I have a friend who will be reloading for the first time. He is going to be using ruger 77r 24 inch barrel. Will be hunting mostly deer(white and black tail) and elk. Longest shot under 250 yards. Could you recommend a overall load. We are looking at IRM 4350 55-57 grains, barnes X 180 gr. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Looking to keep cost down and good accuracy. Also please recommend a die set.

My Remington 700 in 30/06 loves the load.

56 grains of IMR 4350
180 Hornady #3070-- spire point(interlock)
Winchester Primer

I can cover a 5 shot group with a dime if I do my part.

I've used this load for elk, deer, bighorn sheep,and mtn goat.

The 30-06 with the Nosler 180 Partition is about as good as it gets. With 62 grains of RL22 (compressed; has to be tapped into the case; work up from 10% below) it clocks 2875 fps from my 22" barrel with no high pressure signs.

If you want to keep cost down,try the new Hornady sst in 165 gr,and
the load I use is 57 gr.of IMR 4350,but work up to it.I use these bullets in all my deer rifles
and they work.

I vote for Colorodo Bob's recipe. Been usin one similiar with great results. I don't get paid as a gun magazine writer so I can't recommend Barnes X. I have observed several rather dull performances with this bullet and only one example of where I thought it lived up to its hype. My vote is for the Hornady I-Locks. Best bullet for the $ on the market today followed closely by several good selections from the other manufacturers.

Leave the 180 x bullet to the magnums. Hornady is probably the best of the non premium and nosler partition will do anything that the '06 is capable of. I'd pick the most accurate 165 or 180 grain bullet of the pack and let it go to work for you.

If he is interested in useing X bullets, even for elk... I would suggest the 165 gr and drive it as fast as reasonable. The 165 X will out penetrate most prem 200 gainers.

Hey Swift Shot,

Hornady makes great bullets. I really don't think you could go wrong with the 180gn as someone else suggested. The cost is right also.

On a side note..how are things on Whidbey? (From an ex-squid who was once stationed there back in '85-'86)

Edited to add: Try the Lee Deluxe Rifle Die set. It is about the best you will get for around $25. It includes a full length sizing die, a collet neck sizing die, a bullet seating die, and a shell holder.

[ 01-04-2003, 20:09: Message edited by: Rufus ]

I use both the 180gr Barns and the 180gr Hornady with H4350. 55gr. for the X and 57gr for the Hornady. Both work great the X is for bear or Moose and the Hornady is for deer. My father in law used one of them for his deer this past fall. At 175 yards the Hornady entered the base of the neck and exited the spine just before the hips.

I killed lots of Mule deer using the old Nosler Solid base bullet in 168 grain. My favorite 30 cal bullet. Use it in 30-06 and 300 H&H.

Colorado Bob also has a good recommendation.

I just prefer the 165/168 grain bullet in 30 cal for Deer sized game.

Pecos

I'd use a 180-gr. or 200-gr. Partition. Shot my one elk with a 180 in a factory load and it didn't exit at 40 yds -- lodged in the opposite shoulder. John Barsness says he shot everything (pronghorns to elk & bears) for a few years with the 200-gr. and never once recovered a bullet, but that the 180 expands better on deer.

My Model 70 shoots well with any 180 gr. bullet and 56 gr. of IMR 4350, my Mark X likes the 200 gr. Partition and a max. charge (at least) of H4350.

Has anyone tried 180 grain nosler partitions with IMR 4831? I have heard that really good accuracy can be had with 57 grains of 4831 and 180 grain noslers.

Deer are small and easy to kill. For them a 150 grain bullet would be best, and there's no need to use a deep-penetrating premium bullet. For elk a heavier, more toughly constructed bullet would be better. If you want one load for everything you could standardize on a load with 165 or 180 grain bullets. Nosler Partitions, although they are usually not the most accurate bullet you can shoot, are as near to fail safe as anything available and will work well on everything. Hornady Interlock bullets cost less than the Partitions, are usually more accurate than the Partitions, and work equally well, especially at 30-06 velocities.

IMR4350 is one of the very best powders available for the 30-06. Unless your particular rifle is quite unusual, you should get excellent accuracy at top or near top velocity from that powder in the 30-06 with any bullet from 150 to 180 or 190 grains.

Barnes X bullets have a very mixed reputation -- they work very well for some people and in some rifles. Other people and rifles dislike them intensely. They also tend to give heavy copper fouling in many rifles.

I like Lee loading dies; I think that their quality is at least as high as more expensive RCBS or Pacific (Hornady) dies. Lee dies are especially attractive in terms of price if that is important to you. You can get the Lee Pacesetter 3-die set (it includes the Lee Factory Crimp die -- a great invention in my opinion) in 30-06 from Midway for under $20. If you don't want the crimp die and the shell holder, you can get the Lee RGB 2-die set (contains only the sizing and seating dies -- same quality as the more expensive set) from Midway for under $11.

[ 01-05-2003, 05:14: Message edited by: LE270 ]

I have had great shooting with 180 gr serria match kings they kill every thing you shoot with them on top of it they shoot very small groups. The elk I shot this year went all of 30 feet the shot was at 273 yards.

I notice the majority of folks here mentioning/recommending heavier bullets (165 to 180 grain range). However, in my experiance, and as LE270 noted, I would lean towards the 150 grain bullets as your best bet espescially if your shooting longer ranges.

Comparing the balistic difference between a 180 and 150 grain bullet; if you happen to misjudge your range by 40 or 50 yards on a 300 yard shot (which is easy to do in low light, hilly country etc.), it could mean a miss or wounding shot on a deer sized target.

Unless you are shooting moose or elk, I see no reason to limit the potential of having that extra edge of a flatter shooting round with the 150 grainers. If you do your part as a reloader and work up a good load, 150 grainers will be as accurate and kill anything on this continent with a properly placed shot.

I personaly use 150 grain pointed soft points in my 30-06 and shot a lot of big whitetails here in Manitoba. Most within 100 yards but I have taken a few at ranges between 250 and 350. Never had a problem with the 150 grainers performance.

Best of luck,

BDS

165 or 180 Remington CoreLokt will do anything under 300 yards that needs doing on Elk or Deer.

Nobody has yet mentioned the Speer HotCor. These are also excellent bullets. Molten lead is poured into the copper jacket, and it alloys with the jacket. Like the Hornady Interlocks, that tends to keep jacket and core together better.

The nice thing about the HotCor is that the geometry of the nose is more curved than the Interlock, giving slightly better ballistics, and allowing you slightly more COL. The longer COL translates to a slightly larger allowable powder load. However, the real, practical differences between these two fine bullets is the stuff pointless arguments are made of.

Nosler Partitions have an enviable reputation, and that's what my elk loads carry. For deer, they probably provide no additional benefit.

Barnes bullets have a decidedly mixed reputation.

I generally use 165 and 180 grain bullets. 165 is ample for any deer. 180 will give you the penetration you need for larger, thick skinned animals, like elk. If you want to use 180 on deer, it will work just fine.

The most deadly combination I have found for deer in my 30-06 is REL-15 powder with the 125 or 130 grain bullet. Deer being thin skinned are not hard to harvest and you just don't need those heavy bullets to do the job. For duel purpose Elk and deer hunting the 165 grain bullet will perform very well in the 30-06. Bullet placement along with the right bullet for the game your hunting is the key to success in any hunting venue. Better to fire 100 rounds practicing than it is to miss after only one sight in session at the bench.

Denton,
Have you ever had one of those speer "hot cores" hold it's core in the jacket? I have yet to recover one single speer with any trace of lead in it. I had some 200gr. .338cal. that I was using for varmints with my .338WMag. They would really blow them apart kinda like a V-max.

A couple seasons ago I used my 3006 with my elk load to take a nice 4x4 blacktail. 60 grains r19, hornady 180 sp interlock, f210 primers in ww brass. I had the gun set up as a back up for my elk hunt and grabbed it at the last minute. The shot was about 125 yard broadside, and running. The shot was angling slightly down, lung/ top of the heart/ lung and out the lower chest. The buck cartwheeled mid stride and never twitched. A ballistic tip out of a 30-378 could not have killed any quicker. And best of all, practically no lost meat.

175gr Siera Match King over Reloader 15,19, or 22. RCBS X dies.

Swiftshot,
a 165 gr Nosler Partition pushed with 45 to 51 grains of Hodgdon H380 (49.7) will do the trick. The listed load is (my load) but I have a long throated rifle so you may not want to start there. My OAL is 3.29" and I use CCI250 primers.

PaulS

I concur completely with LE270. He's giving you good, easy advice. About all I can add is that IMR4064 is another surefire cinch for 30-06 bullets in the 150-180 grain range, but try the 4350 first.

I urge all new reloaders to steer clear of Barnes bullets, at least for a while. Because the Barnes construction is so different from a jacketed lead bullet, they play by some different rules when it comes to seating depth, pressures and the like. And as others have mentioned, there seem to be an awful lot of rifles that just don't "like" a Barnes no matter what the reloader does.

If for deer only, I would recommend whatever 150 grain bullet shoots most accurately. However, if your friend is wanting a single load for deer and elk, move up to at least a 165 grain Nosler Partition.

One of the advantages of handloading is that you can tailor a variety of loads to your gun. It would be more ideal to work up a good 150 grain deer load with any conventional bullet, and another 180 grain elk load with a bullet known for good penetration and structural integrity (Nosler, Speer Hot Core, Hornady, or one of the high-priced premiums other than the "X").

I like the 150 grain X bullet . This has shown great accuracy. My 30/06 had not shot the 180 as well. The one thing about X bullets is that you can try different bullet weights and great complete different results in accuracy. I have had more luck with lighter bullet weights in th calibers in used them in. My 300 Win Mag shoots the 165 gr better than the 180 also. I think this has to do with the long bearing surface of a given weight. What I am trying to say is that a 180 grain x bullet is longer than a 180 standard lead bullet. I think this is the reason to try using lighter weight X bullets. The shank is the same length. Trying out standard bullets (I like Hornady) will give an idea of the bullet length a particular rifle will like. The key with reloading is that two identical rifles might like completely different loads.

If you want a 180 grain bullet, the Failsafe is another good option. My 30/06 and Aaron's both love it. Aaron has 4 kills with four bullets. The thing that has amazed him is the accuracy and that none of the deer have went more than 10 feet. He has never had any where near this bullet performance before.

I have had the best results with IMR 4831 powder in my 30/06. RCBS dies are what I use. I do like them better than the Lees I own.

Have fun and Good Luck

Hcliff

Bullet: Nosler 180 Grain Partition
Powder: 55.0 grains IMR-4350
Primer: Winchester 8-1/2
Case: Winchester
Firearm: Ruger 77R
Velocity: 2705 FPS @15' from muzzle

HOWEVER...I prefer:

Bullet: Sierra 168 Grain Boat Tail Hollow Point
Powder: 56.6 grains of IMR-4350
Primer: Winchester 8-1/2
Case: Winchester
Firearm: Ruger 77R
Velocity: 2801 FPS @ 15' from muzzle

[ 01-09-2003, 00:38: Message edited by: ricciardelli ]

Use the X it will be a great combination

"My favorite 06 load is 60 grains of H4831 behind the Sierra 180 SPBT. I know it's considered over max by current loading manuals, but some of the old ones, like P.O. Ackley's, go even higher."

Remember that P.O. Ackley was using original surplus 4831, which is slower still than the current H4831. Surplus 4831 is almost as slow as IMR 7828.

As far as being "over max" according to a particular loading manual, each manual uses a different firearm and methodology for working up its loads. Just as from individual to individual, the components used by the respective manuals vary, as do their pressure standards. A manual is only a general guide. The individual loader must work up his loads to the appropriate desired pressure and velocity in his own individual rifle.

If it were me, I would go with Redding
dies. A good load for deer can be built around a 150 gr Partition or Hornady SP and a max charge of IMR4320. If Elk are on the menu a 180 Partition and IMR4350 is hard to beat. This latter load can do it all if you are looking to use one load for everything.

I'll probably be tarred and feathered for saying this, but the 165 gr. Nosler BT is the best deer medicine I've found for my .30-06 yet. Some will say it blows up on impact, this is not true, I've harvested dozens of whitetails and mulies with it and have yet to see one fail. Just my .02, oh yeah, I wouldn't recommend the Sierra MatchKing, despite the photo proof that has been provided, it is NOT designed as an expanding hunting bullet, period.
Yardbird