I HAVE A NEW .338 REM 700 AWR AND AFTER A FEW RELOADS THE BOLT IS HARD TO CLOSE.FOUND BRASS HAS EXPANDED AROUND BASE MAKING HEAD SPACE TO 0 TOLERANCE CAUSING BINDING.ANY SUGGESTIONS. THANKS

it seems as though you might be loading a trifle stiff here.

Is this something that might want to be backed off a bit?

I AM LOADING 70.9 GR RL 19 225 GR HORNADAY. THANKS

That recipe is pretty mild I would think. Bad lots of powder do get out though!

Have you trimmed the cases? Full length resize? How many times have these cases been fired? How many times since last trimmed? Are you neck sizing? What type of die?

When I neck size the bolt closes snug but it shouldn't bind up. I'd start by taking some measurements of fired cases, prepped cases, and a loaded round. I'd also recommend chambering a prepped case with some prussian blue or something to mark where the contact is. Nate

I CHECKED THE CASES AND THE BINDING IS AT THE BASE BETWEEN THE BASE AND THE BOLT.I TOOK A CASE THAT WAS BINDING AND SANDED OFF SOME OF THE BASE AND IT CLOSED FINE. THNAKS

Just for fun, screw the sizing die into the press about a 1/4 of a turn at a time and see if the case chambers any easier. Keep screwing it in until the case chambers easier or you bottom out against the press ram.

Generally most people don't type in all Caps on the internet, it's hard to read and people tend to take it as shouting.

Sounds like your dies are not resizing the case ahead of the belt properly, a common problem with belted cases.

Have thought of getting one of these fancy looking body dies for belted magnum cases - has anyone tried them?

Belted Magnum Collet Body Die

I JUST BOUGHT A NEW SET OF RCBS DIES TO TRY THEM. THE PROBLEM IS AT THE BASE WHERE THE PRIMER POCKET TO THE EDGE OF THE CASE, ON THE BOTTOM OF THE CASE.THE CASE SLIDES IN PERFECTLY ON SIDES IN THE CHAMBER AND DIES BOTH.AFTER A FEW RELOADS THE CASE EXPANDS FROM THE PRIMER POCKET TO THE SIDE. THANKS

If you are getting that much case head expansion,how are the primer pockets?If they are loose after a few loadings the load is too hot for the rifle,reguardless of what the manual says.

quote:

Originally posted by WADE MASON:
I JUST BOUGHT A NEW SET OF RCBS DIES TO TRY THEM. THE PROBLEM IS AT THE BASE WHERE THE PRIMER POCKET TO THE EDGE OF THE CASE, ON THE BOTTOM OF THE CASE.THE CASE SLIDES IN PERFECTLY ON SIDES IN THE CHAMBER AND DIES BOTH.AFTER A FEW RELOADS THE CASE EXPANDS FROM THE PRIMER POCKET TO THE SIDE. THANKS

Are you saying that the rim diameter is increasing?

quote:

Sounds like your dies are not resizing the case ahead of the belt properly, a common problem with belted cases.

Have thought of getting one of these fancy looking body dies for belted magnum cases - has anyone tried them?

They do work. Read the instructions all the way through .

If I get four reloads from Magnum cases I'm happy.

LD

quote:

Originally posted by belaw:

quote:

Originally posted by WADE MASON:
I JUST BOUGHT A NEW SET OF RCBS DIES TO TRY THEM. THE PROBLEM IS AT THE BASE WHERE THE PRIMER POCKET TO THE EDGE OF THE CASE, ON THE BOTTOM OF THE CASE.THE CASE SLIDES IN PERFECTLY ON SIDES IN THE CHAMBER AND DIES BOTH.AFTER A FEW RELOADS THE CASE EXPANDS FROM THE PRIMER POCKET TO THE SIDE. THANKS

Are you saying that the rim diameter is increasing?

NO AT THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE CASE FROM THE PRIMER POCKET OUT IS EXPANDING.FOR A TEST WITH THE PRIMER OUT I SANDED OFF A FEW THOUSANDS OFF THE FLAT PART OF THE BASE WHERE THE #'S ARE ANDTHE BOLT CLOSED FINE.

quote:

Originally posted by stubblejumper:
If you are getting that much case head expansion,how are the primer pockets?If they are loose after a few loadings the load is too hot for the rifle,reguardless of what the manual says.

THE PRIMER POCKETS ARE FINE.IT'S FROM THERE TO THE EDGE THAT IS EXPANDING.MAYBE AFTER A FEW RELOADS I SHOULD THROW AWAY THE CASES. THANKS

Wade...under normal circumstances you should be able to get 6-7 or more reloads from a .338 case.

Something is wierd here....it's why I suspected over pressure loads.

quote:

Originally posted by lawndart:

quote:

Sounds like your dies are not resizing the case ahead of the belt properly, a common problem with belted cases.

Have thought of getting one of these fancy looking body dies for belted magnum cases - has anyone tried them?

They do work. Read the instructions all the way through .

If I get four reloads from Magnum cases I'm happy.

LD

THAT'S WHAT I'M THINKIN.I WAS WONDERING IF ANYBODY ELSE HAD THE SAME PROBLEM.GOOD TO HERE FROM SOMEBODY CLOSE BY TWIN FALLS.

Did you mausure the case after resizing?
How did you determine the OAL for a loaded round?

It kindof sounds like the cases have stretched and you could be jamming the mouth into, or the bullet is against, the lands. This could drastically affect the pressure. What Fjold is getting at is the shoulder may be needing to be bumped back a bit as well.

You need to figure out what's causing it because if it is a pressure related issue,(which is what it sounds like), this is a dangerous way to be using the gun!

What have you measured?

You shouldn't need to be sanding material off the head to make it fit. I'm on the sixth loading of my brass in my .338WM and have not had these troubles. I have trimmed the cases, and I full length size them. I also crimp in some heavily charged 250gr bullets and have no signs of pressure. I still think it has to do with case prep.
Be careful! This makes me nervous and I'm no where near you! Nate

Hey Wade, I have some great news for you. What ever is going wrong is probably a relatively minor issue.

I've been able to get 33 reloads out of 7mmRemMag cases using what I consider SAFE MAX Loads. That was simply a Test and not something I recommend though.

There is absolutely no reason at all that you should not be able to get 5-20 reloads per case once we get it figured out.
---

1. Take a couple of minutes and describe for the folks what you do with a Case once it has been shot and you are preparing it to be reloaded.

2. Describe how you went about "Setting-Up" your Resizing Die.

3. Are you using a Full Length Resizer?

4. Is the Shell Holder in the Press the same "Brand" as the Reloading Dies you are using?

5. Are you hunting in Dangerous Game country?

If you are getting that much case head expansion,how are the primer pockets?If they are loose after a few loadings the load is too hot for the rifle,reguardless of what the manual says.

quote:

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Wade;I have no more than 4-5 reloads with the .3338RUM.I use the chrono,the velocity was higher then listed.(1.5grs below max.),I back up 2grs (3.5grs below max.now),everything is fine now,I had socket pocket hole enlarged,lost of accuracy after 4 top 5 reloads...

quote:

Originally posted by BigNate:
Did you mausure the case after resizing?
How did you determine the OAL for a loaded round?

It kindof sounds like the cases have stretched and you could be jamming the mouth into, or the bullet is against, the lands. This could drastically affect the pressure. What Fjold is getting at is the shoulder may be needing to be bumped back a bit as well.

You need to figure out what's causing it because if it is a pressure related issue,(which is what it sounds like), this is a dangerous way to be using the gun!

What have you measured?

You shouldn't need to be sanding material off the head to make it fit. I'm on the sixth loading of my brass in my .338WM and have not had these troubles. I have trimmed the cases, and I full length size them. I also crimp in some heavily charged 250gr bullets and have no signs of pressure. I still think it has to do with case prep.
Be careful! This makes me nervous and I'm no where near you! Nate

Nate, For the OAL I Took a fired case and slightly dented the neck so the bullet wouldn't fall out and chambered it to the lands then went .015 farther to get OAL.So the bullet was .015 from the lands. Case prep: Full length resizing,then trim case to factory length. Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:
Hey Wade, I have some great news for you. What ever is going wrong is probably a relatively minor issue.

I've been able to get 33 reloads out of 7mmRemMag cases using what I consider SAFE MAX Loads. That was simply a Test and not something I recommend though.

There is absolutely no reason at all that you should not be able to get 5-20 reloads per case once we get it figured out.
---

1. Take a couple of minutes and describe for the folks what you do with a Case once it has been shot and you are preparing it to be reloaded.

2. Describe how you went about "Setting-Up" your Resizing Die.

3. Are you using a Full Length Resizer?

4. Is the Shell Holder in the Press the same "Brand" as the Reloading Dies you are using?

5. Are you hunting in Dangerous Game country?

First I full length resize.Then I trim the case to factory spec.Then clean and tumble the cases.That's when I check to make sure all with chamber.That's when i started finding a few cases that made the bolt hard to close.I didn't reload any of those cases.I started researching why they were doing this and noticed brass color on the end of the bolt where the bolt rubs the bottom of the case from primer out. THANKS FOR THE HELP

quote:

Originally posted by WADE MASON:
...First I full length resize.

How did you set-up your FL Die to Resize? Describe what you did.

quote:

Then I trim the case to factory spec. Then clean and tumble the cases.

When you FL Resized the case, don't you remove the Resizing Lube prior to Trimming? Or do you use FL Dies that do not require a Lube?

quote:

That's when I check to make sure all with chamber. That's when i started finding a few cases that made the bolt hard to close.

This is a good Step and you were correct for doing it at this time.

quote:

I didn't reload any of those cases.I started researching why they were doing this and noticed brass color on the end of the bolt where the bolt rubs the bottom of the case from primer out. ..

The "Brass" burnished onto your Bolt might or might not be significant at this point. But it is excellent that you noticed it.

To set up FL die I used RCBS shell holder and seated die to holder then backed off 1/2 turn.After I resized then I cleaned lube off cases before I trimmed cases. Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by WADE MASON:
To set up FL die I used RCBS shell holder and seated die to holder then backed off 1/2 turn.After I resized then I cleaned lube off cases before I trimmed cases. Thanks

If you backed off 1/2 turn then you are pushing the shoulder forward and not contacting the shoulder yet. The RCBS instructions say to contact the shell holder and screw the die in an additional 1/4 turn to get full length resizing.

quote:

That's when i started finding a few cases that made the bolt hard to close.I didn't reload any of those cases.I started researching why they were doing this and noticed brass color on the end of the bolt where the bolt rubs the bottom of the case from primer out.

Sounds like a pressure sign of brass flowing in the extractor groove.

Wade Mason your sizer is set correctly.1/2 turn before making contact is "too much .001".From your set up die,scew the diesby 1/32 turn at a time,continue until you feel light bolt closing,you will end up going back to the "same "fireformed case-head to the datum line on the case shoulder,meaning you are not backing up the shoulder yet(it is called Partial sizing).Now if cases are hard to chamber adjust die 1/32 turn down at a time(1/32 means back up the shoulder near .002"and so on...

Your sizer is not set correctly...

quote:

Originally posted by WADE MASON:
To set up FL die I used RCBS shell holder and seated die to holder then backed off 1/2 turn.After I resized then I cleaned lube off cases before I trimmed cases. Thanks

Hey Wade, The other guys are correct, the problem is with the way you have your Full Length Resizer Set Up. You are close to having it correct though.

One more question that you did not previously answer:
5. Are you hunting in Dangerous Game country?

If you are, you will be best served by Full Length Sesizing and here is the small change you need to make:

1. With nothing in the Press, insert the Shell Holder and raise the Ram.
2. Screw in the Full Length Resizing Die until it touches the Shell Holder.
3. Lower the Ram.
4. Screw the Full Length Resizing Die in another 1/4 turn and set the Die Body Lock Ring.

Now Lube a case you are having trouble with, run it through the Resizing operation, push the handle down so it "cams over" at the bottom of the stroke, lower the ram, remove the case, wipe off the Lube and try it in your rifle. That should fix it.

If you are not hunting in Dangerous Game Country, then you need to Partial-Full Length Resize the case. If that is the situation, don't move the Die until you let us know.
---

Your "problem" is just about solved.

This troubleshooting over the 'net isn't always an easy thing to do.

It does sound like what your doing in prep should be fine. Partial sizing is common. Although in a bigger case the advantages may be a mute point, especially in something like the .338WM. Partial sizing is a way to cheat a little to get the results similar to neck sizing only. I don't think backing the die away a half turn is for sure the problem, as you need to be able to see where the die does reach at that setting. Eliminate the possibility by adjusting the sizing die like rejpelly recommended. You need to measure the case neck after the bullet is seated as well. This should tell you how much a seated bullet is stretching the case mouth back out. If you are resizing full length and the cases dont chamber easily then they darn sure aren't going to get better when full. The empty case should chamber easily.

Are you crimping the bullets into the case?
If you are using the seater die to put a roll crimp on them the crimping stage can put a slight bulge at the shoulder if it isn't adjusted perfectly. Not that I can tell this is even a possibility at this point but I did it myself to a few cases when switching to a different bullet. I know first hand.

Have you fired any of these over a chronograph?
Was the bolt harder to cycle after you fired the round or about the same as before or when it was just the empty case?
Have you used this can of powder in other rifles/loads? How did it work there?( did you make it to book max?) How did the case mouths look after firing? Were they sooty?

Have you taken measurements to determine CHE?

The small things can each contribute to an overall effect. If this rifle is a factory rifle the chamber should be a standard size. If it is a custom barrel it may be a little tight. Combine that with partial sizing, a tight crimp, and a faster lot of RL19 than you were using before, and it adds up!

Please take your time sorting this out!

Take every measurement before and after. Determine CHE, if you shot over a chrono note the velocities.

There are people on here that have as much experience as I, and many with more. With enough info about the cases before and after each step, the guys on here should be able to help isolate the trouble.

I'd recommend writing down the dimentions requested for comparison. Answer the posted questions and try to be as specific as you can.
I think it may just be the cases are fitting really tight in the chamber.If the primer pockets are staying tight, the primers show no sign of high pressure, the velocities are low, the CHE measurements confirm there isn't flow, then you've gone through the steps recommended above you'll find your answer through the process. It's much easier to help when you can hold the cases in your hand. It's all in the details! Nate

Nate, this is a custom gun from the remington custom shop.The resized cases fit perfect into the chamber the sides aren;t the issue, the only problem is the flat part of the case where the 338 win mag #S are,the brass has expanded there.I have only had a few that this has happened to.When resizing i don't thing that part is resized in the shell holder. thanks for your info.

Wade,
If you want to borrow my fancy magnum case resizer for a couple months send me a PM. Every rifle has a mind of its own. What it should do and what it does do is like pheasant hunting; you know where the birds should be (and often are), but if one jumps up where it shouldn't be don't hesitate to shoot it.

lawndart

quote:

Originally posted by WADE MASON:
I CHECKED THE CASES AND THE BINDING IS AT THE BASE BETWEEN THE BASE AND THE BOLT.I TOOK A CASE THAT WAS BINDING AND SANDED OFF SOME OF THE BASE AND IT CLOSED FINE. THNAKS

Hey Wade

If you sanded off some of the case head then essentially what you did was decrease headspace by that much. If the case chambers easily at that point then that means your shoulder needed to be pushed back which means that you have pushed your shoulder forward during the resizing process. Again, like HC says

quote:

1. With nothing in the Press, insert the Shell Holder and raise the Ram.
2. Screw in the Full Length Resizing Die until it touches the Shell Holder.
3. Lower the Ram.
4. Screw the Full Length Resizing Die in another 1/4 turn and set the Die Body Lock Ring.

that will put you at PFLR or FLR and the shoulder will be pushed back far enough so that the cartridge will chamber easy.

Hey Wade, Did that fix your concern or what?

Just noticed Woods jumped in ahead of me and ALSO provided the correct answer for you:

quote:

Originally posted by Woods:
If you backed off 1/2 turn then you are pushing the shoulder forward and not contacting the shoulder yet. The RCBS instructions say to contact the shell holder and screw the die in an additional 1/4 turn to get full length resizing.

Nice going Woods, if I'd caught it earlier, I'd just have copied your post to Wade.

So how `bout it Wade? All fixed up now?

quote:

I've been able to get 33 reloads out of 7mmRemMag cases using what I consider SAFE MAX Loads.

You are Lucky.

Reloader

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:

Just noticed Woods jumped in ahead of me and ALSO provided the correct answer for you:

Nice going Woods, if I'd caught it earlier, I'd just have copied your post to Wade.

Had a good teacher, remember that post where you explained it all to me about a year and a half ago?

Seems like most of the problems that show up here are die adjustment related. Wish the manuals would give as good a description as we get here on the forums.

quote:

Originally posted by woods:
...Had a good teacher, ...

Hey Reloader, It was apparently due to an excellent match of RCBS Dies and a Ruger M77 chamber. And I was using SAFE MAX Loads of IMR-4831 with 150gr B-Tips and Fed-215s.

I had 3 cases in the Test and loaded them up. Walked out the back door where I was living then and shot them into a Target tacked to the end of a tree. Back in the house to clean and lube the rifle, and prep the cases for the next day.

The next day I'd load them up using P-FLR and repeat the process. Got 33 complete cycles with the 3 cases for 99 bullets.

Went to P-FLR them for the 34th run and got a Neck Split. I had not done any Annealing during the Test and have always wondered just how far it would have gone if I had Annealed them.

But, I agree I was "lucky" about how well the Dies and Chamber matched up.

I am learning something here.....................I am about to become a .338 winnie loader and I always followed the rule screw the die down until it touches the shell holder and then back off so there is a gap the thickness of a 10c piece and then you will have corret full length sizing have I been doing it wrong all these years ??

quote:

Originally posted by PC:
I am learning something here.....................I am about to become a .338 winnie loader and I always followed the rule screw the die down until it touches the shell holder and then back off so there is a gap the thickness of a 10c piece and then you will have corret full length sizing have I been doing it wrong all these years ??

Hey PC, Maybe and maybe not.

It depends on:
1. What you are trying to accomplish.
2. How your Resizing Die and Chamber dimensions work together.

If you are happy with the Feeding(it doesn't fight you to chamber a cartridge) then you may have it adjusted perfectly.
---

In Wade's situation, it appears to Woods(and a few others including me) that he only needed a bit more Resizing to eliminate his problem. Sure would be nice to hear back from him on it.

For your specific rifle, the same directions might create excessive Headspace and lead to short case life.

PC

Quoting from the instructions in the RCBS reloading die box:

"Screw the full length sizer die into the press until the die touches the shell holder when the shell holder is brought up to the top of the press stroke. be sure all play is removed from the press leverage system. To do this, adjust the die as above, lower the shell holder and set the die 1/8 to 1/4 turn frther down so the press cams over center. Set the large lock nut and you're ready to size."

Now, this will work on almost all factory chambers with any press that "cams over". Some presses may not, I think the Lee does not. I reloaded for a 240 Weatherby one time that had a large chamber and this setting was not correct for it. All the other guns I reload for I hit PFLR at about 1/8 to 1/4 turn past the shell holder. A Stoney Point Head & Shoulders Gauge is helpful in determining exactly when you have started to push the shoulder back.

Or, like HC says, you can chamber the case while making very small adjustments to the die and try to catch the adjustment where the hard crush fit becomes a slight crush fit.

Yep, It would be nice to hear what he did do and what the problem was. Nate

Thanks for the help folks.

quote:

I had 3 cases in the Test and loaded them up. Walked out the back door where I was living then and shot them into a Target tacked to the end of a tree. Back in the house to clean and lube the rifle, and prep the cases for the next day.

The next day I'd load them up using P-FLR and repeat the process. Got 33 complete cycles with the 3 cases for 99 bullets.

Went to P-FLR them for the 34th run and got a Neck Split. I had not done any Annealing during the Test and have always wondered just how far it would have gone if I had Annealed them.

But, I agree I was "lucky" about how well the Dies and Chamber matched up.

Nothing Wrong w/ That.

Reloader