OK - I've gotten my reloading kit tonight (.45 ACP), all setup, got my powder measured (4.9 grains), new primer in a clean case and the bullet seated.
Now, I'm measuring the length of the bullet overall. Lymans reloading manual states that the length should be 1.275", however mine is coming in at 1.224". How bad is this? It the reload usable, or should I continue trial and error with my bullet seating die to get the exact correct bullet measurement?
Also - I'm using IMR powder. Lymans states that 4.9 grains is the starting measurement. However the large majority of the case is empty with this amount of powder in it. Since this is my first reload I'm wondering if this is normal. My scale appears to be set correctly, but if I'm only using 4.9 grains per round it seems like I could reload ALOT of bullets with the 1/2 lb of powder I bought. So is this normal?
quote:Originally posted by t_bob38: Seat your bullet to the cannelure and crimp it there. The 1.275" length is a maximum length.
OK - I must be mis-understanding something - I thought the cannelure was the groove at the bottom of the cartridge; The way I read your post it sounds like a cannelure is a ring around the cartridge itself, up around where the bullet is.
Either way, it sounds like my length is fine. If 1.275 is the maximum and I'm only .05" shorter than the maximum I should be fine.
I would personaly crimp it just behind the cannalure. Tha ACP should be taper crimped and you won't get much of a crimp if the case mouth is on the cannalure. Bronson7
The Cannelure ring is a ring that goes around the bullet itself.. Your depth of 1.224 should be fine assuming it fits in your mag fine and chambers fine..
quote:Originally posted by t_bob38: First, it is quite normal for 4.9 grains of powder to leave a lot of room in the case. Don't worry, and don't try to fill it up.
Second. What bullet are you using? Does it have a cannelure?
Ah, I just re-read this. The bullet does NOT have a cannelure - I had misread this earlier and thought you were asking if I had a straight walled case - but I see that you were asking specifically about the bullet.
The Cannelure ring is a ring that goes around the bullet itself.. Your depth of 1.224 should be fine assuming it fits in your mag fine and chambers fine..
6.5 Bandit
Thanks! It did chamber just fine, although I had to resist the urge to test the new round in my apartment
The cannelure is a rolled "groove" on the bullet...it isn't on the case. The groove at the bottom of the case you are referring to is likely the extractor groove, for the extractor to "snap" into in order to be able to pull the spent cartridge out of the chamber.
The purpose of the cannelure is for crimping, but crimping doesn't absolutely have to go there. It is also not an absolute for seating depth.
A word about crimping the .45ACP. The cartridge headspaces on the mouth, so do not over crimp. This is important. It is also hard to be able to explain how much is enough crimp and how much is too much. My opinion is it is better to have not enough than too much, in this case. Headspace is critical. I barely put any crimp at all on my .45ACP's...
Seating depth really isn't a big deal, as long as the OAL isn't so long that it hinders operation. The best recomendation I have here is to try to seat as "long" as comfortable and does not affect operation. Generally, the bullet manufacturers place cannelures on their bullets in the correct location to give "proper" OAL...as suggested above, you can use that cannelure as an aid in determining your seating depth.
Edited...Looks like you guys got this figured out while I was typing!
progrmr, The .45 ACP, along with all semi pistol ammo, is a different breed of cat. I don't know how your ending up with the OAL your getting. It really isn't too important. OAL depends as much on weight and shape as anything else. Usually the maker of the bullet list the OAL best for the bullet. I don't know of a bullet intended for a pistol (read semiauto) that have a cannelure. These cases usually headspace on the mouth of the case. If a roll crimp is used you tamper with that headspace. A crimp that can be used is a taper crimp. This squeezes the case mouth into the bullet while it still leaves enough rim too headspace on.
IMHO Case volumn of most of todays older cartridges are base on the bulk of the powders available at the time of the design. Powders have changed so much in the past twenty years or so that performance can be achieved in much smaller cases. The newer short case magnums reflect this. The fact that your powder charge is much smaller than the volumn required to fill the case is of no importance. It maybe with very slow rifle powders but doesn't apply to pistols cases. Using a minimal load may cause functioning problems. You might be better off if you go to a charge in the middle of the suggested minimum and maximum charge.
I've had good results with the 200 grain Hornady XTP/HP bullet. You may want too take a look at it. Good luck.
Okay, you are using a Nosler 230 FMJ bullet, so the OAL should be between 1.190" and 1.275". You'll probably find that between 1.200" and 1.260" will function in your pistol best.
As for a crimp, the .45ACP does not use a roll crimp, but a mild taper crimp is required.
Your load of 4.9 of SR-7625 is on the very mild end of the spectrum...I have found that SR-7625 From 4.4 grains to 6.3 grains with CCI-300 Primer is the userful range.
When you have used up that pound of 7625 you might be interested in trying Power Pistol From 5.4 grains to 8.2 grains with the CCI-300 Primer.
Posts: 3282 | Location: Saint Marie, Montana | Registered: 22 May 2002
quote:Originally posted by ricciardelli: Okay, you are using a Nosler 230 FMJ bullet, so the OAL should be between 1.190" and 1.275". You'll probably find that between 1.200" and 1.260" will function in your pistol best.
As for a crimp, the .45ACP does not use a roll crimp, but a mild taper crimp is required.
Your load of 4.9 of SR-7625 is on the very mild end of the spectrum...I have found that SR-7625 From 4.4 grains to 6.3 grains with CCI-300 Primer is the userful range.
When you have used up that pound of 7625 you might be interested in trying Power Pistol From 5.4 grains to 8.2 grains with the CCI-300 Primer.
Excellent! Where did you get that information about the Nosler bullets?
and I'll be sure to mind the mild taper crimp as well. I'm using the LEE Carbide 3-die set and the seater die has a built in crimp.
Steve, looks like you just put one under your wing!!
progrmr, make a new friend at your local firearms/reloading supply house. It's best to have a good mentor when you are first starting the reloading hobby. Your reloading manual should also have some good reading in it that may be worthwhile. Good Luck, and be safe!!
PS - you won't find an aol(col) reference on a box of bullets. It's all in relation to which bullet you are using, and which firearm you're using it in. Ex: a .308 in a Browning lever action will have a different max oal(col) than the same load in a single shot Thompson Center Arms Encore, and maybe even a different measurement in a Remington 700.
Posts: 309 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: 31 December 2002
progrmr, save yourself a ton of time,and go to Steve's Pages to get a handle on reloading data, and basic knowledge. Incredibly, Steve's pet loads, have been the "right one" for all my stuff...sakofan..Welcome to the world of reloading, my man...Be careful...It's a slippery slope....
Posts: 1379 | Location: North Carolina | Registered: 11 March 2003
progrmr, A trick I learned is to seat and crimp in two seperate steps. Set the seating plunger down a ways and adjust from there so you seat but not crimp. Then take the plunger out completely and crimp. That way your brass isn't trying to bite into the bullet and slide up it at the same time. This will help a lot more if you ever roll crimp cast bullets.
quote:Originally posted by JTD: progrmr, I trick I learned is to seat and crimp in two seperate steps. Set the seating plunger down a ways and adjust from there so you seat but not crimp. Then take the plunger out completely and crimp. That way your brass isn't trying to bite into the bullet and slide up it at the same time. This will help a lot more if you ever roll crimp cast bullets.
Thanks - I'm going to reload alot tonight keeping all this great information in mind. Think I'll be going to the range tomorrow night to try my loads out. I hope they work good!
You may want to consider testing your load at the range before making too many copies, at least if you're using an auto. pistol. Some of them are a little picky about the ammo they require to cycle properly. I'd hate to see you load a large number of rounds only to discover that your pistol won't feed or eject them as it should.
quote:Originally posted by ricciardelli: Okay, you are using a Nosler 230 FMJ bullet, so the OAL should be between 1.190" and 1.275". You'll probably find that between 1.200" and 1.260" will function in your pistol best.
As for a crimp, the .45ACP does not use a roll crimp, but a mild taper crimp is required.
Your load of 4.9 of SR-7625 is on the very mild end of the spectrum...I have found that SR-7625 From 4.4 grains to 6.3 grains with CCI-300 Primer is the userful range.
When you have used up that pound of 7625 you might be interested in trying Power Pistol From 5.4 grains to 8.2 grains with the CCI-300 Primer.
Excellent! Where did you get that information about the Nosler bullets?
and I'll be sure to mind the mild taper crimp as well. I'm using the LEE Carbide 3-die set and the seater die has a built in crimp.
progrmr, I also just wanted to make sure you were aware that the Lee seating/crimp die applies a roll crimp rather than a taper crimp. They have a different die which applies a taper crimp -you have to buy that separately.
quote:Originally posted by Deutschlander: progrmr,
You may want to consider testing your load at the range before making too many copies, at least if you're using an auto. pistol. Some of them are a little picky about the ammo they require to cycle properly. I'd hate to see you load a large number of rounds only to discover that your pistol won't feed or eject them as it should.
Yea I've only done about 20 (no tumbler yet so cleaning cases is a pain!) and I'm heading to the range tonight. My loads should be fine - everything measures and I've fed a couple into the gun and they seem to fit fine.
I have to say - I bought the LEE Anniversary reloading kit for $65 - so far it really works GREAT! It's not fast, but it works just fine and was VERY inexpensive. Of course, I'll post more info after I shoot tonight and see what accuracy I wind up with.
quote:Originally posted by JAG: Ahhh and another gun-nut is born.
Congrats on the new hobby, hope your girlfriend/wife dont mind the all of the nights you will spend reloading searching for that perfect load.
Welcome to the race, JAG
Thanks!
I couldn't wait till after work so I went to the range during my lunch hour
My reloads performed perfectly - although I think the charge of 4.9 gr was a bit low. I did have some problems with spent cases not being extracted and causing a stovepipe, but I think that with a good cleaning of the extractor and a higher charge the rounds will be just right.
Also the accuracy did seem a bit better. Although the gun is new and I'm still learning how much trigger finger to use. The rounds grouped very tight, a bit high and mostly right of center from 25ft, standing isosceles at an indoor range.
I'm looking forward to me next batch of reloads, but my stupid case tumbler won't be in until Monday! So I think I'll be running some of my empties through the dishwasher tonight!
You really don't have to run the cases through the dishwasher. There is no need to tumble after every firing...just clean the primer pockets and go about your reloading...just up the charge...
Posts: 3282 | Location: Saint Marie, Montana | Registered: 22 May 2002
quote:Originally posted by ricciardelli: You really don't have to run the cases through the dishwasher. There is no need to tumble after every firing...just clean the primer pockets and go about your reloading...just up the charge...
Really? cool! I mean, I like the shiny brass so I can see any problems with the casing but without a tumbler cleaning the cases is VERY time consuming.
Stupid Cabelas.com - I ordered my tumbler yesterday at 10:16 from their online store with 2-3 day guaranteed shipping and now their saying it's not coming until Monday! That's BS and I'm gonna get some of my shipping money back.
I'm sorry if I confused you. What I meant when I said I didn't know how you were getting the OAL you were, I was referring to how your dies might be adjusted. When I said the bullet manufacturer was the best source for OAL info I assumed something I shouldn't have. Of course you know what happens when you "ASSUME". You make an "ASS" out of "U" and "ME". Since I own about thirty manuals, I assumed you did as well. What I should have said was that loading manuals by bullet manufacturers will list the OAL for each and every bullet they make.
Just too illustrate the care most members of this site exhibit for one another, T/C nimrod sent me a personal mail calling this boo-boo to my attention. I'm sure glad that he did so. Between old age and being a lousy typist, I some times take short cuts I shouldn't. I'll try not to do so again. Have a great week end.
I'm sorry if I confused you. What I meant when I said I didn't know how you were getting the OAL you were, I was referring to how your dies might be adjusted. When I said the bullet manufacturer was the best source for OAL info I assumed something I shouldn't have. Of course you know what happens when you "ASSUME". You make an "ASS" out of "U" and "ME". Since I own about thirty manuals, I assumed you did as well. What I should have said was that loading manuals by bullet manufacturers will list the OAL for each and every bullet they make.
Just too illustrate the care most members of this site exhibit for one another, T/C nimrod sent me a personal mail calling this boo-boo to my attention. I'm sure glad that he did so. Between old age and being a lousy typist, I some times take short cuts I shouldn't. I'll try not to do so again. Have a great week end.
Being new to reloading I only have 1 book (Lyman reloading manual) and I really don't want to purchase a manual from each bullet manufacturer I might load because I'm only loading for .45 ACP - seems like you're really paying for all the information in those manuals but if you're only using 1 bullet all the other data in the book is pretty much useless !!
Thanks for the clarification though - and I certainly appreciate the care and guidance of those on this website that are more experienced than I! (that would be just about everybody )
progrmr Ohh you say that right now but you've got the reloading flu and you will load different bullets and use different powders and you'll definately need more manuals!!! Oh by the way there's no cure know to man for this flu!!! It also usually leads to the "I need another gun flu" as well!!!
I also reload for the 45 ACP. I understand your thoughts about one manual. I just recently got back into reloading after a six year break. (Military won't let use have dangerous things in the barraks) I only have one manual, but I can tell you I wish I had more. There are companies always coming out with new components or powders. An example of this is Winchester's WXR powder, that replaced WMR. You can't find that one in Speer's #13. I would agree with you on the most part, that one manual is fine for beginning but sooner or later you might need a new one or more. Not to mention most data is interchangeable. i.e. a 230 gr. FMJ will use almost the same loads no matter who makes it. Anyway have fun.
P.S. keep the tumbler in a back room that the wife/girlfreind does not go by when it is in use.
Posts: 26 | Location: Slidell LA | Registered: 02 June 2003
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Oh by the way there's no cure know to man for this flu!!! ![[Eek!]](images/icons/shocked.gif){kind=icon}
It also usually leads to the "I need another gun flu" as well!!! ![[Roll Eyes]](images/icons/rolleyes.gif){kind=icon}
