I have been breaking in a new barrel, 338 WIN MAG, Ruger 77 MK II. I use a bore cleaner and copper-out between rounds. The patches are coming out clean, but if I look in the bore with a flashlight, I can see copper on the lands ( not grooves ). Does anyone know what the problem could be? Or is it a problem ?

Thanks

It's perfectly normal on a factory barrel to get copper fouling instantly, alot on some depending on how rough they are. Clean it all out with JB or Sweets to break it in properly and continue the process until you have it as smooth as it will get. If you get it to NOT copper foul real quick with a factory barrel... you'll be doing great. One Remington I have is supper rough, the other is fairly smooth and doesn't foul bad at all. Odds are against you though. A hand lapped custom bbl is the only way you get what you pay for. Good luck with it, it can still be very accurate though.

Brent: I see what you're saying, the problem I'm having, is that after washing with sweets 7.62 till the patch comes out non-blue, I can still see copper on the land with the flashlight. It looks like it's imbeded in the land, but won't come off with sweets.

I drove myself nuts trying to get all of the copper out of the barrel of my 270. As the other poster have stated, most factory barrels will atract copper and you realistically can't get it all out.
After a year of trying to remove the copper racing stripes I stumbled on JB's bore paste and Flitz. First I soak the barrel for two or three days with Butch's Bore Shine. Then a treatment with Sweets. Clean throughly. Then run some JB's bore paste, about 25 strokes. Clean again. then finish off with Flitz, about 25 strokes or so. I did this treatment twice ( about two months apart) and now the copper fouling is much improved. Cleaning the barrel takes much lees time. I am guessing that the JB's paste and the Flitz polish the bore and make it harder for the copper to stick.

CORBIN has a Synthetic Sapphire Bore Lap ("micro-engineered lapping cream smooths, cleans, and conditions your bore to resist fouling").
They say: "may be used fore fire lapping or with brush/patch combination. Stop lapping after two passes through the bore" .

And they have an even stronger stuff "for gunsmiths".

This shortens the procedure Zeke prescribes.

I have this stuff but do'nt dare to use it because I do not want to make my .308 barrel .311.

I am breaking in a new barrel also. I cleaned it a few times with some Hoppes #9 and a brush. Now for the last 60 shots I have not cleaned it at all.

I have been using it for hunting, pray tell, and after a few shots at criters I get out to the range now and then and fire off twenty or so shots slowly increasing the loads.

The barrel is a new Winchester in .220 Swift that was made in 1948 but never installed until now. The loads have been a mix of 50 gr Sierra Blitz Kings and 40 Nosler BT's and the powders have been IMR 4064 and RL 15. As of today the 50 gr load is up to 4170 fps instrumental and it continues to shoot into 0.5 MOA or better.

I read on 24hrcampfire that "Muledeer" fired his .223 last year 350 shots at praire dogs and then put it away and tested it this spring and it shot the same load into .6" at 100 yds. So far he has not cleaned it.

regarding some of the post above: Do the barrels truely need to be THAT clean? I mean I don't know of a contest that permits cleaning between each shot so after the first round is fired, the barrel is, by some of your some definitions, dirty and copper clad.

Here's why I clean mine down to the bare metal after 20-30 rounds or so, some might shoot better longer than others before fouling spoils accuracy.

If I can only see down the bore a couple three inches and like Montanahunter says... it don't come clean but indicates IT IS, you could develope a buildup problem beyond where you can see when you "do" feel the need to clean it down to metal. I clean mine down to where all I can see left is a slight steak next to the edge of each groove where it doesn't clean that hairline edge. Everything else is smooth and shining with no copper streaks as far as I can see. JB gooed up all over two or three patches is all it takes on any of mine to make 'em shine up. I use a Dewey rod and .40 caliber patches wrapped around the long Dewey Jag completely coated with JB for maximum effect.

None of my guns shoot their best until at least three rounds have been back through the bore to "foul" it though, then they settle in. Same goes if I switch powder too.

I'd say to scrub it more with JB and it'll clean up, it just may take more than you'd think it should. Sweets will eventually break it down and remove it all, most people are afraid of leaving it long enough though. It won't hurt the steel as long as you flush it out with Shooters Choice or something after your done, it probably wouldn't hurt it if you left it in over night but I never have needed to.

I can get the copper out just as fast with JB but either one or a combination works just fine.

I've just started using a fairly new product for bore cleaning. It is called "Wipe-Out". It is a foam spray that you squirt into the barrel, let it sit for an hour or more and then push about 4 or 5 patches through the bore and it is CLEAM - NO copper fouling left! !

This past weekend I went up to Wyoming for the first prairie dog shoot of the season and fired 150 shots each day through a 22 K-Hornet with no cleaning during each day. Each night I used the Wipe-Out, but since I had shot 150 round without cleaning I had to repeat the cleaning process a second time. But then is was clean as a whistle.

You can find this stuff at Sportsman's Warehouse at $9.50/5 oz can, or get it from the company. I don't think the Sportsmen's Warehouse is anywhere in the east, but they are in several cities in the Mountain West. My advice is to try to find a commercial outlet as the company is HORRIBLE to deal with. I emailed them with an order for one can to try out. No reply for 6 weeks - another email to remind them I had placed an order. No response for 5 weeks, then they sent me 6 cans, charged me full price at $10.99/can and an exorbitant shipping and handling fee. I sent an email asking for a UPS label so I could return the portion I didn't order, but that was three months ago and I haven't heard a word from them since. By now I have tried it out and found it to be quite good, so I guess I have a multi-year supply.

The company is as follows:

SharpShoot R Precision
27385 Pressonville Rd.
Wellsville, KS 66092

email info@sharpshootr.com
Web page www.sharpshootr.com

Good luck

Don Shearer

I said this before and I'll say it again,once you put a stick of dynamite like a 338 behind the grooves of any barrel, factory or custom you can forget about smooth bores.When the bullet exits the bore so will the chunks of rifling.To prove my point,check you're throat from the chamber end before you shoot let's say 20 or 30 rounds at the range before and after.There is no doubt with such a load you will have lost some barrel steel.This was shot down the barrel scratching the bore.

Shootaway,

I disagree with your scratching theory.
I emailed them guys about the Wipe-out, he emailed me back in a day or two and said they ship to Alaska, not problem. Maybe they got their sh_t together finaly. Thanks for the heads up though.

I fire laped with a kit from Sinclair. Changed my sako 338 winmag and my 416 Weatherby from awful foulers to very nice guns.

I was wondering how the sinclair fire lapping system is done,I was thinking about trying the tubbs fire lapping system but after some research and advice from others on this forum I have decided to hold off on trying it,did you examine the bore and throat before and after you did it with a bore scope to see what effect it had on the bore and throat, just wondering thanks

I wouldn't worry about it, it will cure itself in time..consider a squeeky clean barrel needs from 2 to 5 shots to foul a barrel before it will shoot should tell you something....What you have is a wash and it will not hurt a thing, the proof of that will be in the shooting. Some barrels shoot better the dirtier they get..I have an 06 that I have not cleaned but once in the last 20 years. The last time I cleaned it it didn't shoot a decent group for 200 rounds, it's down to .290 for 5 shots now..Every barrel is an inity unto itself, and you have to figure each one of them out. I have another that I clean every 12 to 20 shots to maintain its super accuracy.

Over cleaning has ruined more barrels than anything I know of..A lot can happen by running a rod down a bore...