Hi All,

I have a new Winchester LH model 70 that is driving me nuts. First off, I am not new to reloading, so I do not really need basic reloading advice. When shooting a 5 shot group, I will get two distinct groups, typically two shots touching, then 2 inches below, three shots touching. I have worked up to a load that shows the most promise and it is:
57 grains H4350
Fed 210 M primer
Remington Brass
Nosler 165 gr BT

I have bedded the action, free floated the barrel, tightened every screw to the proper torque. The rifle also did the same with 150 grain bullets. The crazy part is the groups do not happen on consecutive shots. For example, the first shot hits high, the next three shoot a very small group 2 inches lower, the fifth shot hits high touching the first shot. I am taking a minute between shots to let the barrel cool and think I am a good shot. Ive tried H4895 and that did not work so well, so I am wide open to any suggestions. The COAL has the bullets seated ot so that they just fit the magazine, and are just off the lands. I canèt seat them out further. Should I start changing the seating depth of the bullet downwards, change primers and reduce the loads and work back up, put pressure under te barrel tip or just buy a new gun

Thanksfor your help.

Mark

Mark

Rather than looking at this as two groups, I think you really have to accept that your particular bullet/powder/ combo is actually a 2 incher. Instead of trying to figure out "why" I would go to another load, starting with the bullet, and see what happens.

JMHO

Ray

This can happen if you change the position of your eye (parallax) or you rest changes minutely between shots. I also experienced this when there were differences in neck tension (small amounts of lube in neck of some cases, none in others). Another problem can be differences in primer strike; clean primer pockets before repriming. Kudude

I get the same type thing. 3 shots about touching. Then I shoot a inch away left or right,up,down.

I figure its just me shakin the barrel, too much coffee, yankin the trigger, that dude down the line blastin his frickin damn pistol rapid fire, who's this bozo pullin up in the parking lot behind me(another damn rambo rapid fire pistol shooter), or thinking about loading another round before I shoot this one

some things to pondeer. like kudude
Is it a synthetic stock?
how you holding the rifle?
Are the groups shifting left or right up or down?
what type of rest do you use? front and rear one piece?
trigger pull and cheek pressure are the two most common culprits.
check your shootin style very close.
""have bedded the action, free floated the barrel, tightened every screw to the proper torque. The rifle also did the same with 150 grain bullets. The crazy part is the groups do not happen on consecutive shots. For example, the first shot hits high, the next three shoot a very small group 2 inches lower, the fifth shot hits high touching the first shot.""

Have you tried a different scope?

Two distinct groups is often a sign of reticle float...

Probably not going to make your day but it could be anything that everyone mentioned. I would check scope hardware and then try another "known to be good" scope. Then I would try some other bullet/powder combos. I had a real fussy wby ultralight that absolutely hated everything till I got onto retumbo and then it shot good with several bullets.
Another quick try would be to take some of your ammo and push the bullets in another .050" seating depth just to see if there is an effect....then experiment between there. Also...if you can get your hands on some 165 sierra HP boattails.....if your gun doesn't like them with popular 165 powders there is a problem.