go to their website and look at the MSDS sheets for their powders, you will see where the powder is manufactured.

I believe they DID develop the new 777 clean burning blackpowder substitute, but I do not know if they actually manufacture it.

I owe it to myself to stop over there for a tour of their facility.

Tim

[ 11-21-2002, 23:57: Message edited by: TimB99 ]

kraky - Interesting you should pose this question. Just this morning, I was wondering WHO actually does make their own powder.

Let's see, Olin, or is it Primex, has a plant in St. Marks, FL, I think, where W296 (same as H110) is made, W760 which is the same as H414, and a guy mentioned H450 being the same as the old W785. Then we have IMR 4831 which some say is Accurate 3100. Over at gibrass.com they sell WC872 which is supposedly interchangeable with H870.

Maybe Steve just makes it all in his basement - that's how he has so much data at his pages

R-WEST

Hodgdon makes nothing...they repackage.

I think ADI in Australia produce some powders for Hodgen, I could be wrong however.

So does the Aussy firm make Varget too? Or?

Atlatl,

Varget is an Australian powder and out here it is called AR 2208.

This link will take you to the relevant section on the Hodgdon site.

http://www.hodgdon.com/msds/extruded.htm

The Australian company that makes the powder is called Australian Defence Industries or ADI

Mike

[ 11-23-2002, 05:05: Message edited by: Mike375 ]

Does any one know the ADI equivalent of H4895? Looks like this powder is excellent for 50/60% reduced loads. Anyone got a reduced load for the 308 with this powder?

Just thought I'd mention it. I just purchased 48 pounds from Jeff Bartlett at www.gibrass.com He deals in millitary surplus powders that can be loaded to data common to commerical stuff like H-110, H-450, H-870, IMR 4831, RL-25, ect. The best thing is the PRICE! total cost for 48 pounds was $334.10, and that includes shipping. If you buy 48 pounds or more, he pays the hazmat fee. Powder is getting too damn expensive. I'll be loading this stuff up shortly in some of my more overbore mags. like my .338-378 Weatherby and such. I'll report the results as soon as I get them. Bill T.

[ 11-24-2002, 16:21: Message edited by: Bill T ]

As long as H322 and H4227 are available, I'm happy.

Eddie

BillT - Those prices ARE pretty hard to beat, for sure. Powder prices at the local dealer are getting really hard to stomach, especially when you use a lot of it.

I got a batch of "newly manufactured" IMR4895 from gibrass.com last year, and, it's about a grain or two hotter than the lot of DuPont IMR 4895 I'd been using. As long as you don't start out full throttle all the time with the surplus and pulldown powders, they're the way to go.

R-WEST

R West, The prices are very good and Jeff is very reliable to deal with. This is where I'll be buying most all my powder from now on. Although the 48 pounds I bought should last for quite some time! I just think some of these commerical powders are way too overpriced. I stopped by a local gun shop here a while back and they had RL-25 for $24.00 a pound. Thats robbery. I just bought 16 pounds of Accurate 2230C last month from Natches and it was priced good at $59.95 for 8 pounds. It's a one shot sale so I might pick up another 16 pounds soon, before they sell out. 2230C has a burn rate near IMR 3031 and is good for many standard cartridges like .308, .30-06, .30-30, etc. It can be loaded with 2230 data. Bill T.

BillT - Holy Cow!! $24.00/lb

Likewise, I'm a dedicated user of 2230-C, and, most of the other Accurate Arms powders via Natchez They have pretty good prices on the "name" brand powders, too.

R-WEST

It would be interesting to note the price difference between what we pay in Australia for our powder with the ADI label and what you guys are being slugged in the US for the same powder under the Hogdon banner?

Boris - Checking the MidSouth catalog, all the Hodgdon powders run around $16.50 US dollars per pound. If it's being shipped, we have the haz-mat fees of $20.00 per box. I think the max we can get is 4-8# containers in one box. Bought at a local gunshop, the prices are about $2.00 per pound more.

R-WEST

Natchez has some good deals on other AA powders. 8lbs of AA-4350 or AA-4064 is $75. The 2230C is closer to AA-2460 than AA-2230.

You have to watch Hodgdon, some of their powders, Clays most noteably, comes in a 14 Oz. container, NOT a 1 pound can. This throws price comparisions off. Bill T.

GSF 1200, Can load data be interchanged between AA-2460, AA-2230, and AA-2230C ?? Bill T.

Hi R-WEST,

Thought I would ask what brands you would recommend. I'm a 2230-C freak! My last reloading went well. But, 2 sets of rounds totally misfired taking off part of my left ear. What a mess. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Any help on some affordable health insurance would also really help at this time. Thanks.

"Fire the first round and take your opponent down!"

GUN-PRO

quote:

---

Originally posted by R-WEST:
BillT - Holy Cow!! $24.00/lb

Likewise, I'm a dedicated user of 2230-C, and, most of the other Accurate Arms powders via Natchez They have pretty good prices on the "name" brand powders, too.

R-WEST

---

Bill T & R-West,

I had the opportunity to speak to the technical department over at Accurate Arms about the time 2230-C first became available. The gentleman I spoke with said that 2230-C has a burn rate that is 6% slower than commercial AA-2230 and that it was/is acceptable to use AA-2230 data for load development

FWIW,

R-West,
I have been loading new WC-844 which I bought from Jeff Bartlet, and I agree with you about the quality of his service.

I am getting low and was thinking of reordering, when I saw some AA2230-C for sale at the gun show.
The price was $79/8#, which is cheaper than I can get powder from Jeff (unless I order a case). Since I don't think that I want to buy six jugs, I was thinking I would pick up some of this. You say that this is one of your favorite powders, can you elaborate?

I am shooting .223 55gr bullets

I bought 8# of surplus IMR-4895 for $64.00 and 2K of the 55 gr .224 Hornady SP bulk bullets for $44.00 a K from Pat's. I don't know if the prices are the same as I bought this stuff almost a year ago. Just another place for you guys to check is all.

http://patsreloading.com/patsrel/whatsnew.htm

[ 01-13-2003, 08:04: Message edited by: Mike-OR ]

For those that are interested in the Aussie powder

http://www.adi-limited.com/handloaders-guide/

Ed Reynolds and AEM Enterprises, Inc. (the "AccuLoad" and "CalcuLoader" guys) can probably tell you where every canister powder by any distributor is ultimately made. He is virtually a walking encyclopedia on the subject. You can reach him at Ed@aement.com

ADI's AR2208 is "nearly" equivalent to Hodgdon's 4895 ... perhaps slightly slower. You will find that load manuals also give charge weight for a given cartridgde within 0.5 grains for the two powders.

Been lollagagging (working) again, and not paying enough attention to this thread. Gotta stop that.

Gun-Pro - Don't know if your post is serious or in jest, but, if you're serious, I don't really have a 'favorite'. Looking through my load notes, just about every powder mfr is represented in my "Pet Loads" section for each weapon. Accurate Arms is a favorite because of their good prices, especially when Natchez has it on sale. One thing I HAVE noticed is their lot to lot variations seem pretty extreme, as GSF1200 mentioned with 2015. I usually buy at least one, sometimes 2, eight pound containers of whatever powder, so, a few years may go by before it's time to re-stock; in that time frame, there may be a dozen or more lot changes, so, today's powder may be major different than the last batch. IMR's powders traditionally haven't exhibited this trait.

El Viejo - I've been using AA2015BR (the old version, not the newer XMR2015 that GSF1200 mentioned) almost exclusively in a 223 700 VLS that was accurized by Arnold Arms before their demise. The rifle is capable of shooting in the 0.200's consistently (although I'm not) with 24.5 of the old AA2015 and 52/53 Hornady or Sierra HP match bullets in Federal Gold Medal Match cases with F205M primers. I'd purchased a bunch of 2230-C last year, and, with my supply of AA2015 running low, I started fooling around with 2230-C. At the same time, I was playing with a Model 7 in 7TCU. It also liked the AA2015, so, I started using 2230-C in it, as well. Both rifles responded very well, albeit needing another grain or two of the slower 2230-C. I've not been able to give it a thorough workout yet (my range here in SW Pa is currently under about 8 feet of snow), but, it looks like 2230-C might work okay. Accuracy isn't quite as gilt-edged as AA2015, but, I really need to work with some different primers, seating depths, etc..

I just opened an 8# jug of the new XMR2015, so, if spring comes eventually, it may end up as the winner.

It sure is frustrating knowing I won't be able to shoot for months; I'm going stir-crazy. I have box upon box of different loads to try, and the weather just will NOT co-operate. Jan. 10th at 1:00 AM was the last time the temp was above 32 degrees; 20 MPH winds = calm; it won't stop snowing; can't see the wife's car (and it's an SUV) for the snowdrifts; the weather guy just said the HIGH for Thursday will be 4 degrees (F) with gusty winds and snow showers. I guess the past few extremely mild winters have spoiled me I've cleaned the loading room about a dozen times, catalogued supplies ad infinitum, cleaned/re-cleaned rifles, checked scopes/bases/rings, trimmed/weighed/polished brass, cleaned/uniformed primer pockets. The wife came downstairs the other night and I was talking to my boxes of bullets. I need warmth I'm starting to lose it

R-WEST