Does compressing powder loads make it difficult to keep overall length consistant?

My load: 7.62X39, Laupa cases(1.514), Sierra 125 Spitzer(2120), 29.0 grains H4895.

Hodgdon does not indicate this is a compressed load but the powder is only about 1/16 from the top of the case. The OAL varies +/- .005 and I think the OAL actually grows between seating and crimping. Is this normal? Is this a problem? Am I anal?

Yes; the bullet can be deformed and/or the powder can push the bullet back out. H4895 is a really slow powder for use in that case unless the bullets are 150 gr. I suggest switching to H4227. 22.5 - 23 gr with that 125 gr bullet will be an excellent load and will equal factory and milsurp in ballistics.

Larry Gibson

quote:

The OAL varies +/- .005

If I was getting +/- .005" I would call it good and go shooting.

Use a drop tube and/or vibration source to settle the charge a bit before seating. Other options include using a short-cut version of the powder (if offered). Crimping at a cannelure is the other thing I use (bigger calibers).

The extruded powders are far more forgiving when compressed than the ball powders.Compressing ball powder can actually unseat the primers. Did that! During the 60s I compressed full ( to the top ) cases of H 4831 in the 22-250 ( 2 varminter ). Never had a bit of problem and the rifle was always deadly accurate using Barnes' original 70 grain bullets.
Today I use 33 grains of 4895 totally compressed with a 300 grain gas checked bullet in my .358 x 41. No problems. roger

Mike, yes, you are anal.

.005 is a normal variance in OAL.
I've compressed loads to the point the cases have bulged....and other then that, have had little if any, problems with it.

Please let us know how that load shoots. I might like to try it sometime.

While I try to avoid messing around with drop tubes and swirling the powder as I fill the case, why not try this just for fun. Fill one of your cases as you normally would with H4895, then put your finger over the mouth of the case and tap it several times on your reloading bench. There should be a considerable difference between the starting level of the powder and the finished level.
H4895 as with most of the stick powders, can take considerable "compression" before it becomes an issue.
I do agree with the idea that before you get too involved with the more exotic methods of getting more powder in a case, usually a better powder can be found.

I ran into a bulk problem with 27 grains of Varget in .223 cases. Dumping powder straight into the funnel filled the neck. Pouring slower resulted in powder settling to the top of the shoulder.

I used this load to test primers (Fed/CCI/WLR) and got some of my better results; best with WLR. As for the anal part, if I told all the particulars I use in reloading and gun cleaning you would have no doubts. Thanks guys.

If one really gets finicky he can load powder twice.....1/2 load and compress with a brass rod and then load the balance of powder and compress with the bullet....he will find the bullet experiencing much less compression this way....but IMO it's a lot of work for the gains....

One can actually use a slightly slower powder using this method and squeeze another 100 FPS from his hunting loads.....that's assuming it's worth it to you.

Also try using a long drop powder funnel.

quote:

My load: 7.62X39, Laupa cases(1.514), Sierra 125 Spitzer(2120), 29.0 grains H4895.

Shot this load again today with smallest 3 shot group at 100 yds being 0.447". For a 7.62x39 (.30 Russian) in a Ruger 77 Mark II this appears to be a keeper of a hunting load. Thanks for the input.

With 4895 and similar stick powders, you can fill them to heaping over the mouth and not have any problems (other than spilling) with compression.

I loaded 27.5 gr of Varget in .223 cases. I backed off a 1/2gr only because I kept spilling it.

I have been loading ammo since 1967 and have never found need for a compressed powder charge . If the powder doesn't fit the case well enough to allow a bullet to be seated without compression , it ain't the right powder !

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Bromley:
I have been loading ammo since 1967 and have never found need for a compressed powder charge . If the powder doesn't fit the case well enough to allow a bullet to be seated without compression , it ain't the right powder !

In 1967 I was compressing a whole lot of H 4831 into 250-3000 cases resized to 22-Varminter. It was absolutely the right powder cause it and H-4895 was all I could afford and the 4895 was just a little too fast burning for Barnes' 70 grain bullets. In many years of compressing powders the only real barrier was significant compression of some of the fine ball powders.
Me thinks there is a lot of powder compression that goes on with some unawareness. For instance, people have been pushing large for caliber bullets into the .308 and its clones and doing some fair intrusion into their powder rooms.
If any one can provide sound data to support the "wrong powder" general statement I would be surprised but be objective in reviewing it. roger

I don't really consider hearing or feeling a slight "scrunch" when you seat the bullet as compression although I guess it is. I've done that with various stick powders but I always had plenty of neck to start the bullet into.
When I say you can find a better powder, I mean one where you don't have to dump your powder in stages nor use a drop tube nor have to swirl your powder going into the case and even then it's a tedious task moving the case over to the press without spilling powder.
I don't think using a "not quite right" powder because you can't afford another or don't want to make a trip to town is really what we're talking about. I've used 4350 in a 22-250 case. I got excellent accuracy but couldn't get enough velocity to suit me.
Most cartridges can use a pretty good arc of powders is why I say you can find a better powder.

Try this, set up your vibrating case cleaner next to your loading bench. I don't like it on my bench. Wen you drop your powder into the case with the funel just hold the case agenst the tumbler it will settle the powder.
Bill

Vapodog,
I'd thought you'd been over it by now, guess I was wrong. 3,607(100) out of a lowly .257 Ackley was more than you could swallow and there was the idiot who contacted Speer to confirm what i'd already told him.
Come on over, the Steelhead run is on.
Stepchild