Following the lead of Hot Core, I've decided to stir things up around here.

To me a cartridge is just right if it can move a bullet which is appropriate to the caliber and has a decent sectional density approx .250 at a easily attainable muzzle velocity between 2900 and 3100 fps. This is my own definition and of course subject to debate, however this is how it shakes out:

From 243 to 375 RUM using velocity from Nosler #5 (subtracting 50 fps for short barrel, slow barrels, not loading too close to max, etc.)

Overbore
240 Wtby / 100 gr bullet /.242 SD / 3300 fps
257 Wtby / 115 gr bullet / .249 SD / 3385 fps
264 win mag / 125 gr bullet / .256 SD / 3130 fps
270 WSM / 140 gr bullet / .261 SD / 3135 fps
270 Wtby / 140 gr bullet / .261 SD / 3245 fps
7 rem mag / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 3200 fps
7 Wtby / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 3215 fps
7 STW / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 3250 fps
300 Wtby / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 3150 fps
30-378 Wtby / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 3210 fps
300 RUM / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 3175 fps
340 Wtby / 210 gr bullet / .250 SD / 3175 fps
338 RUM / 225 gr bullet / .281 SD / 3175 fps
338-378 Wtby / 225 gr bullet / .281 SD / 3170 fps

Just Right
243 / 100 gr bullet / .242 SD / 3095 fps
25-06 / 115 gr bullet / .249 SD / 3065 fps
6.5x55 / 125 gr bullet / .256 SD / 2950 fps
260 rem / 125 gr bullet / .256 SD / 2985 fps
6.5x284 / 125 gr bullet / .256 SD / 3075 fps
6.5-06 / 125 gr bullet / .256 SD / 3070 fps
270 win / 140 gr bullet / .261 SD / 2970 fps
280 rem / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 2950 fps
7 SAUM / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 2990 fps
300 SAUM / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 2910 fps
300 H & H / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 2975 fps
300 WSM / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 3030 fps
300 Dakota / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 3050 fps
300 win mag / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 3100 fps
8 rem mag / 200 gr bullet / .274 SD / 3000 fps
338 win mag / 210 gr bullet / .250 SD / 2970 fps
330 Dakota / 210 gr bullet / .250 SD / 2940 fps
358 STA / 225 gr bullet / .251 SD / 3030 fps
378 Wtby / 260 gr bullet / .264 SD / 3000 fps
375 Wtby / 260 gr bullet / .264 SD / 3000 fps
375 RUM / 260 gr bullet / .264 SD / 2975 fps

Underbore
257 Roberts / 115 gr bullet / .249 SD / 2775 fps
7x57 / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 2780 fps
7-08 / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 2810 fps
284 win / 150 gr bullet / .266 SD / 2730 fps
308 / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 2650 fps
30-06 / 180 gr bullet / .271 SD / 2820 fps
8x57 / 200 gr bullet / .274 SD / 2650 fps
338-06 / 225 gr bullet / .281 SD / 2640 fps
35 Whelen / 250 gr bullet / .279 SD / 2450 fps
350 rem mag / 250 gr bullet / .279 SD / 2520 fps
375 H & H / 260 gr bullet / .264 SD / 2740 fps

I decided to use the 180 gr bullet for the 30 calibers because to me that is a more appropriate bullet than the 165/168 gr, especially in many of the 30 calibers.

Now I realize some have pushed these bullets faster and also if you jumped to a heavier bullet on the overbore it would lower velocity. Also realize that the velocity parameters are not necessary for killing game, hell I love my 30-06. Just trying to stay around that .250 sectional density as a way of comparing apples to apples.

quote:

Originally posted by woods:
Following the lead of Hot Core, I've decided to stir things up around here. .

I certainly think you are a guttsy guy trying to compete with a master!

Next; It is MHO that the underbore, overbore, and just right bore would be better expressed as a ratio between the case capacities and the bore diameters. roger

Hey Woods, I don't understand the first sentence and have "corrected" the second sentence for you:

quote:

Originally posted by Woods:
... a cartridge is just right if it can move a bullet which is appropriate to the caliber and has a decent sectional density approx .250 at a easily attainable muzzle velocity between 2900 and 3100 fps.

is accurate and has plenty of Energy to Kill cleanly.

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:

quote:

Originally posted by woods:
Following the lead of Hot Core, I've decided to stir things up around here. .

I certainly think you are a guttsy guy trying to compete with a master! ...

Are you two Pilgrims "trying" to create some kind of argument on the Board or what???
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First off , with the availability of all kinds of Slow and Super-Slow Powders, I'm not sure if the term "Overbore" is currently accurate - unless someone does change the original definition(like Woods).
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Second off , the List does not have any of the normal weenie Head Shooter cartridges because of the originators definition. Does that mean they are not useful and actually won't Kill anything?

No 6.5RemMag, 30-30, 300Sav, 357Mag, 35Rem, 416Anything, 44Mag, 444Mar, 458Anything, or the excellent 50BMG.
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Third off , using a 180gr Bullet in all 30cal cartridges (308Win - 300-378Wby) seems a bit predijucial prejudical strange. While using the excuse, "because to me that is a more appropriate bullet than the 165/168 gr," as a disclaimer! Almost as if the originator took a class in, "How to Skew Statistics(so you can Make A HSGS Look Like It Is Useful)", by "PTdenton".
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Forth off , everybody knows a 130gr and a 140gr Bullet is ideal for the 7mm-08 and 280Rem.
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As a buddy often posts, What does it all mean?

It means Woods might have slipped while using a "Thingy" and experienced a Head Injury.

All your prejudices are showing;

"using bullets appropriate to the caliber" - What does that mean? Appropriate to whom and for what? The 150 grain - 165 grain bullets in 30 caliber are more appropriate for what i use a 30 cal for.

"2,900 - 3,100 fps" where I hunt that is adequate but for other areas of the country it is not necessary, 2500 fps may be more than adequate for them.

quote:

Originally posted by woods:
Following the lead of Hot Core, I've decided to stir things up around here.

From the last 2 postings I'd say you're on the road to success. roger

I expected more flaming!

Guess I'm not as good at this as HC.

It's possible I should have used 165 gr bullets to compare the 308 and 30-06 but I am a charter member of the Heavy Bullet Mafia afterall.

quote:

seems a bit predijucial prejudical strange ........ Almost as if the originator took a class in, "How to Skew Statistics

Now that there is funny, I don't care who you are! Like the Democrats accusing the Republicans of wanting to raise taxes!

quote:

As a buddy often posts, What does it all mean?

Don't mean nothin, just my opinion!

quote:

No 6.5RemMag, (that would be Just Right as shown by a group I shot today)



30-30 (underbore), 300Sav (underbore), 357Mag (underbore), 35Rem (already listed as 350 rem mag, I guess it's hell to get old and your eyesight starts going, huh HC?), 416Anything (you guess at those, the question is where do you stop?), 44Mag (underbore), 444Mar (underbore), 458Anything (underbore), or the excellent 50BMG (way overboard!).

quote:

Originally posted by woods:
I expected more flaming!

Guess I'm not as good at this as HC.

Keep tossing out the Bait - and they will show up eventually.

Maybe this can help you get going, ask alf or tater-tot to explain anything at all about Reloading.

quote:

Like the Democrats accusing the Republicans of wanting to raise taxes!

I feel like I'm currently in the Twilight Zone here in KY. "They" just elected a democrat Governor and he is saying, every time a microphone shows up, "I will not allow the TAXES to be raised. We project a $600M deficit for 2008 and we will correct the problem by (get ready) reducing Spending!" He even told the KY Senate Head(another dem) that the Pork Barrel money, slated for a road in his County which goes nowhere, will not get approved.

Then in the County where I'm living, the Republicans are in charge and EVERY WEEK the local paper(The Weekly Disappointment) reports our Fisical Court(the Republicans) have decided it is necessary to:
1. Double a specific TAX.
2. Break out specific funded programs as a separate Line Item(create a new TAX).
3. Triple a different TAX.
4. Add a new TAX.
5. TAX an existing TAX.
6. Lay off 10 people, but pay for a HUGE Fireworks display.
7. Etc.

But they do say each and every time, "We deeeeeeply regret we are having to..."

Don't ask me what's going on here, beats me.
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quote:

No 6.5RemMag, (that would be Just Right as shown by a group I shot today)

RL-22??? No wonder you are getting Fliers.
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quote:

35Rem (already listed as 350 rem mag, I guess it's hell to get old and your eyesight starts going, huh HC?),

Now Woods, surely you know the 35Rem and the 350RemMag are two different cartridges. One even has a Belt and the other one doesn't. But, I do agree there are parts of getting old that I could do without.

Hey Woods, I was just looking at your fine list again and noticed that if you actually change the Bullet "weights" around a bit, you can shift them in the lists. But that does change the Sectional Density Standard.