I noticed while searching other threads for opinions on Hawk Bullets that they seem to work ok for the older big bore s (45-70, etc.) but that they are not recommended for anything in the 30-06 class or above. I have been considering using these bullets in the following lever action calibers:

.307 Winchester
.356 Winchester
.375 Winchester
.444 Marlin
.35 Remington

I have been impressed with their selection in F/N style bullets; however I am concerned as to the performance in these calibers. Does anybody have experience with Hawk Bullets in these calibers?

Any and all opinions based on actual experience would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Matt

Dutch4122 I have used Hawks in two calibers, 9.3x74R 285 gr. .035jkt. I Have shot several pigs with this bullet at ranges from 20yds to 100yds. Every hog went right down, none ran. The bullets I recovered had large mushrooms and about 50% of the shank left, good weight retention. Velocity was @ 2350fps. In my 450/400 3 1/4 [.408dia.] 300gr. .025jkt. I have shot several pigs and one deer, at ranges from about 30 feet to about 50 yds. The pigs have gone right down, the deer shot facing me at about 40yds took one jump, the bullet was recovered in the flank. It knocked a big hole in the heart. The 400's I have recovered have expanded to the size of a quarter, they do not have hardly any shank left. They work perefectly for my intended purpose of shooting deer and pigs on my lease. Their velocity is 2330 fps. If I was going to use Hawk bullets for any larger game I would switch to the heavier jkt. I have some 400gr. .408 Hawks in .035jkt but I have not taken game with them yet. In a nutshell they have performed as advertised. At the velocities of the rifles you list for small deer and broad side shots the .025jkt would give a BIG mushroom and adequate penetration. For bigger animals and raking shots I would get the .035jkt. I have been impressed with them on the game I have shot with them. They have anchored several 270 to 285 lb. hogs in both calibers, one shot each.

N E 450 No2-

Thanks for the info! This is exactly the kind of advice I need. I had been unsure about their use in my .35 Whelen, but it looks like I could duplicate your load with their .358 280 grn round tip at about the same velocity with the same jacket thickness.
My intended use will be on Deer, Black Bear and Pigs so it seems we're in the ballpark on game performance.

I'd still appreciate any more info whether good or bad that anybody else would be willing to share.

-Matt

Had I hit #1 (CO Mule Deer) in the shoulders at 180 yds, I might have recovered the bullet to see the expansion. I hit him thru the top of the heart, just behind the "elbow" and had complete penetration. Dropped in it's tracks.

#2 � Mule Deer at a bit over 170 yds, through onside shoulder and out behind offside. Typical entrance (bloodshot � to about 4 inches and a completely shattered shoulderblade. No recovery. Deer went about 5 steps before folding up.

Both w/ 35 Rem. XP-100, .035 jacket Est. impact velocity ~1700 fps.

I used them twice in Africa and I have a lot of failures in the form of seperations...I used the .035 the second time and I still had seperations..Used them in 338, 375 H&H and 300 H&H...so like you say they did not work well in these calibers...

I blew up a .035 160 or 175 gr. 7x57 on a small spike buck with a rear end shot that stopped cold and came apart in the first 6" but it put him down with a broken pelvis and I finished him quickly..I posted these failed bullets on here sometime back...

Hawks appear to be just old time bullets with no core binding or any of the atributes of modern bulletry.... Copper jackets and pure lead are not a new inovation, regardless of their claims... i suspect that is why they allegedly work in the older black powder calibers and that makes since because those old calibers are not hard on the bullets integrity at that low velocity....

Based on my experience at the velocity I have shot the Hawks, I would choose the .050jkt for any muzzle velocity above 2500fps for game bigger than deer.In my 9.3x74R I have killed 4 Pigs with the 286 Nosler Partition. Two went right down, two ran. Of the two that ran both were hit behind the shoulder[ on purpose do not want to mess up the shoulder roast ], one at @ 50yds and the other at 100 yds. Similar hits with the Hawk bullets have resulted in no steps taken after impact....but the Nosler's have always given complete penetration. The Woodleigh 286 gr. usually shoots through on ribcage broad side shots, most times on shoulder shots. The one shot taken at a running away hog [freezer was low on wild pig], knocked him right down but a finisher was necessary.The bullet penetrated from the left ham to right behind the front shoulder inside the rib cage. I like to use the Hawks when I am not walking while hunting and can probably wait for a broad side shot. While stalking pigs I usually use a Woodleigh, or Nosler Partition. I might put a Hawk in the right bbl and a Woodliegh or a Nosler in the left. This is one of the advantages of a double rifle, instant selection of two different loads. I have also used the Speer 270gr. with excellent results. I was worried that at around 2200 to 2300 fps I would not get good expansion from the Nosler but the pig shot at 100 yds still had a big hole in him. When it is all said and done a Nosler Partition is a hard all-round bullet to beat. But I sure like those Hawks on broad side shots.

Ray,

I imagine those Hawk bullets are intended for the shooter using big guns on smaller game. I think they would sell well in Australia. The only problem with them is that they are expensive especially once freight is added and the 400 grain Speer Flat Nose in 458 really does the job as do the 220 Hornady flat nose 375s. Hawk quote me $36.50US to send out 100 350 grain thin jacketed 416s.

Geoff McDoanald in an email told me he uses his 440 grain Black Powder Express bullets for his 50 caliber shooting for pigs and goats.

Mike

Mike you are correct, they are more pricey than standard production bullets. That is one of the advantages of the 375 and the various 458 rifles is that good plinking/lesser big game bullets are avialable for peanuts. The advantage of the Hawks is that you can get them in thin or thick jackets for nearly any of the odd [ie. non standard American] sizes, and in several different weights. By picking different weights and jacket thickness, you can taylor your bullet to the velocity and game you are hunting.

450,

I have just gone ahead to get dies and press from Dave Corbin and starting with 416.

I am going to do both copper tube and also use jackets from USA. 350s and 400s with .018" jackets anda hollow point like the 308 Speer 130 grain Hollow Point should do the job at hand.

By the way, the gear is expensive and you there is a wait of couple of months or more.

What should be interesting is a thin jacketed bullet with bonded core. I have also ordered the dies for paper patch and 3 point styles. A hollow point which is easiest to make, a point like Hawks Round Tip and a flat nose hollow point like Hornady 300 grain 458s.

375 will be next on the agenda.

Mike

[ 08-05-2002, 10:37: Message edited by: Mike375 ]

Mike,
I personally think the woodleigh is the bullet by which to judge all others, for shooting game, but the Norhtfork, Nosler and GS HV may be about equal...I have used Woodleighs extensively and they have never failed me. I will try the new 375 H&H 350 gr. softs on Buffalo this year..or I am taking a loaded box or two to my PH to try...

Ray,

I think those Northfork bullets with the driving bands are going shoot nice.

I base that on some testing a mate has done with Gerards 110 grain 264 bullets. The rifle is a Rem 700 with Number 5 barrel, Jewell trigger etc. and the Gerard bullets if anything are shooting easier than the Ballistic Tips.

Mike

goneballistic,

I just realised my error. I have gone with Richard Corbin not Dave.

Initially I am gettting the Walnut press which is the same as Dave's smaller hand press. Once I get the hang of things then I will get Richard's Benchmaster Hydraulic press.

From what I could tell the Mega Mite is best if you are not going to get the hydraulic press.

Leaving the hydraulic presses to one side, the expensive part of this bullet making is the dies and various punches for difference point shapes.

If you want to make your own jackets from tubing, the dies are about $400US and they are around $1500US to $2000US if you want to make jackets from strip.

Mike

[ 08-06-2002, 02:01: Message edited by: Mike375 ]

Thanks for all the info on the Hawk Bullets. I guess the .025 jacket bullets are definately not the way to go in a medium bore rifle. I have some 250 grn .358's with the .030 jacket and I think I will try them first. Although, I think a tougher jacket will be necessary for anything bigger than deer. Not sure I would like to try the .030 jacket on pigs unless the bullet was heavier.

-Matt