I was sorting some 338 Lapua brass from Lapua, brand new.

We prepare all new brass by trimming it, and uniform the primer pockets.

After that we segregate them by weight to be used for specific rifles.

Segregated with 1 grain weight.

Total was 428 cases.

321 2 0.47%
322 2 0.47
323 16 3.74
324 51 11.92
325 86 20.09
326 130 30.37
327 120 28.04
328 20 4.67
330 1 0.23

hi, were they all from the same lot?
Dave

By inspection (visual estimation) that looks like a pretty decent Normal distribution. There is a little bit of a skew towards the lower side of the curve, but the majority fit in that 28+ range. I did that exercise with my local bulk supplier of cases. I took home a big tray of a couple thousand rounds and picked out 300 which were in the middle, say +/-.5 grains of the center. I saw little if any difference in firing accuracy, so I discontinued the practice.

In this case they were from the same lot as they came from a single barrel from the factory.

quote:

Originally posted by hivelosity:
hi, were they all from the same lot?
Dave

I have no idea, they came in bulk.

have you compared groups from light and heavy brass in the same caliber? if what were you results.
Dave

quote:

Originally posted by hivelosity:
have you compared groups from light and heavy brass in the same caliber? if what were you results.
Dave

No I have not, and I am certain it will make no difference.

The only reason we sort them this way is to segregate them by weight for specific rifles for consistency.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by hivelosity:
hi, were they all from the same lot?
Dave

I have no idea, they came in bulk.

They came in a bulk pack of 428?

I've always wondered just how far...to what level of experimentation...would be required to produce a number of cases that were perfectly uniform between themselves, in volume and neck tension and powder amount so each shot produced the exact same velocity...theoretically then the bullet should/would hit the exact same point, extant changing conditions and human frailties.

AND...just what effect could be measured in the wear of a barrel per shot...would that velocity be sustainable as the throat wears away...which is always a consideration.

I do understand there are limits but it would be nice to find those limits and then shoot a 1000 yd target with a 10 shot(or more) hole of bullet diameter.

Anyone ever heard of a method to measure inside case volume other than water/scale method??? Some technology outside the shooting fraternity.

I've measured many different caliber/brands of cases and found that Lapua, Norma and RWS brass to be the most uniform and hardly ever more than 1-3 gr outside depending on case size.

FWIW...

Picked up a box of Nosler 338 Lapua today...
average weight for the total 25 was 328.59 gr...5 individuals picked randomly was...

328.7
328.4
328.3
328.5
328.5
for an average of 328.49...and 5 sets of 5 each averaged within 0.1 of each other also.

This is the most uniform brass, in ALL DIMENSIONS I've come across in a long time...even better than the last 100 338Lapua I bought...slightly more expensive but NO mucking about...just prime, load powder and bullet and shoot.

It would be nice if these cases, the Berger 250 gr Hybrids, my rifle and me could all come together to produce some 2-3" 300-500 yd groups...not sure I'm up to that level any more.

Saeed,

Those are interesting results and a little surprising given that they are Lapua cases which are generally considered to be the best out there. In my experience, and where I have been concentrating my efforts recently, is to sort by neck thickness rather than by overall weight of the case. The theory behind this is that if the case is significantly thicker on one side then the whole case is generally thicker throughout its length and will not lead to good accuracy because the case is “lopsided”. Two cases can weigh the same but be significantly different in thickness. I have experimented with the two extremes taking one case that was neck thick and the other more uniform, both weighing the same, and the uniform case shot more accurately with the identical load combination in my 22-250. It was a simple non-exhaustive test but It was enough to convince me to focus on neck thickness. I use an RCBS Case Master Gauge but I think that the tool by Redding is better for this and will be purchasing it shortly. It is a more tedious process though than just weighing the cases.

Based on Nonagonagin’s comments on the Nosler brass I will have to check some 30-06 brass I purchased for its uniformity.

Keep us posted on your results, thanks

Paul

I found that Lapua, Norma and RWS to be very exacting PRIOR to the Nosler and Hornady is very good also. I'm embarrassed for not saving all the data on case/bullet/primer measurements I've done over the years to put an actual value on various items.

I've been getting 8-10 reloading's out of the Hornady 338 Lapua brass...I will now start on the Nosler brass and see how long they "live" with full loads of RL-25 and Berger 250 Hybrids at 2900-2950 fs.

I have saved Saeed's Lapua distribution...THANKS, SAEED...for future comparisons.

Yes, Paul...Non-uniform neck thickness is a major contributor to "lousy" groups...once turned AND "tuned", cases that were not all that great suddenly became very desirable....basically uniformity in ALL aspects of case prep, rifle/scope/base-ring tuning and trigger work can turn a cheap 1.5" to 2.5" rifle into a "bugholer". I've acquired many "shot out" rifles and components "in lieu of pay" "fixing" and developing loads back in the pre-1968 days.

Please post your '06 results...I have several '06 based rifles that shoot very well but have often wondered if I could eke out a bit smaller group with another brand of case...just a bit short on the readies to do it without an edge of some kind...you can give me that edge.

I did a similar test...except I wanted to know how the case brass re-distributed....using Rem 308 brass. Measured a bunch of cases, picked out 10, measured the necks, sectioned one and measured the neck and slightly above the base...thin side was still thin, thick side was still thick...used one similar case and fired it 10 times...sectioned it, the neck and base were still thick and thin but it was "evening out"(maybe only in my mind) and the group was larger than "tuned brass"...turned the necks on 4 of the remaining 8 and fired 5 groups each with a Hornady 150 gr/H4895/Rem that produced many 1/4"-1/2" groups...upshot was non-uniform, untuned cases gave ~1.5" average, tuned produced the "normal" 1/4-1/2" groups...all cases lost a little weight due to trimming...no evidence of head separation...after sectioning the cases the brass distribution seemed about the same...measuring in the "tenths".

I have noticed that when I "benchrest prep/tune" cases...fit the sizer to the chamber or now use a bushing type sizer...they have a much longer reloading life, but when "the ring" appears most are more likely to be on one side and only a few are even all the way around the periphery, which seems to indicate a thick and a thin side...

Always very satisfying to read useful and valuable, non-confrontational information.

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
FWIW...

Picked up a box of Nosler 338 Lapua today...
average weight for the total 25 was 328.59 gr...5 individuals picked randomly was...

328.7
328.4
328.3
328.5
328.5
for an average of 328.49...and 5 sets of 5 each averaged within 0.1 of each other also.

This is the most uniform brass, in ALL DIMENSIONS I've come across in a long time...even better than the last 100 338Lapua I bought...slightly more expensive but NO mucking about...just prime, load powder and bullet and shoot.

It would be nice if these cases, the Berger 250 gr Hybrids, my rifle and me could all come together to produce some 2-3" 300-500 yd groups...not sure I'm up to that level any more.

Norma produces the brass NOT Nosler.

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
I found that Lapua, Norma and RWS to be very exacting PRIOR to the Nosler and Hornady is very good also. I'm embarrassed for not saving all the data on case/bullet/primer measurements I've done over the years to put an actual value on various items.

I've been getting 8-10 reloading's out of the Hornady 338 Lapua brass...I will now start on the Nosler brass and see how long they "live" with full loads of RL-25 and Berger 250 Hybrids at 2900-2950 fs.

I have saved Saeed's Lapua distribution...THANKS, SAEED...for future comparisons.

Yes, Paul...Non-uniform neck thickness is a major contributor to "lousy" groups...once turned AND "tuned", cases that were not all that great suddenly became very desirable....basically uniformity in ALL aspects of case prep, rifle/scope/base-ring tuning and trigger work can turn a cheap 1.5" to 2.5" rifle into a "bugholer". I've acquired many "shot out" rifles and components "in lieu of pay" "fixing" and developing loads back in the pre-1968 days.

Please post your '06 results...I have several '06 based rifles that shoot very well but have often wondered if I could eke out a bit smaller group with another brand of case...just a bit short on the readies to do it without an edge of some kind...you can give me that edge.

I did a similar test...except I wanted to know how the case brass re-distributed....using Rem 308 brass. Measured a bunch of cases, picked out 10, measured the necks, sectioned one and measured the neck and slightly above the base...thin side was still thin, thick side was still thick...used one similar case and fired it 10 times...sectioned it, the neck and base were still thick and thin but it was "evening out"(maybe only in my mind) and the group was larger than "tuned brass"...turned the necks on 4 of the remaining 8 and fired 5 groups each with a Hornady 150 gr/H4895/Rem that produced many 1/4"-1/2" groups...upshot was non-uniform, untuned cases gave ~1.5" average, tuned produced the "normal" 1/4-1/2" groups...all cases lost a little weight due to trimming...no evidence of head separation...after sectioning the cases the brass distribution seemed about the same...measuring in the "tenths".

I have noticed that when I "benchrest prep/tune" cases...fit the sizer to the chamber or now use a bushing type sizer...they have a much longer reloading life, but when "the ring" appears most are more likely to be on one side and only a few are even all the way around the periphery, which seems to indicate a thick and a thin side...

Always very satisfying to read useful and valuable, non-confrontational information.

NONAGONAGIN

Sorry for the delay. Here are the results of measuring the weight of 50 new Nosler brass in 30-06.

Format is Weight....Number of cases....Percent of total

178.8---1---2%
179.0---13---26%
179.2---8---16%
179.4---12---24%
179.6---12---24%
179.8---3---6%
180.0---1---2%

90% of the brass weigh within 0.6 grains which I think is pretty good. I checked case neck thickness and none of them really varied much over about 0.002" with the two high and low extreme weight pieces having the greatest thickness variation. The primer pockets are milled flat as I could not cut anything in the pocket with my Sinclair PP uniformer. Length of the cases was about spot on uniform with the shortest case at 2.4775" and the longest at 2.484" varying only 0.291" and 0.0065" shorter than recommended trim length.. When I primed them the primer pockets were very tight. I did notice that the inside chamfer was very slightly lopsided on them. Overall I think the Nosler brass based on this sample is probably worth the extra money.

Thanks
Paul

Thank you gentlemen.

Who make Nosler brass?

Cheers, Chris