You guys are going to get really sick of my questions before long. I've been looking at the K&M flash hole de-burrers and primer pocket reamers. The prices don't seem too ridiculous. Any good/bad reviews? Also, what about the Forster case trimmer? Cabela's has them on sale.

Man I lost my flash hole de-burrer back in the 70s. Never replaced it. I think that for the hunter using quality brass a lot of the tools and steps needed back when I started reloading in the 60s are no longer needed. Now if you are shooting long range target or benchrest different issue. When I could no longer see a difference in my groups between new just sized brass and detailed cases I stopped fooling with it. Lot more fun to shoot than prep a case that isn't needed.

I've used a Forster trimmer since the late 60s. Never saw a reason to replace it.

quote:

Forster case trimmer?

IMO it's a fine tool.

The rest of things you mentioned are IMO worthless as teats on a boar!

Thanks guys. I just finished reading the "case volume" post by jola. You are beginning to help me save $$$ on this high dollar venture.

Get the basic stuff and forget about "thingys".

The basics are:

1. press
2. Dies
3. Shell holder
4. Balance beam scales
5. funnel
6. Id/OD chamfer tool
7. Case trimmer
8. Measurung device....digital calipers are great
9. Imperial sizing wax
10. Two or more loading manuals
11. loading block....make your own maybe
12. plastic spoon for dribbling powder
13. priming device if your press does not come with one.

There's a helluva lotta stuff out there that are totally unnecessary.....get them as your interest guids you.....then you too will know how worthless most of the "thingys" are

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
8. Measurung device....digital calipers are great....

My old RCBS stainless calipers kinda took a dump. Got different readings at -0- everytime.

I just got the digital RCBS calipers from the UPS guy and they are really nice!

quote:

1. press
2. Dies
3. Shell holder
4. Balance beam scales
5. funnel
6. Id/OD chamfer tool
7. Case trimmer
8. Measurung device....digital calipers are great
9. Imperial sizing wax
10. Two or more loading manuals
11. loading block....make your own maybe
12. plastic spoon for dribbling powder
13. priming device if your press does not come with one.

+!
I do use a RCBS powder trickler. But simply because I use a uniflow and it will trow just a couple grains short.

I bet for the first 10 years I used a Lee powder Measure kit(set of scoups) and a plastic spoon. Not sure it is that much slower.

K&M tools are well made and work well for the desired task. I think all case trimmers are fine, I prefer the one made by Wilson but you need a case holder for each case.

Most cases outside of Lapua and Norma need to have the burr removed from the flash hole. I think I read that Nosler cases also do not have a burr but have never used any. Not sure how much the burr affects the average reloaded shell, but it won't hurt to remove it.

BigB

quote:

Originally posted by BigB:
K&M tools are well made and work well for the desired task. I think all case trimmers are fine, I prefer the one made by Wilson but you need a case holder for each case.

Most cases outside of Lapua and Norma need to have the burr removed from the flash hole. I think I read that Nosler cases also do not have a burr but have never used any. Not sure how much the burr affects the average reloaded shell, but it won't hurt to remove it.

BigB

BigB....congratulations on post # 1,000!

quote:

Originally posted by BoomRM:
...I've been looking at the K&M flash hole de-burrers and primer pocket reamers. The prices don't seem too ridiculous. Any good/bad reviews? Also, what about the Forster case trimmer? Cabela's has them on sale.

The K&M "Tools" are not "Thingys" by any stretch of the imagination. Excellent First-Class "Tools". However, Lyman makes some which work just as well and are typically less expensive.

As for Case Trimmers, the Lee Hand Held Case Trimmer/Case Length Gauge is very inexpensive and cuts Cases to length more consistently than most of the Lathe Style Trimmers. Plus you can hold them over a Trash Can and not end up with Brass slivers all over your Reloading area. The Lathe Style Trimmers make a HUGE mess.

Best of luck to you.

quote:

The K&M "Tools" are not "Thingys" by any stretch of the imagination. Excellent First-Class "Tools"

Hot Core.....I have no disagreement with the quality of said tools.....only to their need and value added to the reloading process!

quote:

As for Case Trimmers, the Lee Hand Held Case Trimmer/Case Length Gauge is very inexpensive and cuts Cases to length more consistently than most of the Lathe Style Trimmers.

I agree the lee tools are great IF you are only going to load factory. Or trim only to factory length. I have a couple. However sense the majority of what I shoot isn't factory I use the Forster about 99% of the time. If I was doing more pistol shooting I'd probably use the lee's more.

I agree with Vapodog K&M are quality tools. Just not something that a new loader needs to run out and buy.

Vapodog,

Thanks for pointing out the #1000 post, it took 10 years but I made it.

BigB

quote:

Originally posted by BigB:
Vapodog,

Thanks for pointing out the #1000 post, it took 10 years but I made it.

BigB

Only 250 years to go!

I have used a large rifle K&M primer pocket reamer to the extent that it is pretty dull.

I chuck it in an electric drill, (wore out my cordless drill) and ream away.

I do this on all my gas gun ammo as I don't want a high primer. There is a chance that a slamfire could occur with high primers.

I cannot tell any difference, with a hand held target rifle, between brass with pockets reamed to a uniform depth, and brass that is not mucked with.

quote:

Originally posted by BoomRM:
I've been looking at the K&M flash hole de-burrers

K&M makes some pretty good stuff. Among other of their tools, I use their flash hole deburrer for PPC sized flash holes. It works. But I prefer the Lyman deburrer if we are talking regular size flash holes - the handle on the Lyman tool is better, making the tool easier to use.

- mike

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Hot Core.....I have no disagreement with the quality of said tools.....only to their need and value added to the reloading process!

I agree there is a considerable amount of variability in opinions on whether Case Prep, of any type, is worth doing.

As for me, I De-Burr the Flash Hole and Square the Primer Pocket on every Case I reload. If no one else desires to do it, that is fine by me.

I also Weight Sort which many see as a TOTAL Waste of time, fine by me again.

And I Re-Trim to length, Champfer and De-Burr the Case Mouth, and Polish the Case Mouth with 0000SteelWool wrapped around an old 22cal Bore Brush - after every single shot - and still fine by me if no one else does.

I also Anneal about every 5th shot, and if no one else chooses to - also fine.

I want my Cases as consistent from Shot-to-Shot as I can make them. It is my time to use, so I use it as I desire, and proper Case Prep is just something " I " do.

I also much prefer to shoot against guys who do not believe in Case Prep when we see who is going to buy the BBQ.

There are a lot of tools and practices that the casual shooter or hunter, both of whom use mainly off the shelf factory rifles, will tell beginners are a waste of time and money. From their perspective they are correct.

Still, there are more shooters than just those folks. Target shooters, professional snipers,
beanfield shooters, and long range varmint hunters will tell you that most or all these "questionable" gadgets and techniques are certainly necessary, if one wants to stay competitive.

The reason that the plinkers and hunters don't see a use for them is twofold: Firstly, in and of themselves, these things aid accuracy only incrementally, and in shooting platforms (custom rifles and loading equipment) built to tolerances necessary to show up those increments. Secondly, with the custom rifle shooting bunch, accuracy is not just shooting a nice group at 100 yards and putting the target on the wall of the loading room or showing it off at the barber shop. To them accuracy is being able to repeat that group time after time after time and in all conditions. The vast majority of hunters and plinkers do not put in the hours and hours of range time with high tolerance rifles, wind flags, super scopes, and all that is necessary to make a sound judgement about whether or not to ream a primer pocket to aid accracy in ALL cases. On the other hand, a lot of target shooters, et. al. forget that not everyone is even trying for 1/10 MOA accracy.

As a wannabe BR champ who realizes his shortcomings, I have tried every technique and gadget I could lay hands on for a lot of years. I have ended up with a drawer full of junk that does not help me at all. I have also ended up with a different drawerful that does help my aggregates. K&M tools are in the latter drawer.

I have to admit that after taking the Jack Neary course I stopped bothering to weigh brass, but in the same breath I will also mention that I use only Lapua or Norma brass.

These tools and techniques should not be seen as a substitute for the most important aids to accuracy: knowledge and practice.

Great post amamnn. Being totally new at this reloading game, I am trying to sort out all of the "wants" and "needs". I don't have anyone that I know whom I can buddy up with for "hands-on" learning on all of the essential components required, and what is going to be a waste of time and money. If I had the money to buy everything, it would be a helluva lot easier to get loading!

Thanks,

Boom