Hello,

Please see the 3 links below that I hope will help explain my question.
I'm reloading 9mm. My load data is coming from Lee Modern Reloading second addition. My bullets are Berry's plated 115gr RN and being loaded with lead bullet data as suggested by Berry's. My powder is HP38 4.3 grains, O.A.l of 1.10 and my cases are the first reload of my factory brass. This puts me on page 507 of the Lee book for 115gr Lead bullet. So, as you will see from the pics my bullet seating is correct but it just doesn't look right. It looks too deep to me especial next to the factory round. Maybe I'm wrong, hopefully I am or maybe I'm just too anal or both. Let me know what you think. Any help will be thankfully received.

Does the factory round have the same weight bullet as the bullet you are reloading?

No it doesn't look right to me either. Can you hold a Berry's bullet against your loaded factory round to see how far into the case it would seat if set at that OAL?

9mm Parabellum hasn't much airspace. A "deep" seated round with modern powders in a 357 Mangnum isn't going to have much danger risk. After all it is in fact a lengthened case derived from a blackpowder cartridge parent the .38 S & W Special.

But the 9mm Parabellum is a different animal and is already at minimum sensible case capacity.To reduce that even more you do risk a incresae in pressure.

I think that your bullets with that profile are too deeply seated. The Lee 115 grain OAL qouted maybe for a much shorter bullet that has more of it at the nose end. Like a 38 Super profile bullet shape.

quote:

Originally posted by Shootshellz:
Does the factory round have the same weight bullet as the bullet you are reloading?

Yes, the factory round and the Berry's round are both the same, 115gr.

quote:

Originally posted by enfieldspares:
No it doesn't look right to me either. Can you hold a Berry's bullet against your loaded factory round to see how far into the case it would seat if set at that OAL?

9mm Parabellum hasn't much airspace. A "deep" seated round with modern powders in a 357 Mangnum isn't going to have much danger risk. After all it is in fact a lengthened case derived from a blackpowder cartridge parent the .38 S & W Special.

But the 9mm Parabellum is a different animal and is already at minimum sensible case capacity.To reduce that even more you do risk a incresae in pressure.

I think that your bullets with that profile are too deeply seated. The Lee 115 grain OAL qouted maybe for a much shorter bullet that has more of it at the nose end. Like a 38 Super profile bullet shape.

The factory round and the Berry's round are both the same, 115gr. So, yes they would seat the same. Should I use the same powder charge and just alter the seating depth? I don't want to end up with a squib or failure to go into battery.

Lucy 11, have you started at a reduced loading, and worked the load up?... or did you start near max?

This may also be helpful; SAAMI specs

It seems both OAL are between the Min and Max listed by SAAMI.

Seat the same length as the factory round; You are over thinking this.

If the suggested powder load is the starting load then yes I'd seat to the same as the factory round and that should be a god starting point.

I would not go lower than the starting load but I also would not for a first evaluation exceed it either.

quote:

Originally posted by mike_elmer:
Lucy 11, have you started at a reduced loading, and worked the load up?... or did you start near max?

This may also be helpful; SAAMI specs

It seems both OAL are between the Min and Max listed by SAAMI.

This is the Lee starting load for everything, powder and seating.

You are creating an issue from a non-problem. Load, shoot, repeat.

quote:

Originally posted by lucy11:

quote:

Originally posted by mike_elmer:
Lucy 11, have you started at a reduced loading, and worked the load up?... or did you start near max?

This may also be helpful; SAAMI specs

It seems both OAL are between the Min and Max listed by SAAMI.

This is the Lee starting load for everything, powder and seating.

Very good. You should be good to go as loaded. That load you selected is just as it was when tested.

Still, be observant while shooting for the first time, paying attention to function, felt recoil, and inspect the case and primer for signs of unwanted pressure.

And also remember that the min oal listed in the Lee book is just that, a minimum. You can seat as far out as the geometry of the gun will allow (in this case mag length) but the listed figure is the smallest it can be and not cause undue pressure. It would appear that the factory simply seats them longer than minimum.

I tend to ignore 'suggested' oal's. For each bullet used I find the longest oal that will (1)feed thru the magazine, (2)eject when loaded, and (3)fully seat in the chamber. If you load for more than one pistol than you have to decide to either load for each or compromise and load for the limiting gun.
C.G.B.

Me too; I never read the suggested OAL; I load the ammo to fit my magazine and throat.

I seat a lot of my pistol bullets to the same length as factory if the bullets are close to being the same.

I bullet that is seated to deep can cause way over pressure.

Here's something you might try. I use this method for rifle cartridge OAL. No reason it won't work on pistols.
Action EMPTY and closed. Run a flat tipped rod down the barrel from the muzzle. Mark the rod at the muzzle with masking tape.
Open action, or possibly remove barrel. Drop the bullet of your choice into the chamber. Secure it there with a pencil or like object. Again, run the flat tipped rod down the barrel from the muzzle. Mark the rod with masking tape.
Measure the distance between the front edges of the two tape markings. This will show maximum OAL with the bullet touching the lands.
Compare that measurement with your current reloaded rounds.
That will tell you how much too deeply loaded your reloads are, if, in fact, they are shorter than is necessary.
Let us know how this works out.

Steyrsteve: Great suggestion for rifles; way too much work for pistols, IMHO. I seat my pistol bullets to the reloading manual suggested OAL for the weight of the bullet.

Me too. But the 9mm lucy11 pictured didn't look quite right so thought he might want to try this method to see where things stand.

The deeper seated bullet is just fine, though I seldom load that short, provided you are starting with the starting load.
If anything, the factory round looks long considering it has to work in ALL guns.
COL is determined by many things. I like to load such that the bullet is just off the lede/rifling/lands and not back so far.

Speer #13 calls for an max OAL of 1.168. Listed OAL for 115 gr is 1.125 to 1.130, depending on shape.

I load for the 40 S&W and 45 ACP and find that a longer OAL feeds best. I will be loading for the 9mm as soon as my shell plate arrives and will start with the longer OAL.

Google "plunk test" - use it to find a length/seating depth that will work in your gun. I use the same load (4.3 gr. W231/HP38, Berry's 115 gr. plated RN) with a COL of 1.130" - a nice, soft shooting, accurate load in both of my 9mm pistols.

You need to buy the P.T. Barnum Decattiwupous die. This die removes the cattiwupous of all cartridges.

Jim

To determine seating depth of S-A pistol loads, I take out the pistol barrel and use it as a gauge. Keeping the bbl. upright, I drop a loaded round in the chamber and tune seating depth until the rear face of the case head is level with the bbl. rear extension. As various 9x19 cases often vary in length, causing inaccuracy due to faulty headspace, I'm in fact transferring headspace control from case mouth to rifling lead, making all cases equal, whether long or short. In my experience, accuracy will improve up to the pistol's potential. One last remark, the above adjustment has to be rechecked whenever changing bullet ogive (other weight, shape, brand, etc.).