I hear there are issues with 220swift brass, but havn't heard a specific instance. What ypes of problems are common to reloading the swift?

Anyone with a good recipe?

I am about to purchase the dies for this rig, and could use a jump start on some decent powders and bullets to twist down a 1:14 26" heavy barrel.

Thanks

[ 03-25-2003, 18:39: Message edited by: JustC ]

The 100 pc lot of WW .220 Swift brass that I just got from Graf is some of the best I have seen. The necks are very uniform in wall thickness and in general the brass was not dented etc. The necks were a snug fit in my throat so you should check that.

I would not buy any long bullets. I think the 55 Blitz Kings are too long for my 1-14.

I would use the brass I mentioned, CCI Br primers, IMR 4064 powder and get some Nosler 40 gr BT's and 50 Gr Sierra spitzers. Full power loads of 1/2 MOA or better are common with this cartridge.

I have a Rem. ss varmint with a 26in/1-14 barrel.
My swift really likes IMR4350 and H414. One of the best shooting bullets in this swift is the 53gr. Sierra HP. Also, 55Gr.Sierra SP and 52gr. Speer HP. Any of these work great on coyotes and that what I mostly use the swift for.
Call em in close_____Pete

Pete, that's the rifle I have. Any chance you would throw me a recipe with both powders???

I also have several of those bullets you mentioned

Thanks.

The problem isn't with the new brass. The problem arrises after several firings. The brass seems to flow a lot more than in normal cartridges and causes the necks to thicken. Sometimes the thickened necks can get to large for the rifle chamber.
Measure the neck dimension of fired brass and make sure all reloads are less than this dimension and you should be fine.
John

I haven't had a lot of problems with the brass other than it stretching. After all it is a higher pressure round.
My Swift likes the 52 grain Sierra HP with 41.8 grains of IMR4350. It's Winchester brass and Fed210M primers.

Bob257

All of my 14" twisted Swifts eagerly digested R/P brass fueled with 39.5grs of Re-15 and a 55gr V-Max/Ballistic Tip. I like CCI 200's.

I trimmed every other firing,just so nothing got out of hand and to avoid pressure spikes.

As per usual,start low and work up.

The Swifts and my 22CHeetah Mach Ones were what I relied upon most,prior to the advent of the portable(small) laser rangefinders.

I never had a Swift that didn't dazzle..............

I don't buy the notion that .220 Swift cases stretch or necks thicken any more than any other similar cartridge cases. The shoulder is sharper than a .308 Winchester for instance. I use RCBS FL dies only with a Hornady carbide expanding button. This is my third Swift dating from 1965.

This cartridge is commonly overloaded and when a over max load is fired the brass flows in all cartridges. I load 39 grs of 4064 with 50 gr Blitx Kings and little trimming and no neck thickening is evident.

This cartridge is the King of the old style .22 CF's and takes the slow twist (1-14) and short bullet technology to it's limit.

Case design has much to do with brass flowing forward. The Swift's "undoing" is it's copious body taper(double the amount of the 308Win) and relative slow shoulder angle. Both working in harmony,flow brass.

The typical Ackley Improved Swift(40 degree) negates that affect,I've seen it,as pards shoot that chambering.

I love the Swift very much,it is fabulous. But she remains prone to difficulties associated with it's design.

Size and trim with sense and she'll pay dividends,while granting long case life..................

Just C,
The IMR4350 load is fine in my rifle but is out of a Speer manual printed back in the early 60's (when men were men and loading data got the velocity they said they did). That said I use 45grs. of IMR4350/53-55gr. moly coated bullet, Win. brass, CCI#200 primers for 3780fps. I'd rather not give the H414 load because mine is an extremely slow burning lot I bought about 15yrs. ago.
The 300rds. of swift brass(Win.) I bought 4yrs. ago had necks that ran up to .019 side wall. I turned all of it to .016. And yes it does grow in lenght. No big deal, just keep on top of it.
Call em in close____Pete

Thanks everyone so far,...This is my first swift,and I can see me being "friendly" with this caliber for a few rifles to come.

Pete, thanks for that recipe also.

[ 03-27-2003, 06:24: Message edited by: JustC ]

It's not "working in harmony" nor case taper or shoulder angle. It's overloading that exceeds the yield strength of the brass and neck sizing with improper lube and expanding buttons that have a poor finish.

The body taper of the 22-250 is 50% greater than that of the Swift so that should stretch even more! We all know that if we load any of these cartridges light we can just neck size them forever. It's over loading and sloppy dies that does it.

The Swift will take more pressure than the 22-250 case also as it has a much stronger web. Saw them in half and see.

In any event if the Swift and Varminter were invented today we would rejoice as we could get rid of those heavy range estimating devices and just hold on. What a concept!

If you wanna shoot a Swift -P-,then you can alleviate some trim issues. But when I want 223 velocities,I personally opt a 223.

The 22-250 responds very nicely to being Improved also. It nips the same issues in the buds and enhances capacity as well. Both good things IMHO and that's why I built two of them.

The Swift flows more,due to it's longer body. The squattier 22-250 resists that tendency a little better,despite having it's fair share of body taper.

Improve either of the two and that flow all but stops,in a direct comparison(meaning like pressures).

I could not surmise on what you'd term as a "heavy" device,but would comment that I'm 100% content to tote my 10 ounce Leica 1200LRF with me,so as to know an exact range determination in all situations.

10 ounces of weight is a very easy tradeoff for determining EXACT range,as compared to a wild assed guess................

Just a clever comment on range finders at the time. It read good last night. You could call that green with envy or indifferance. If you were here you would see that there are not that many opportunities for long shots. It seems however that range finders have made an entirely new shooting hobby. I rate it far better than fast draw that I ignored also.

Maybe my loads are only at .223 AI levels. I don't care. I care where the first shot goes and most of my shots are under 300 yds on varmints which a 223 would just get by on.

I have a no miss policy with my .219 K-Zipper. So I get as close as I can. I load that rifle light so that the barrel will last for years longer. You see the rifle is, to me, a work of art and I don't want to have to rebarrel it. I have been satisfied with a 50 gr bullet a 3600 fps for 40 years now. If such and such a smaller cartridge will equal that is a moot point to me.

I really appreciate your efforts being at the cutting edge. I think that most of us however just like being out there with the rifle of their choice.

I read that one of my cars will go around a corner about as fast as any on the road. It should as the tires are 275 40 ZR17's. I don't test that. It's just my way.

I like my digits and other appendages and am not hellbent on wrecklessly injuring my person. Point bein',eeking available performance much interests me,but not at the cost of wreckless abandon(stupidity).

I'm not the type to build a 22-284 and load it down to Hornet velocities. Others may favor that route and that's there business,as the option exists.

My reason for employing a Swift,was not to duplicate velocities safely yielded in less capacious offerings. When the Swift was my bread and butter round,it was for a coupla reasons. Foremost was that it's sizzling velocity,aided trajectory and without viable means of range determination,it were a guessing game. I found I guess better,when trajectories are flattened. Simply more "margin" for error,as speed minimizes the magnitude of trajectory corrections.

Same reasons I built several 22-250AI's and a coupla 22CHeetah's.

I have found that with the advent of the laser and 100% accurate range determination,that less intensity chamberings were granted new life. My preference is Leupold scopes wearing an elevation turret and with accurate range determination and modest atmospheric conditions,first round connect percentages have skyrocketed with what most would term as "sedate" rounds. Damned great bullets help things across the board and are eagerly welcomed.

With a laser,I'm quite content with the 223AI,for most Vermin dispatch. I've largely aborted the bigger 22's,as the 223AI is so grand. When I want more(performance),I usually opt a 243AI or hop on the 25cal bandwagon. That when remaining energies are important and the 25-06AI and 257Wby's are 100% Sinister,but that deviates from the crux of this Thread.

I've much familiarity with the Swift and had many rifles so chambered. It can't be argued,that it is a fabulous chambering. She simply has the capacity to do great things with ease and every example I owned showed an eager penchant to produce exceptional accuracy.

My point was/is,that the cartridge warrants monitoring case stretch/growth(whatever term one prefers). One can easily extract exceptional performance out of a 22 that capacious,without breakneck pressures. That's the role in which that cartridge personally interests me. Also the reason I favor Re-15 in that hull.

But briefly touching again on the 223AI,it is the chambering I most dote upon. 50's will do over 3700fps and 40's will easily break 4000fps,both with H-335 and moly(which I employ in all diameters). That level of performance can most certainly be eclipsed,but it takes a far bigger motor to soundly trump it.

For those bullet weights mentioned,I believe the 223AI to be a supreme vehicle,as it has a meager propellant appetite and brass is damned near free. Those attributes coupled with it's most respectable performance,has totally entranced me and I view it as a path of very little resistance and total happiness.

I take hitting stuff fairly serious and make strides to hedge a bet. The laser is the implement that has upped that percentage the greatest and that without question............

So....a thread set-back and an ackley shoulder would help my brass life and boost the pressures to a level consistent with a 60gr missle launcher. Kewl.....

Brass for the swift does not exactly come cheap. Damn manufacturers think a few more grains of powder is worth a 75% price hike....

I have had a lot of luck with Varget in my Swifts.
Also I had what was called a 220 wilson arrow in OZ ,which puts a sharper shoulder on a Swift case with less body taper.

I do not like 4064 in the Swift as I have found you get higher pressure with less velocity than Varget.
Good luck,
Charlie.

At grafs 22-250 brass is $22.99/c and the Swift is $26.19/c. This seems to be in line for what you get.

That can't be the price for Norma brass? If it is, or if they have it cheaper than most places,..please forward any info on how I may contact them.

Thanks.

Charlie, I will be trying some Varget now as well. Much obliged

[ 03-28-2003, 06:42: Message edited by: JustC ]

Exactly what Big Stick said. 39.6 gr of RL15, 55GR V-max and CCI 200 primers. SMOKIN DEATH!!!

Personally I'd not look for more capacity than the Sswift,unless high BC(VLD) projectiles were at the front of my thoughts. Your 14" twisted tube does not lend that option and I'd forget the Swift Improved notion for light projectile applications.

My advice would be to enjoy whatcha got and shoot her 'til she pukes. With a smidge of sense,that'll be a whole damned bunch of shooting.
Point being,one can punish a barrel from any chambering,or a guy can grant it a little leeway.

I mean if you grant your Swift a smidge of courtesy,by the time it pukes,you'll know full well what you crave next. That as far as case capacity within that projectile diameter or perhaps an alternate twist rate on the second tube,or hell even something of another diameter altogether.

So rather than fret the future,I'd be inclined to maximize existing possibilities(regarding your current twist rate and fine tuning propellant selection).

That brings me full circle to R/P brass/Re-15 and 50 or 55gr V-Max. Norma brass is too spotty for me,regarding "hardness". Some of it is great,others not worth a shit and VERY soft. I aborted it's use,for those reasons.

For no bullshit,rip-snorting excellence,the Swift is difficult to top. She becomes even sweeter with today's projectiles and propellants. Pay some attention to brass issues,show your barrel a little respect and a guy can flat have a helluva alotta fun punishing critters and eek long component and barrel life doing so.

To help your project,shoot me a PM and I'll give you a 220 Swift Forster Ultra Bullet Seater(part # U00028) for your new found Swift. It is a fabulous product and I'd be glad to send it to you,as a token of gratitude for our scope dealings.

A great cartridge,is most deserved of a great seating die and the Forster capably tackles that issue....................

37.5 grains of IMR 4064 in a winchester case with WLR primers using the Sierra 55grain Spitzer BT. Rifle is a Remington 220 Swift VSSF with a trigger job. Accuracy is commonly 1/2 MOA or better. Scope is a Leupold 6.5-20x40MM.

Since I wrote above how uniform the WW Swift brass is neck wise I primed a large lot with tool new to me, the Lee Auto prime 11. This allows a much better feel than my old system.

I was disappointed that many of the primers went in very hard and others were normal. I "qualify" all of the pockets with a Sinclair type primer pocket bottoming tool but not the pockets diameter. Nor did I measure the CCI BR2 primers.

Also the extractor groove varied so much on this lot of new WW brass that I could not get some of them into the Lee shell holder. I don't blame the shell holder as the brass should at least be consistant.

I am going to look at other brands I am embarrassed to say.

I don't find I trim my .220 swift brass any more than I do my .338 Win Mag brass. To check for thick necks I slide a bullet into a fired/unsized case. If it grabs because of a tight fit I would retire it because too much brass has flowed forward. I saw would because it has yet to happen.

R Walter-
What velocity are you getting with your load, mine is identical with a hornady 55gr SP. Shoots about 1/2" and loves porcupines.