Hi guys, I recently reloaded some once fired 22-250 brass. I noticed that on most of them I had to use more pressure than I liked to close the bolt. I recently read on another post that it could be the dies. I used an L.E. Wilson gauge on the brass after resizing and they looked fine. I am currently using an older set of Lyman dies. They were given to me by a co-worker, who bought them used, so I don't know how much use they really have seen. I was wondering if it would be possible for the dies to cause this problem?

Try chambering an empty case & see how it feels. You don't say anything about how the dies are adjusted, are you full length sizing or only partial sizing, etc. If the empty, sized case chambers easily, you could be loading your bullets out too far & contacting the lands, the expander could be pulling the neck/shoulder out enough to cause the extra chambering force.

It's extremely unlikely that the dies are worn to the point of excess headspace....I've never seen that in my life.

Was this once fired brass from the rifle you are loading for or from some generic rifle? Did you trim brass length,chamfer and seat the bullets properly for your rifle? Are the primers seated properly?
Usually brass that meets the Wilson gage requirements will not have problems chambering. How does the brass from your rifle fit the Wilson gage prior to resizing?

I am full length sizing the brass because this started out as a joint reloading endeaver. The brass was fired from 2 different rifles. I will try chambering a resized piece from the batch that did not chamber easily & a piece that has been resized but not reloaded. I did trim the brass to spec after sizing & I am seating the bullet to the max overal COL listed in the latest Nosler manual. I mounted the size die in my press just to look things over after firing the rounds in question. The threaded stem for the expander looked questionable. Like it was crooked. I am going to look into that, it may have been the shoulder. Thanks for the response & any other ideas or suggestions are welcome.

not knowing your load I saw once where a compressed load was so compressed that it warped the case a bit (also the guy couldn't get the bullet seated very deep or it would pop back out)

I would suggest keeping your brass seperated. Also true up the expander ball. If you are unfamiliar with this technique and can not find it on this forum one of us will be glad to assist.
For shits and giggles the next cartridge that gives you difficulty chambering. Do not fire it. Remove and mark it. Check it on the Wilson gage and if all looks fine then try seating the bullet deeper. Good luck and keep us posted.

Well guys, I checked out the expander & straightened it in the die. I resized a piece of brass & tried to chamber it. It chambered the same as before. It will slide into the chamber fine, I feel more resistance than normal when closing the bolt. I also made sure that the chamber was clean, to rule that out. I am going to try resizing a piece of brass with the expander removed & see how it chambers. If there is no change I am going to borrow another F.L. sizer from a buddy to rule out the die in question. I will post my findings as soon as I have any.

Two things come to mind, one, as another poster said, is the brass trimmed properly?

Second, it is possible that your rifle has a short, bare minimum chamber, and the die just won't push the shoulder back enough. I have run into this many times. I chamber my own barrels, and headspace to a go-gauge, no more. Sometimes dies won't size the way they should. You can have the die bottom shortened so the case will go in further before it hits the shell holder, or you can have some of the shell holder top removed. Either way, you are doing the same thing, getting the case further into the die.

But check the brass length first!

Well guys, I just tried a brand new Forster bench rest full length size die, adjusted all the way down to the shell holder. The result was the same.

Hey hvy barrel, I'd suggest your Shell Holder may not match up well with your Dies, or even though you are screwing the Die in to "touch the Shell Holder" you are not allowing for a minute amount of stretch in the Press Linkage.

1. With no Dies in the Press, insert the Shell Holder and raise the Ram.
2. Go back to the Lyman Die and screw it into the press until it touches the Shell Holder and lower the Ram.
3. Screw the Die into the Press another 1/4 turn and set the Lock Ring.
4. Lube a case you are having a problem with, squash it, wipe it dry and try it.

If it now closes with just a slight bit of resistance, you have achieved Zero Headspace. Benefits include the best possible accuracy from those cases and you will get the longest case life. This is Partial-Full Length Resizing(P-FLR).

If the bolt closes with no resistance, you are now Full Length Resizing(FLR) and this is the method that should be done on all cases which will be carried in Dangerous Game country. FLR does have a slight bit of Headspace and you need to watch for Casehead Separations after 3-4 firings.

If the bolt still closes too hard, you can try an adding another 1/4 turn in step #3, then repeat step #4.

If that does not correct the problem, remove the Shell Holder from the Press and measure it from top to bottom with your 0.001" Caliper. Then using a large flat file, remove a couple of thousandths from the top of the Shell Holder. Then repeat steps 1-4.

Keep removing metal from the Shell Holder until you get it where you can actually Full Length Resize with your Die, then set it to P-FLR.

Best of luck to you.

If you are adjusting the die down to the shell holder, then it is not usually correct for partial full length or full length resizing. The RCBS die instructions say that they need to be adjusted 1/4 turn past where it contacts the shell holder. If you do not turn it far enough then it will not contact the shoulder and push it back. Meanwhile, during the resizing process you have pushed the shoulder forward while squeezing the case walls back to size.

If I take any of the cases for any of my calibers and adjust the die just down to the shell holder, it will make any of them hard to chamber. They all have to have the die adjusted about 1/4 turn past. The way to do it is to have your rifle out, adjust the die down to the shell holder, resize, chamber the case and notice amount of resistance to closing bolt. Thread die a small amount further in and repeat above process. When the amount of pressure necessary to close the bolt lessens, that is partial full length, a small amount more and it is full length resizing.



Without guns we are subjects, with guns we are citizens



I see Hot Core beat me to it, must have been typing the same time as me.

quote:

Originally posted by hvy barrel:
Well guys, I just tried a brand new Forster bench rest full length size die, adjusted all the way down to the shell holder. The result was the same.

All the way down to the shell holder,you dont resize enough deep?? with this method,go dowm by 1/4 or 1/3 turn.Why do adjust your die" just touching "the shell holder,another method,( I think you are between the two, bad spot) adjust your die at first just touching the shell holder,then back it up 1/4 turn,then carefully adjust it by 1/16tour down at the time,will come a spot that it will chamber with "moderate bolt lifting".you FL sizer is not set correctly...

quote:

Originally posted by hvy barrel: I did trim the brass to spec after sizing & I am seating the bullet to the max overal COL listed in the latest Nosler manual.

Try adjusting your COL down some. The Nosler manual list only the max SAAMI COL for a given cartridge which isn`t a lenght that will fit all chambers. They test all their loads at the longest lenght that will fit a rifles magizine. I bet you`re jamming the bullet in the lands and that`s the stiffness you feel when closing the bolt.

I'm betting on brass from two different rifles as being the culprit. Begging or borrowing a set of SB dies would determine whether or not that is the problem, and then segregating cases will take care of it, of course...
And if that isn't the cause, it almost has to be a rifle that is chambered extremely short. All you guys have talked at length about how to adjust the sizer die down, so that can't be the issue. And Ol' Joe has discussed COL. I think all the bases are covered.
Best of luck to you, guy! Let us all know what you find out.

Size a case with the decapping stem removed and try in the rifle. If it goes in easily reinsert the decapping-expanding stem and lube the inside of the case neck. Try again. You may be pulling the shoulder forward a bit if not enough lube in the case neck. Hope this helps.

I had a gunsmith check the headspace & give the rifle a good once over. Everyting looked ok. I am going to try again & just keep an eye on the brass.

What reloading press are you using I had a similar problem using a Lee hand press on 7mm rem mag bras. The press would spring enough that I couldn’t size the brass enough. My friend had a similar problem with some brass he bought on the internet once fired he needed a small base die to solve the problem.

The simplest thing to try is buy some new factory loaded shells and try them in your rifle. If they fit and function properly you will know it is a problem with the resizing process. Also as stated earlier don't mix your brass if shot in a different gun. The chamber size will very enough sometimes to cause a real headache.

Usually only neck sizing is necessary if shot in a single shot or bolt action rifle not so with an automatic most of the time.

Good luck.....

Hot Core's response is one of the best I've seen to any question posed on this forum. I'll have to pay more attention to his posts.

I am back & I have news. First of all, I am using an RCBS Rockchucker press.
After talking things over with the gunsmith I went back & loaded some rounds. I trimmed the brass to 1.892" & loaded 5 rounds with 28gr of IMR 3031. Then loaded 5 more increasing the load by a half grain until I hit 30gr. The chambering problem seems to have gone away, for the most part. I still had a few rounds that were just slightly tight. I think that the brass must have been too long, just barely. I had one group at .654" & another at .314". I was very surprised by that, so I am going do that whole test again & see if it will duplicate or if I messed something up.
Thanks for all the help.

Hey Hvy Barrel--eliminate all the variables that you can. Using brass from only one rifle is the first thing to do. And, expect the brass to "grow" with multiple firings/reloadings, so you have to periodically trim back. I usually just put the brass in my recycle bucket after 5-6 reloadings.

Also, have any of us thought about a chamber cut with an old, worn-down reamer (minimum size chamber) and a sizing die cut with a brand new unworn one (maximum size die)? Everything within SAAMI specs but still a problem.