How are they working for deer hunters? I've only shot two deer so far and both have been shoulder breaking kills. One drt and the other went maybe 40 yds. Does it seem like with the controlled expansion vs the way NP's pretty much totally expand, loose most of the front half with the rear core punching on thru.....that the AB's don't get the pass thru's with shoulder bone shots? I used NP's for years and judged all other bullets against their performance. Shoulder shots on large northern deer always resulted in pass thrus while both AB's have stopped in the deer. Not suggesting bullet failure......I think they work great....but maybe the NP's were better for blood trailing compared to the new AB's. I shoot them at lower velocities (2800fps) and their accuracy seduced me away from the paritions that always produced an exit wound. I know two examples are far from a pattern but I never experienced a NP that failed to exit a deer broadside, even into the shoulder. I'm thinking that the price for those ragged cloverleafs might be a lot less blood sign to follow up here in the wet bogs where I hunt. I figure a behind the shoulder shot thru the slats would probably exit more than not but shoulder shots seem less likely to produce two holes to bleed from. Both deer were large (200#+) but I notice a lot of AB mushroom pics being posted on hunting sites.....I never had a NP bullet to take a pic of........others thoughts and opinions.....

Dave

From the posts I’ve seen there is a mixed review on the Accu-bonds. Like the Ballistic-Tip it boils down to speed. People shooting very fast cartridges are less happy than the people shooting traditional cartridges.

I've shot four deer (two mule deer and two whitetails) with 160 grain Accubonds in a 7 mm WSM. All have been one shot kills. Shots ranged from 40 yards to 220 yards. The bullet that killed my last deer transited at least three feet diagonally through the animal and smashed the opposing shoulder before piling up under the skin. It is the only bullet recovered so far. I would say that the Accubonds perform as expected, even at 3000 fps muzzle velocities.

My son has killed probably a dozen deer in the last few years with Winchester Supreme 140 gr Accubond and has had great results. He has killed two this season (one this morning) and neither has gone over 10 yards. Every one, he has killed have left easy to follow blood trails, but most have fallen within sight of where they were shot.

In a lot of years of shooting deer I've come to prefer exit holes.....take it from there.

So far I'd advise of heavy-for-caliber bullets and also I've yet to recover an A-Frame or a Northfork bullet.

It seems the particians work for you.

Dave,

Here is an exit hole in a 170 lb buck hit at 150 yds with a 140 Accubond started from a 270 WSM. I find the Accubonds penetrate better than the 140 Ballistic Tips.

quote:

In a lot of years of shooting deer I've come to prefer exit holes.....take it from there.

So far I'd advise of heavy-for-caliber bullets and also I've yet to recover an A-Frame or a Northfork bullet.

It seems the particians work for you.

Yes I in no way meant my thread to sound like a pounding on AB's......they have done their job for me. Its more that like vapodog I really depend on an exit hole to help with blood trailing when or if required. Hunt really wet and thick areas where if theres no snow you can really loose em fast without blood to help. The paritions were good 1 1/2" bullets while the AB's were sub 1/2"........I liked them groups a lot and thought they might be the ticket. I'm a slightly high center shoulder shooter that always hits bone with most shots. Slower velocity rounds just don't seem able to fully penetrate like I'm used to. Switching to a 260 from the 308 next year so maybe the exits will start to happen.......if not I suppose I should just go back to the bullet that has served me so well for so many years. I believe its simply the fact that the larger expansion of the AB's tend to slow faster and are just less likely to punch on thru. Thanks for the replies...

Dave

I can say this about the Accubond:
they shoot just like the Ballistic tip;
the 200 grain .308" when launched from my 30-06 hasn't been recovered;
the same bullet when launched from my 300 H&H hasn't been recovered either, but it does leave a bigger hole.

Would I recommend this bullet? You Bet!

140gr Accubonds out of my 270WSM at 3100 have stomped/stopped every deer and hog I have shot with it including the biggest buck (body weight)I have ever shot two weekends ago. Shots have been from under 50 yards to over 300 on over 10 deer and 10 pigs over the past 4 years. Accubonds are great and way better (imho) than the ballistic tips. Are accubonds the best bullet out there it would be almost impossible to say.

The guys I load NABs for and myself have all been very pleased with the performance on dozens of animals ranging from whitetail and pigs to mulies and elk.

IMO they perform like a partition but, provide better BCs, better accuracy, and you don't have deformed tips in the mag.

I'm not saying they are the best, but they are darn good bullets and all a man needs for NA game. I feel they are the best designed premium bullet for the hunter that wants everything in his hunting bullets: Accuracy, Good BC, Durability......

Good Luck

Reloader

quote:

the way NP's pretty much totally expand, loose most of the front half with the rear core punching on thru

for what it's worth, this is what they were designed to do.

quote:

for what it's worth, this is what they were designed to do.

Exactly my point. For anyone that feels I'm in some way putting down the AB's performance, I'm not. Couldn't be further from the truth, I understand how both the NP and AB are designed to expand. My point is simply that you can push a smaller frontal area bullet farther thru a deer when starting both at the same velocity. Seems the same load starting at a basic 2800fps and being sent into the same basic porition of a whitetail "in my experience and my experience only" sends the NP on thru more consistantly (and out) than the larger expanded AB. Thats all........I see that some are getting pass thrus......maybe more velocity - heavier bullet weight - not directly into large shoulder bone - different caliber - or maybe just having better luck with exit holes than I with the same bullet. I happen to like nosler bullets above all others for my deer hunting....maybe I just have to choose between stellar accuracy and consistant exits holes in my application. I was just hoping for both in the same package if possible. Talking to nosler has confirmed that the AB's will produce a larger wound channel and with their design the NP may just travel a little further thru due to smaller frontal area (by design). The AB is the most accurate non match bullet I've yet to shoot.....I haven't give up yet, the 6.5 caliber may just do the trick. Nosler felt the 30 caliber 150grain would be less likely to penetrate as far as the 130 grain 6.5 caliber I'm going to....all other things roughly the same. Thanks

Dave

Hey Dave, Thanks for posting about the "Lack of Exits". I want Exits from the Bullets I use too.

Are you talking about a 150gr Accubond in a 308Win? And how far away from the Deer at Impact?

Great first-hand info.

I've shot two big deer (250#+)this year with a 280 shooting 140 Accubonds at 2800FPS muzzle velocity. In both cases the bullet was just under the skin on the far side. Range was about 90 to 100 yards. Heart and lungs were destroyed and both deer staggered about 25 yards and fell over. If you want a pass through this might not be the best option. Personally I love the way it shoots and what it does to the deers heart/lung area. I'm switching to them in my 06 and 6.5x55!

This year I have killed 3 deer so far with 180gr. Accubonds and 2 elk. They have been an outstanding bullet for me, one of the elk was 340 yds, DRT.The deer have been less that 200yds,one was 75 yds away, Exit holes on all shots. I'm using a 300win and if there is a problem with deer there is a little more blood shot meat than I would like, but rib meat id not much good anyway.

I am simply amazed by the number of shooters who don't get pass throughs, with any bullet! I have only had 3 in north of 400 game animals taken.

These included a BT at very close range, just last year, rib on entry--270 Win 130 gr. NBT with full house loads at about 25 yards, bullet found just under skin on off side, deer down like a sack of rocks.

The other 2 were a 30 cal 180 gr. failsafe at about 100 yards on a huge (250lbs) hog, stem to stern shot, found in rear ham, at bone socket. The third was a NPT (Perish the thought!) on a quartering shot on a regular old Ga. whitetail, 30-06, factory ammo, borrowed rifle, bullet shank found in rear ham.

I've killed or been with folks who killed animals, (mostly whitetails) that number over a hundred, with AB's and they have been 100% in pass throughs, but that doesn't surprise me, that had been the case for a boatload of animals with NBT's for me until last year, and I think that BT was clearly out of it's design envelope with a full tilt load at point blank range in that instance, and the deer was just DRT, so OK by me.

I agree with Reloader, I think the AB is tougher than the NBT by a good bit, and it is designed to work a lot like the NPT according to Nosler, which I think it does. My typical AB performance has been caliber size entries, and nickel or slightly larger size exits--just perfect to me, these exits are larger than those I typically have seen with Partitions, supporting the statements that the AB retains a larger 'mushroom' as opposed to an NP that maybe has lost all of it's front and has just the 'shank' penetrating through the animal.

For what it's worth, I've had a lot of partitions NOT loose all their front, and penetrate just fine, I quantify that by seeing larger than caliber exits many times, and no evident bullet parts remaining behind......

Good shooting--Don

Both cases were 308 150 grain AB's.......one was 60-70 yds the other about 25 yds. Up here you hardly ever get long shots because of thick cover. In both cases the deer would have been about 225# live weight and one was directly broadside while the other was quartering to me slightly and below me as I was up in a stand a ways. I always use a slightly high shoulder shot to keep tracking to a minimum and the reason I moved to NP's many years ago. The longer shot was a drt instantly with a broken near side shoulder with no exit wound. The second this year was a bit of a downward and back angle with a broken shoulder, totally jellied near lung, punched the diaphram, and then traveled into the stomach where it stopped. In both cases we're talking at least 20" of penetration after hitting and breaking shoulder bone. The second deer took a bit of looking as it lost almost no blood and traveled into quite a thicket of regrowth fir and spruce (couldn't see your feet below you as you pushed along) I almost fell over the buck about 45-50yds away from where he was shot. If I had been in open hardwoods or a flowage perhaps I would have seen him drop but I rarely hunt such areas as the bigger bucks always seem a couple bounds at most from real thick stuff after the opening day influx of orange. I've been cruising the forums looking for posts about the real experiences of those using AB's and the campfire has some real long extensive posts concerning radically different results by hunters using them (very interesting reading). I really liked the accuracy (I went from ho hum 1 1/2" NP accuracy with my best reloads to a best 1/4" and average 3/8" groups with the AB's) that, and the tips not deforming in the blind magazine was the reason I left a working load with zero problems for many years and tried something new. I know it doesn't take sub MOA accuracy to shoot deer size targets.......but man does it feel good to see ragged cloverleafs after a load working session with a good accurate rifle. Nosler felt the various calibers and weights being used along with impact velocity have a lot to do with the mixed results, I believe when I switch to a 260 that penetration will improve and I may just see those exits start to appear. Than again the 260 may just shoot NP's quite well and the whole bullet switch may become a moot point. I like the concept of BT accuracy coupled with NP performance, it appeals to me. Like I said I'm not done testing (problem is I can only legally shoot one deer per year) thats why my post here, to hear what results you guys are getting and seeing also. I would be a happy camper if I start seeing exits the size of the ones pictured along with that sweet accuracy. Thanks to all for the feedback.

Dave

Hey Dave, Thank you for such a thorough follow-up post. Lots of excellent "CSI" info in your data.

Lots of folks on here love the 260Rem and 6.5mms of all types. I've not had one, so can't comment on them.
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A buddy of mine used the old white box 150gr PP Winchester ammo in his 30-06s for many years. As he became better at being unseen in the woods/swamps, his shots started getting closer. He mentioned it to me about two years before he began to quit having Exits.

Seafire champions "slower" velocity(downloaded) Cartridges because of their ability to penetrate Deer. He is absolutely correct that a bullet which typically will not make an Exit has a better opportunity to do so at a slightly Lower Impact Velocity.

But since my buddy did not Reload, he seemed to be trapped. We talked about it and I mentioned he might want to try the same white box Winchesters, but with the 165gr PPs. His Exits returned and the problem was solved.

If you want to keep using the excellent 308Win, you might consider trying the 165gr Accubond. It should be just a bit slower and should have a bit more Sectional Density. And I'd guess the Ballistic Coefficient would be a bit higher as well. So, you might not give up much Trajectory at the longer distances and pick up Exits when close.

But..., I've not used an Accubond, so that could be full of Beans.

Best of luck to you and Welcome Aboard!

I was just reading an article about Snipers wanting a more effective bullet than the match kings when encountering something between them and the target, such as a windshield or glass window...

IN their testing, their was a big impression with the TSX Barnes and the AccuBond from Nosler...

They showed where they didn't have the yaw once hitting the windshield that the Match Kings do... and they also found that they penetrated the "targer" better, without flying thru them and they having to worry about potential down range collateral damage.....
I don't know if some of you folks consider that relivant to the subject, but I thought it was an interesting article....

They had many good things to say about Ballistic Tips also...

quote:

If you want to keep using the excellent 308Win, you might consider trying the 165gr Accubond. It should be just a bit slower and should have a bit more Sectional Density. And I'd guess the Ballistic Coefficient would be a bit higher as well. So, you might not give up much Trajectory at the longer distances and pick up Exits when close.

Good point and could easy make the difference, again I let the accuracy get the better of common sense and didn't continue with any 165 load work after the out of the gate sucess with the 150's. Got a box of 165 NP's and AB's sitting in the reloading bench untouched. After the holidays when I start with the 260 I will see what I can get out of the 165's. I will say this from hands on experience.......the AB's shoot like match bullets for me and they do not come apart even after hard bone contact at close range. Seafires been sharing some good wisdom with me on the newest 260 direction.

Dave

I've shot 3 roe with the 140gr AB out of my 7x57 at a MV of 2,800fps.

One was a buck at 60yards, the bullet passed between 2 ribs on the way in and showed a just over calibre sized hole on the way out. The buck was hit in both lungs and went quite a long way - evidence I thought of a tough bullet.

The next shot was a headshot on a doe at 200yards (sorry Hot Core but the darn thing couched for the day after an arduous stalk) nothing left between the ears... the fawn stood up and received a lung shot again at 200yards causing the biggest hole in the ribs I have EVER seen in a deer (maybe 7" diameter) and that with no contact on the shoulder...

Very small sample - I shall no doubt use them for a long time as I have 100 left but I am a little ambivalent.