IMO it's practical use and range is roughly equivalent to a .223 Rem.

I built one using a shilen barrel and while I had high expectations I finally decided that it's just another name for a .223 without the .223 advantage of dirt cheap brass.

I shoot a Tactical .20 which is a near twin of the .204. The following is actual load data for my 40 grain V-Max (BC .275) load which has been chrono'd repeatedly. This isn't the max velocity available, but a reasonable load in this particular rifle designed for extended strings of p-dog and chuck shooting. To some this might apear a 200 yard max rifle, I'd never argue that because a man has to know his limitations. I believe that some are extremely poor shooters and with that in mind possibly 200 to 300 yards is beyond the limit of their abilities with these ballistics. I've personally used this load to shoot a large number of p-dogs in excess of 400 yards (as has my wife) as well as a good number over 500. But again if one feels these ballistics inadequate for their challenged level of shooting skill by all means limit yourself to that which you feel capable of. "Or" perhaps I could get my wife to give you some shooting lessons cause to her this round is a serious long range performer. I've seen her shoot it, she's right.


Ballistic Data
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Range Elevation Velocity Energy ETA Drop Max Y 10mph Wind Deflect
0 yds -1.50 in 3880 fps 1337 fpe 0.000 sec 0.00 in -1.50 in 0.00 in
25 yds -0.40 in 3791 fps 1276 fpe 0.020 sec 0.07 in -0.58 in 0.04 in
50 yds 0.55 in 3704 fps 1219 fpe 0.040 sec 0.30 in -0.52 in 0.17 in
75 yds 1.35 in 3619 fps 1163 fpe 0.060 sec 0.68 in -0.42 in 0.38 in
100 yds 1.98 in 3536 fps 1110 fpe 0.081 sec 1.23 in -0.28 in 0.66 in
125 yds 2.43 in 3454 fps 1059 fpe 0.102 sec 1.95 in -0.09 in 1.03 in
150 yds 2.71 in 3374 fps 1011 fpe 0.124 sec 2.85 in 0.15 in 1.49 in
175 yds 2.79 in 3295 fps 964 fpe 0.147 sec 3.95 in 0.45 in 2.05 in
200 yds 2.66 in 3218 fps 920 fpe 0.170 sec 5.25 in 0.81 in 2.71 in
225 yds 2.33 in 3142 fps 877 fpe 0.194 sec 6.76 in 1.22 in 3.47 in
250 yds 1.78 in 3068 fps 836 fpe 0.218 sec 8.48 in 1.71 in 4.32 in
275 yds 1.01 in 2995 fps 796 fpe 0.243 sec 10.44 in 2.26 in 5.27 in
300 yds 0.00 in 2923 fps 759 fpe 0.268 sec 12.62 in 2.88 in 6.30 in
325 yds -1.27 in 2852 fps 722 fpe 0.294 sec 15.07 in 3.59 in 7.47 in
350 yds -2.82 in 2782 fps 687 fpe 0.320 sec 17.79 in 4.39 in 8.76 in
375 yds -4.65 in 2714 fps 654 fpe 0.348 sec 20.80 in 5.28 in 10.18 in
400 yds -6.77 in 2646 fps 622 fpe 0.376 sec 24.10 in 6.27 in 11.72 in
425 yds -9.20 in 2580 fps 591 fpe 0.405 sec 27.70 in 7.35 in 13.37 in
450 yds -11.93 in 2514 fps 561 fpe 0.434 sec 31.61 in 8.55 in 15.12 in
475 yds -15.02 in 2450 fps 533 fpe 0.464 sec 35.87 in 9.86 in 17.03 in
500 yds -18.45 in 2386 fps 506 fpe 0.495 sec 40.48 in 11.30 in 19.06 in

montdoug, Did you make sure and check out his "limitations" on ranges for various chamberings? He sure doesn't have much faith in the 22-250 and the Swift!!! But the funny thing is the difference in his "limitations" between those two!!! I personally like the 17HMR up to to 150, 7mmBR XP-100 with a Holosite up to 300 and then pick your medicine after that!!! The .204, 222MAG, 22-250, .243, 243AI, 6mm, 25-06, .260 and if you want to blow one up.....7mmMAG shooting 115 grain Speers!!! Really want to blow one up?......300SAUM shooting 125 Noslers at 3525fps!!! I'm done dealing with this one folks!! It was too much fun!!! GHD

300 to 400 yards? Forget it...

im thinking of getting one of the new 204 rugers but i dont know much about it .my main concern is the wind how do these stack up at 300-400 yards? any other info would be appreciated.
thanks

There is a pretty decent article in the November 2004 issue of Guns & Ammo!

There is also a trajectory chart and some reloading data in the article!

I have a 26" 204 barrel for my TC Encore and reloading dies for it, but I haven't tried it out yet because it's muzzle loading season here and by Encore frame is currently occupied.

Hope this helps you.

Steve, I went to your site to check out what you had to say about the .204 since you posted, "....forget it" about using it at 3-400 yards and don't see where you have generated any data for this one yet. We'd be interested in seeing what you found out in your testing!!!! I'm sure a bunch of dead varmints would be interested in knowing why they shouldn't have expired also!

As far as wind drift data goes comparing the 32 grain VMax at 4279fps against a 55 grain VMAX at 3700fps....not much difference out to 500 yards in a 10 mph crosswind!

32 @ 300 yards=9.2"

55 @ 300 yards=9.2"

32@400=17.9"

55@400=17.5"

32@500=30.4"

55@500=29.4"

Not much difference in wind drift!! GHD

Any small diameter light weight bullet is going to be affected by cross wind. But as far as the 204 shooting at 3-400 yrds, you bet your butt it will! I have mine zeroed at 300yrds. I zeroed it off a bench rest at the range with factory Hornady ammo, it shoots consistant 1.5" groups at 300yrds with factory ammo. Ive got the dies as soon as I get some more brass built up I'll start loading for it and try to tighten that up a little.

If you sight-in at 100 yards, and you are experiencing a cross wind of 10 MPH, and you are using the 33 grain bullet, with a BC of 0.185 (according to factory), and if you are actually getting 4000 FPS at 15' from the muzzle:



Then;



at 400 yards

Velocity will be 1959 FPS;

Bullet drop will be -19.4 inches;

wind deflection will be 23.1 inches.



Now, maybe I'm old-fashioned, but a bullet drift of +/- 23 inches is NOT varmint grade...hell it ain't even elephant grade!



And a 1-1/2" PBR is maxed-out at 198 yards.



Now if you want to use that little .204 for varmints out to 200 yards, fine, but 400 is pissing in the wind!



In addition, if you go to the reloading data pages, you will definately find data on two different .20 caliber cartridges, and one of them (oh my) is the .204 Ruger.

in the american rifleman,nov. 2004 issues, they test fired a savage model 12 varminter. Ammo Hornady no. 3040065 32 gr. v-max. 4043fps avg. They fired 5, 5 shot groups. The smallest group .57" The largest group 1.30" The average for all 25 shots was .95" If you want a rifle to shoot in the wind at 3 4 hundred yards, go with 6br,243win.6mmrem. or all most any 243dia. In Shooting Illustrated (nov. 2004), the writer could not give a good report on hunting accuracy of the ruger 204 as there was to much wind blowing. And the bullet leaves little or no puffs of dirt for the spotter to see if u miss.

Steve, I regularly go to your site and check out stuff and I went there and didn't see the data for either of the 20's....it's there, I just didn't see it I reckon! However, the comparison I made was using the 32 grain VMax, not the 33 VMax. 33's were discontinued and so therefore aren't considered. The 32 has a BC of .211....not .185...makes a slight bit of difference. My sight in range used was 200, not 100 and the velocities I used in the calculations were from a SAVAGE 12 FBSS in 22-250 shooting the 55 grain VMAX and a SAVAGE VLP in .204. I love both of the chamberings(think the 22-250 is one of the 2 greatest ever) but I wouldn't hesitate for a second to take the shot instead of sitting it aside and grabbing the 22-250 in the situation alluded to in the post! Keep posting data! We do look at it!! GHD

As I have shoot the 204 in a crosswind this year on the first dog hunt of the year I can say with out a doubt it did VERY well. I guess I should have read the tables and used common sense to know I should have not of been making the shots I was making at a lazered 300 yards.... oh well. It was sure fun. Yes the 204 did a very nice job of reaching out with a 15 mph crosswind. We went out two weeks later with no wind and I had several kills at 400 yards. Damn, if I had only known .

ricciardelli,

I have concerns with what you say about the 204. Do you own a 204? If you do you need to go and shoot it more, because it will shoot between 300-400yds in a crosswind. I had a day with a friend that we only shoot my 204, and yes we did have other guns:2-17HMRs, 2 22-250s. We killed 25 whistle pigs that day and all the shoots averaged between 300 and 400 yards. After about 2 minutes we were dialed in for compensations needed for the wind. I know that this is going to be hard for you to believe but here it goes, I killed a whistle pig at a lasered 627yds with a 10 mph crosswind. Not only did it kill him, it threw him off the rock while doing a 360, before hitting the ground.

It's people like you that I live for to prove wrong, people that think they are experts on something they see on paper but haven't done it themselves.slygunner

Interesting...

Since a 10 MPH wind will cause a deflection of 52 inches at 600 yards;
a 9 MPH wind will cause a deflection of 47 inches at 600 yards;
an 8 MPH wind will cause a deflection of 41 inches at 600 yards;
a 7 MPH wind will cause a deflection of 36 inches at 600 yards;
a 6 MPH wind will cause a deflection of 31 inches at 600 yards.

As you can see, each 1 MPh causes a deflection of around 5 to 6 inches at 600 yards.

Now, unless you travel with a complete weather station in the back of your Yugo, how do you know exactly how strong your wind is?

And my second question is ... How big are your prairie dogs? Over here they are around 2 inches wide and 6 inches long.

Oh, and did I mention that the bullet drop on this caliber is over 80 inches at 600 yards? 48 inches at 500? 27 inches at 400? 13 inches at 300?

So your's was at 627 yards? That's around a 91" drop...and if that PD was at 620 yards your bullet would have missed, even with no wind, as well as at if it were at 635 yards.

As for what I own, or what I have done, you have no idea, and never will...

Ok,here we go, first my 204 is zeroed at 200yds, at 600yds I'm 54" low. A 10mph crosswind gives me a 36" drift.

I do carry a weather station, its called a Brunton ADC JetSet, check it out.

I could swear I said whistle pig which translates into Rock Chuck, much bigger than a praire dog.

Are you telling me that I'm lying or imagining things, because if you are, you have no business even being on a forum that other people respect for the valubale info on it. If you don't believe thats you perogitive, but that means that you don't believe anything on this forum.

You still have not told us if you own a 204, maybe its because you don't and you are getting your information from one of those outdated programs on your sight.

"As for what I own, or what I have done, you have no idea, and never will... " this seems very childlike. please support and verify YOUR opinions and experiences with real life proof. All I have stated comes from owning and reloading and shooting a 204 Rem. ADL, nothing special.

It's easy to call Bullsh$#t on someone when your hiding behind a computer, but tell my two witnesses that they are full of it to their faces. How someone can tell someone that they didn't do something without seeing it for themselves is beyond me.slygunner

If you have a good enough scope it can be done with ease.. Push a 32gr. Vmax BC of .210 @ 4000FPS will give about 87 inches drop @ 650yds.. Thats about 12MOA wich isnt all that much.. So hitting woodchucks at that distance is deffinatly doable.. Considering my 6.5 drops around 210inches @ 1k and I have killed plenty of woodchucks @ 1k and beyond..

6.5 Bandit,
My 204 has a leupold VX 3 Long Range 4.5x14x50 with the varmint reticle. I have grow to trust the adjustments. I hate to say this for the snid remarks that I may get, but here it goes, I plugged the variables into my laptop one day and made the proper adjustments and rang the gong at 1000yds multiple times. I believe that it was close to 28 and 3/4 minutes of elevation, I think. My friend and I laughed hard after hearing the ring. I didn't get this gun to do that with but it did. I mainly got this for a coyote getter out to 300yrds and the occasional varmints.slygunner

Thanks for the pictures of new born praire dogs. Come on steve give it up!!! I have been to Montana and shot praire dogs there, they were much bigger.Not to say that there aren't any new borns there, but get real. We were talking about the 204, marmots, 600 yard shots, and wind drift, get back on track!!! Oh I forgot you have no real life experience with this combination of subjects, because first you have no 204 because if you did you would know better than to say it is no better than 300yrd gun. So that pretty much takes you out of having any real world experience with the 204 and this thread.

Don't have a .204 Ruger (yet, waiting for some more handloading components, such as *CASES* to be more widely available), nor have I shot one. Very interested in one, though.

If you want to go 'by the numbers', using JBM Basic Trajectory Calculations I get this:

.204 Ruger, 32gr V-Max (.211 BC) @ 4000fps

Range Velocity Energy Drop Windage
400 2175.1 336.1 -14.6 19.3

.223 Rem, 50gr Blitzking (.243 BC) @ 3400fps

Range Velocity Energy Drop Windage
400 1956.6 425.0 -19.4 20.1

Guess someone should go tell all those prairie dogs I shot w/ a .223 that I should have really missed cuz of the wind.

For that matter, the bit about how much 1mph changes in the wind can blow you off, etc. Funny, then, how people shooting 600-1000yd BR manage to keep the shots in some pretty respectable groups. Do they have wind meters? Some, maybe. Most, no, because they don't tell you a dang thing about the wind between you and the target, which is what matters. Flags help, when the range has them (ours has only one, end up using mirage more). Wind doping is an art, not a science, and yes, you will probably miss more than you hit at first. Get over it and walk your shots in.

Oh, and prairie dogs ain't 2x6". Gophers/ground squirrels, maybe. P-dogs are more about the size of a 1 or 1.5 liter water bottle.

YMMV,

MOnte

Since you have seen fit to make a pronouncement about "prairie dog", maybe you would like some facts!



Vital Stats



Weight: 1.5-3 lbs.

Length with tail: 3-5"

Shoulder Height: 3-4"

Sexual Maturity: 1 year

Mating Season: March-April

Gestation Period: 28-32 days

No. of Young: 3-8, 5 avg.

Birth Interval: 1year

Lifespan: 3-5 years in the wild





Class: Mammalia

Order: Rodentia

Sub Order: Sciurognathi

Family: Sciuridae

Sub Family: Sciurinae

Genus: Cynomys

Species: 5 in North America





Prairie Dogs are stout, burrowing rodents among the many varieties of ground squirrels.



Prairie Dog burrows are called "towns."



Most Prairie Dogs hibernate during the Winter.



Settlers called them "dogs" and "sod poodles" because of their high-pitched, bark-like call.



As members of the genus Cynomys (Greek for "mouse dog"), all 5 species of Prairie Dogs belong to the Squirrel Family (Sciuridae).



Prairie Dogs issue different sounds identifying various predators, which include hawks, owls, eagles, ravens, coyotes, badgers, ferrets and snakes.



At the turn of the century, as many as 5 billion Prairie Dogs occupied millions of acres of grass prairies across the West.



In 1900, a huge Prairie Dog settlement, 100 miles by 250 miles, was reported on the high plains of Texas containing an estimated 400 million Prairie Dog!



As for groundhogs:



Groundhog is another name for Woodchuck. This rodent is a type of marmot. These solitary mammals hibernate (sleep through winter) in burrows. Groundhogs are found in North America in forests and fields.



Anatomy: A groundhog grows up to 17 inches (43 cm) long. It has a tail that is about 5 inches (13 cm) long. This mammal has a bulky body and short limbs. The fur is brown-gray and the eyes are black. The hands and feet are black and have sharp, sturdy claws. Like all rodents, their incisor teeth continue to grow throughout their entire life.



Diet: Groundhogs/woodchucks are mostly herbivores (plant-eaters). They eat grass, seeds, leaves, flowers, fruit, eggs, and some insects.



Predators: Groundhogs/woodchucks are hunted by many animals, including wolves, dogs, coyotes, bobcats, foxes, and humans. Groundhogs cannot move very quickly, so their best defense is to retreat into their burrows. Keen eyesight and hearing help warn groundhogs of predators approaching.



Classification:

Class Mammalia (mammals),

Order Rodentia (rodents),

Family Sciuridae (ground squirrels),

Genus Marmota (marmots),

species M. monax.

ricciardelli,
I thought that we were talking about the 204 and its ballistics? I think that us varmint hunters know the difference between praire dogs and marmots, in my mind and others, you have lost all credability. I guess thats what happens when you speak before you think..gee, my dad was right,it did come in handy.slygunner

3-4" tall, by 3-5" long.



Hmmm... I think that just proved the point we have been trying to make.



Thanks,



Monte

Who is this guy??? And how for is he going to go to prove to us how big of a dumb a$$ he is??? I'm beginning to think was has never seen a praire dog. This is entertainment at its finest.

Figured he used to know what he was about and has been pretty helpful to people in the past; not sure if he's off his medication or what.

Assuming you weren't talking about me, of course

Monte

Do these praire dogs look a little bigger than what steve is saying?.. or am I imagining things again.



Maybe???

slygunner

they are just fat - dangerously so- they need a more balanced diet. Somebody help them - they are killing themselves on food. DAmn it somebody do an intervention, wheres Maury Povich, Oprah, or Extreem, fat bastard, Makeover?

I am thinking for monsters like that nothing short of a CRF 375+ rifle will do.

............look out they're gonna charge !!!

I'm done with this thread also. I think you finally got the point through his thick, arrogant head. That asshole is going on my ignore list, he has nothing of value and no credability.
If anyone wants real world data on the 204 just PM me. I'm happy to talk to anyone that is down to earth and interested in making progress in the world of shooting and reloading.
Happy Hunting,
slygunner

I can't speak for anyone else but I thought your information was very educational. I would love to get into that P-Dog town you mentioned. I have shot some very big and fat dogs, but that was years ago the man that owned the area I used to hunt poisoned all of them and filled in the holes. I wonder how a 300WM would do on a P-Dog? Probably serious over kill.

Two of the guys I know up here actually use the .338 Lapua for the little critters. I have never been out with them when they brought along the "big guns", but they tell me it is a blast and a half.



I use a .22LR, .22 WMR, .22-250, .220 Swift, and 6mm Remington for most of my critter shooting. I have used a 7mm Rem. Mag., .30-06 and even a .357 handgun.



I generally enforce the following limits on my critter shooting (but do occasionally vary a bit):

.22 LR - 50 yards or less

.22 WMR - 100 yards or less

.22-250 - 250 yards or less

.220 Swift - 350 yards or less

6mm Remington - anything past 350 yards

I must say, those are either very young, or some of the *scrawniest* prairie dogs I've ever seen. Gotta love the fresh turned earth and tall green grass... Every dog town I've seen looked like a friggin' miniature bombing range... a barren, pock-marked wasteland, w/ rare pockets of grass over a couple inches high. Usually brown and yellow (like the rest of the country side)from the heat. Where the heck did you find those pictures? Some irrigated nature preserve where they'd turned them loose the day before?

Backyard my backside!

Monte

Hmmm... get a little testy when someone snipes at what *you* consider 'correct', eh? Not much fun, is it?

Anywho, this has gone way, way to far afield from the original topic. I'll call it quits if you do. Fair enough?

Monte