What is the minimum outside temperature for you to go to the outdoor range to test load workups? And I'm not talking about personal comfort. I'm talking getting reliable results form the rifle and loads.
I'm from Minnesota and the daytime highs lately have been around 30 degrees. How much factor does temperature play in evaluating loads? Do I go ahead, or hang it up until spring. I'm laid off now for a couple of months (Construction Estimator) so I've got the time NOW. I'm very busy all summer, so now is the best time for me.
I finally got around to testing some loads last week here in Indiana. Temp outside was 7 degrees! It's a good test for the ammo, but with the loads I tested last week - I will also test them again on a very hot summer day. Temp does bear on pressure, and influences velocity some in-turn.
I would only suggest that whatever load you work up to in cold temperatures be just slightly on the safe side of max, and then test it again in the heat.
I go out whenever I get a chance. You have keep in mind that most powders change their burning rates with extreme temperature changes. Loads that are perceived maximum in the winter are too hot in the summer. Hodgdon extreme powders are very resistent to temperature changes(check out their web site). For this reason I try to stick with them when possible. I like the fact that barrels cool faster in the winter which, fortunately, makes for less down time.
You definitely want to load for the worst--that is load for the hottest weather you may encounter. I've read of varmint shooters having to load rounds ,as the day progresses and warms up, with lighter and lighter charges to compensate for the pressure signs. Some powders are supposed to be better than others in this regard, such as Hodgdon Extreme powders.
Thanks for the replies, that's exactly what I wanted to hear. I was told by a guy on another board that he would NEVER go test loads in this kind of weather. I can understand that temp has an effect on loads, but in Minnesota during deer season, or coyote or Jack Rabbit hunting in winter it's - GUESS WHAT......COLD!
In loads for my hunting rifles I test at whatever the weather happens to be, at least down to -10. After that I go to the indoor range. I've turned into a wussy in my old age. Seriously, for big game rifles, testing in cold weather around here just makes sense, because as mentioned, hunting season around here is usually fairly cool. Varmint rifles on the other hand, I try to test in both cool and warm weather. Reason being, gophers in the summer and coyotes in the winter. Handguns, it's a comfort thing. Indoors in the winter, outdoors in the summer. - Dan
Posts: 5285 | Location: Alberta | Registered: 05 October 2001
Okay, this is the way it was explained to me: If you are going to work up loads for hunting in weather like you are having NOW...just go out and do it. But if it is only 30 degrees out and then when it comes time to hunt, it is more like 80 degrees out, you are going to have some loads that are way too hot for your rifle. There is an old story about the guy who worked up some nice loads, a little on the warm side, but not really "HOT". It was cold outside when he did this. A few weeks later, it was a bright sunny day, but still pretty cool out when he went hunting. He had put the box of bullets on top of the dashboard of his truck. The bullets sat in the warm sun and when he shot one, the gun came apart. The bullets that were fine in the cold, were way too hot when they warmed up. The message here is "BE CAREFUL".
Hey Dave, The reason I told you that " I " never shoot Test Loads below 60deg is two-fold. First off because of what the folks mentioned above. If you develop a SAFE MAX Load in real cold weather, it may or may not be SAFE as the temperature increases.
The beginning of our South Carolina Deer Season often opens when the temp is running close to 100deg. So, a Load developed at 20-30deg might not work well for me at all.
Secondly, " I " can't hold a firearm as accurately when I'm "cold", and you can see it in "my" groups. So, even if I shoot as good as I can, the groups will not reflect the true potential of those Loads.
Good luck to you!
------------------ Good hunting and clean 1-shot kills, Hot Core
Posts: 9920 | Location: Carolinas, USA | Registered: 22 April 2001
Thanks for the replies! I get the message about temperature changes from cold to hot. I generally look for the "lowest" safe charge that gives me accuracy. And I stay away from Max loads like the plague. I always go for accuracy even if velocity is on the low side.
I didn't see your post until after I posted my last reply. I appreciate all your input on this topic, just as I appreciate all the many other knowledgeable posters on this and other boards. I have changed or altered the way I do many things because of the mountains of good advice I get on them.
Likewise, when I get advice that causes me to pause and say "wait a minute here", I may decide go get a second opinion. When you posted:
"Dave: About 25-30 degrees that day. HC: Man-O-Man, that kind of weather is not what "I'd pick" to check Test Loads in. Not saying you shouldn't go shoot the rifle, but if it was me, I'd be wasting Test Loads at that Temperature. I'd recommend you wait until it gets to "at least" 60deg to do the Test Load shooting. Just go shoot those factory loads and enjoy the rifle until it warms up a bit."
The last two sentences made me want that second opinion, and so I did. Again I thank you for your very astute advice given me and I look forward to seeing more of it.
I have been shooting WW2 surplus ammo in a garand since the sixties in all temps hot to very cold and it has never failed to fire hot and true.If you are loading to factory specs it should work in any temp range that you can stand to hunt in.
Hey Dave, I'm in complete agreement with you looking for more than just one opinion. In fact, as you look back through my posts to you, I think you will find that I encourage that.
In this particular case, our weather conditions are so totally different where you live compared to where I live that my advice to "wait" just doesn't make good sense.
Best of luck to you as you "develop" those loads. (I did email your hotmail address as you requested.)
------------------ Good hunting and clean 1-shot kills, Hot Core
Posts: 9920 | Location: Carolinas, USA | Registered: 22 April 2001
One thing I will do while working up a load in winter is to keep a number of the cartridges to be fired next in my shirt pocket underneath my coat . It should keep the load on the safer side if you do end up using some of them in the summer . I also really like the idea of the Hodgdon Extreme powders for this country , and I will be going to them more amd more wherever they will fit . I've always liked Hodgdon propellents anyway ..........
Posts: 1660 | Location: Gary , SD | Registered: 05 March 2001
I agree that working up to the redline at cold temps isn't a good idea, actually not a good idea at any temp range, but especially bad when cold.
I don't think one should cease load work though, I've worked up loads in low temps, but agree, it is tough to settle down and shoot well when it gets real chilly. Fortunately our local range added a heated enclosure, so even if its down to 0, you are comfortable enough to work on loads.
I have found that loads that were accurate at cold temps, have been accurate at more enjoyable temps, but it is a rare day I test loads in temps higher then 70F
Posts: 7213 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 27 February 2001
Seems to me that cold weather would be the perfect time to work up loads for cold weather hunting [provided you handle your ammo the same way you'd do when you were hunting].
WyoMan, I have been shooting 30-06 surplus ammo since the sixties in all temps. I started loading my own ammo in 1965, mostly 38spl and 30-06 using canister powder to factory specs and it worked well in all temps hot and very cold. WC852(slow version)for 30-06,280 and 338win mag, this is what I use for my slow powder needs. WC846 for 308,303,30-30, 243 22-250 and 243 ,does well for medium speed powder needs. WC820 serves well for magnum pistol powder needs such as 44mag,41mag and 357mag. These surplus powders have worked well for me in hot and very cold temps , however,there are lot to lot burn rate differences so work your loads up slowly. For all hunting ammo,I work my loads up to factory spec velocities using a chrono,and if all looks good( no high pressure signs), and it usually does,then this load serves my needs for all temps that I can stand to hunt in. Best, Dyno
