I am actually not a new reloader. I have reloaded 45 ACP for a few years now. But I believe that reloading for rifle is a bit more complicated.
I want to start reloading 308 for a semiauto AR10 rifle, and a Steyr bolt action rifle. All of my shooting is at a range. I like to make small groups. That's it. No hunting or anything. I want to make ammo at least as good as Federal Match 308.
I have thousands of questions, and bet you've heard it too often. I'll ask some here, but if there is a single book or FAQ that would be better, that works too (although I like other people saving me time - I am lazy).
1) I have saved a lot of brass. I have both Federal Match and some military. Which should I use and why? Also, does it matter which rifle was used to fire it the first time?
2) I have a Dillon 550 press. Which are the best dies for this? I am willing to pay more for dies that reduce work (did I mention I am lazy?) or produce better quality ammo. I won't pay more for a name.
3) What additional brass prep is required compared to simple cleaning for 45 ACP? Do I need a swager? Do I need to measure every case for every reload?
4) Are there good sources on the internet to purchase supplies and stuff so I don't have to go to the store (did I mention I am lazy?).
5) Any recommendations on first timer bullets and powder mix for the type of ammo I wish to produce?
Thanks.
James
quote:
Originally posted by jimmybcool:
Hello,I am actually not a new reloader. I have reloaded 45 ACP for a few years now. But I believe that reloading for rifle is a bit more complicated.
I want to start reloading 308 for a semiauto AR10 rifle, and a Steyr bolt action rifle. All of my shooting is at a range. I like to make small groups. That's it. No hunting or anything. I want to make ammo at least as good as Federal Match 308.
I have thousands of questions, and bet you've heard it too often. I'll ask some here, but if there is a single book or FAQ that would be better, that works too (although I like other people saving me time - I am lazy).
1) I have saved a lot of brass. I have both Federal Match and some military. Which should I use and why? Also, does it matter which rifle was used to fire it the first time?
2) I have a Dillon 550 press. Which are the best dies for this? I am willing to pay more for dies that reduce work (did I mention I am lazy?) or produce better quality ammo. I won't pay more for a name.
3) What additional brass prep is required compared to simple cleaning for 45 ACP? Do I need a swager? Do I need to measure every case for every reload?
4) Are there good sources on the internet to purchase supplies and stuff so I don't have to go to the store (did I mention I am lazy?).
5) Any recommendations on first timer bullets and powder mix for the type of ammo I wish to produce?
Thanks.
James
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born on a mountain, raised in a cave, hunting and fishing is all i crave!
1. The Federal match is pretty good stuff but there may be some concern that you have brass from several different lots which may vary some in capacity. Unless the military brass is good match quality I would shuck it.
If money is not a big concern I would start fresh with a quantity of Lapua brass. No, at this time is does not matter which gun the brass has been fired in. However, you need to keep it separate from here on out.
2. I have never used the Dillon press.
3. If you are really serious about "small groups" here's the drill. a)Clean and full length size the cases (make sure your die is properly squared in the press). b)Uniform primer pockets, de-burr flash holes. c)Trim cases to a uniform length. d)turn case necks just enough to true them up. e)de-burr and champher case mouths. f)Sort cases by weight discarding any that vary from the mean by more than 10% NOTE: If you are starting with new brass it should be once fired in the rifle you are going to use it in before all this prep is done. If by swager you mean primer pocket swager -- yes if you are going to use the military cases. If by measure every case you mean measure every case for length every time it is reloaded -- no, case trimming is a periodic thing (usually every five or six loadings probably less often than that with the 308). NOTE: Steps b, d & f are one time only. Step c as I said is periodic and step e occurs only after c is performed.
4. http//www.lockstockbarrel.com & http//www.precisionreloading.com are just two of many.
5. There are lots of good bullets out there but I would start with Sierra Matchkings. As for powders, I have never owned a 308 so I really can't make a recommendation.
All of the case prep I described is not really necessary just to reload a rifle cartridge and is pretty time consuming. Also, the dividends are pretty small unless your rifles are very accurate to begin with. However, if you are shooting 3/4" groups now and shrinking them to 1/2" or maybe even 1/4" turns you on then it is probably worthwhile.
Find a good publication or instructional video on the subject. I'm sure some of the other members can recommend some.
Good luck and have fun.
[This message has been edited by Mike M (edited 09-16-2001).]
I would probably follow the advice to toss the milsurp stuff.
As for dies, I like to use inline seaters. Matter of fact, that is all I use.
As for supplies, Sinclair International.
Make sure you segregate the rounds you make for the styer from the AR10. Because in the Steyr you can do a technique called neck sizing, the AR10 you cannot. Bolt guns are far better to load for IMHO, due to the fact that they are more forgiving of a "tight" case and a load that is set at some point close to the lands (overlong).
As for powder, listen to your rifle. It will group well with some and less well with others. And do not think that just because Person X won 10 bench-gun competitions with a Y charge of Z brand powder that you should neccessarily emulate that. Listen to your rifle.
Get a good set of calipers and mic. Stainless steel. NOT plastic.
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Safety & Ethics,Accuracy, Velocity, Energy
Joe M
Enjoy-- good shooting. A.
You may want to look into a runout gage to measure concentricity. When I started to reload, bullet runout killed my accuracy and drove me nuts. When this problem was solved, little tiny groups became the norm.
My gage is an RCBS Casemaster(Sinclair International, $70 ).
As usual, the other folks on the forum have got everything else covered.
Good Luck
ZM
Some good advise already. I would at least use the same lot of new match grade brass for both rifles, and seperate the brass after shooting to stay with each rifle. The Dillon will definately make accurate loads, don't waste your money buying another press. All the recent service rifle champs that I'm aware of use Dillon. For at least the AR-10, I would try Win 748. It always worked well with gas operated semi-autos, M-1 Garands and M-14's. I would also try Sierra Matchkings in both guns. If it won't shoot Sierra's, it won't shoot. Weight will depend on barrel twist rate on the rifles-hopefully they are close to the same (?). As said earlier, you can neck size the bolt gun, but I really wouldn't neck size the AR-10. A failure to feed in a match can be devistating, more costly than any possible accuracy improvement. I use RCBS competition dies with success, I've seen good results with Redding as well. A side note of importance- Keep a seperate notebook for each rifle you load for. Keep detailed notes in each book. That way you can keep track of loads, bullet weights, seating depths, accuracy's, velocities, temperature at range time, paste cutouts of target groups, etc. You don't want to get mixed up on what load did what in which rifle. No sense having to re-learn what you've learned. My 2 cents.