I am having a tough time deciding on what bullet to choose for my 300 WSM, for long range elk hunting,

The BC of the TSX is lower, but

- would you choose the 180 Accubond, or the 165 or 180 TSX?

- will both penetrate the same at long distance lower velocities?

Keep in mind, I have previous experience with Accubonds, but no experience with TSX,

Thoughts?

Maxx,I would choose the 180 TSX.You should have seen the shot I took at my caribou this year with the 300 win Mag and the 180TSX. A 250 yd offhand shot that smacked him at 3147 fps in the shoulder area.It was an instant kill,with the legs just giving out and him dropping.I also found a TSX bullet at the range last weekend that someone shot into the mound of sand.It showed a picture perfect mushroom.

quote:

Originally posted by Maxx:
I am having a tough time deciding on what bullet to choose for my 300 WSM, for long range elk hunting,

The BC of the TSX is lower, but

- would you choose the 180 Accubond, or the 165 or 180 TSX?

- will both penetrate the same at long distance lower velocities?

Keep in mind, I have previous experience with Accubonds, but no experience with TSX,

Thoughts?

I haven't used either bullet on elk, but I would tend to want a bullet with a relatively "soft" nose for long range use, so it would expand reliably after slowing down! Now, the TSX may do that, but I KNOW the Nosler Partition bullet will, and that bullet will also give deep penetration at ALL ranges. Nosler states that the Accubond is designed to behave the same way the Partition bullet does on impact. But I have not tested Accubonds to determine how true this claim is. However, Accubonds have great ballistic properties, and so will retain their initial velocity longer than the Partition type. So will those TSX's!

Personally, I would use the 200-grain Nosler Partition bullet, because I know from past experience that it works on elk!

One thing about the WSM is the longer bullets rob powder capacity due to the short mag lengths in the sa rifles chambered for them. I'd stick with the 165s or 168s if I went TS since the 180s are so long. I feel the added velocity you will get with the 165 TS will make up for the small BC difference between it and the 180 NAB.

I was able to push the 180ABs in a 300WSM to around 2950 while in the same rifle I got the 165 HDYs safely to 3200+. That was mainly due to the powder capacity robbed by the longer 180 ABs.

My 2 cents...


Good Luck

Reloader

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Maxx,I would choose the 180 TSX.You should have seen the shot I took at my caribou this year with the 300 win Mag and the 180TSX. A 250 yd offhand shot that smacked him at 3147 fps in the shoulder area.It was an instant kill,with the legs just giving out and him dropping.I also found a TSX bullet at the range last weekend that someone shot into the mound of sand.It showed a picture perfect mushroom.

I assume that is your muzzle vel.? Did you get complete penetration & what did the exit wound look like? For long range, past 300yds, I would think the NAB will expand a bit more than the TSX but I haven't taken game w/ either. Someone enlighten me.

I load the 168gr TSX for a friends Browning Abolt in 300wsm. We get around 3100+fps, and it works very well on elk. He killed a cow elk a few years ago at a lasered 468yds, and she collapsed at the impact and rolled down the hill. Classic Barnes performance.

I have used Barnes X, XLC or TSX exclusively for elk since about 1992. I have no experience with the Accubond.

I killed an elk at 420yds with the Accubond, another last fall with the 180TSX 347yds. Both DRT, 300win. The Accubond did not exit the TSX did.

I have yet to shoot 180 TSX at big game-justy atthe range out of my 300WM. But I do use the 180gr Accubonds. Moose out to 300 metres with double lung complete pass-thru's. In 2004 I shot a Mulie buck quartering away at 44 metres, and recovered the bullet in far front hide of the shoulder. An hour later I took a sweet whitetail @ 554 metres, double lung complete pass-thru. Elk out to 250 metres.

I am really impressed with the Accubonds i 140gr out of the Tikka T3 270WSM. My wife got her bull moose this past season on the last morning taken @ 325 metres. She took 2 shots. The first was definately a kill shot but I told her to shoot again as the bull tried to make it to the timber line. oth shots were double lung, complete pass-thru. The bull went about 20 metres and dropped right at the edge of the timber (sure was glad not to have to work to get the moose out of the timber).

I have shot the TSX at the range in my 300WM with good groups. Watching some of the video footage of the Barnes TSX thru gel media, looks impressive.

For me right now though, I'm sticking with the Accubonds. I think 165gr would be a great choice also for the 300WSM , as mentioned you will get more powder.

Maxx, I think the first thing we need to do here is define "long range." To me, it starts roughly at 600 yards.

If you are referring to 500 and under, I personally don't think you or the elk would know the difference so long as you put the bullet in front of the diaphragm.

However, I do believe that the short necked short mags are better balanced with the 165-168 class bullet in 30 cal, over the 180. I'm with Reloader on this.

I wouldn't have any reservations whatsoever hitting a bull elk in the shoulder at over 300 yards with the Barnes bullet. I'd be more apprehensive to launch the soft nosed AB at the bone at those distances fearing of lack of penetration. This is a hunch, not experience.

I think a Barnes 168 TSX is in the same class as a 180 or 200 AB for penetration from the same caliber, given the velocity differences.

At 400 or so yards and under, worring about the BC is, IMO, kind of a waste of time.

long range 500 - 750 yards

Ok. John Burnes did quite a bit of testing of the Barnes X, and the Barnes XLC bullet to 700 yards from his modified 7STW. He found that the 150 grain bullet penetrated some wet phone books between 29 and 33" at that distance. I do not remember his MV. Regardless, penetration wasn't an issue, and he still had great mushroomed bullets.

It isn't an elk, I know, but it is a reasonable test.

Between the 600 and 750 yard mark, I'd opt for the better BC bullet for overall trajectory performance.

Honestly, I'm really on the fence on this one. Perhaps you should load up both and test them in some media at 700 yards.

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Maxx,I would choose the 180 TSX.You should have seen the shot I took at my caribou this year with the 300 win Mag and the 180TSX. A 250 yd offhand shot that smacked him at 3147 fps in the shoulder area.It was an instant kill,with the legs just giving out and him dropping.I also found a TSX bullet at the range last weekend that someone shot into the mound of sand.It showed a picture perfect mushroom.

I assume that is your muzzle vel.? Did you get complete penetration & what did the exit wound look like? For long range, past 300yds, I would think the NAB will expand a bit more than the TSX but I haven't taken game w/ either. Someone enlighten me.

fredj338,sorry the 3147 load was used by my partner in the rifle he borrowed.I used a 3000fps load for this kill.The exit wound was not visible and I thought that the bullet remained inside until I brought the caribou to the butcher.There I saw that the bullet exited high on the opposite shoulder and broke the ribs about three inches below the spine.There was an area the size of a 6 inch circle that was really damaged on the exiting chest wall.The exit wound was about the size of a dollar coin if I remember corectly.I gutted the caribou real quick in the field and don't remember exactly the damage to the lung.My second caribou was shot in the head as it was facing me from 100yds.The bullet broke the skull penetrated the length of the body and exited between the hind quarters.Both quarters were really damaged and not much meat was gotten from them.My partner tried shooting offhand at the 250 yard distance and out of recklessly firing 10 or 12 shots at two standing caribou, manged to break the leg on one. I quickly shot it in the neck as it stood to end its suffering.The neck shot killed it instantly as the bullet passed through its neck taking plenty of blood out with it.I noticed the tsx bullets don't leave large exit holes on the caribou shot.The shot that hit the bou in the upper leg compltely severed it.It made a clean break in the bone.My conclusion is that at 3000-3147fps, the 180gr TSX open fast, stays together to complete the job with unstoppable penetration.BTW,the rifle I lent to my partner was my most accurate rifle.It puts the 3147fps TSX load into a single whole at 200yds.I am sure it is just as accurate at 300yds.

Maxx I shot a 355" bull this fall with 165 tsx's. 207yds. running 1 pass through, found 1 under off side hide looked like the brochure. 300wsm started at 3050fps not hot but groups very well. 180 accubonds also do well out of this rifle but haven't shot anything but paper with them, 3000fps. elk went 40 yds. 1 through the lungs and 1 through the heart.

I'd go with the Barnes, hands down. Have used both in Africa - not extensively, but did get 4 animals with the Accubond and 7 with the Triple Shocks over 3 trips. Accubonds in the 338 performed surprisingly poorly on both zebra and eland. The PH asked if I had any other ammo I could use, and if so to please begin using it immediately. Poor penetration was the problem.

I think the Triple Shocks are the better bullet. Opened reliably and penetrated deeply (exited, generally) at ranges from 50 - 250 yards.

H T,

That is good information to know. I also had a major penetration problem with the 140 from a 270 on a mulie at less than 50 yards. It was my first time to ever use that exact bullet/caliber combo. Not a good first experience for a soft tissue shot.

I am also a great fan of the 200 GR. Nosler for long range shooting, it kills like the hammer of Thor, penetration is awesome as is internal damage and blood trails are good.

It has a great trajectory even though it starts out slower, it holds its velocity better than lighter bullets. Expansion at any range is reliable. I tried about everything before settleing on the 200 gr. Nosler.

I have been shooting elk and deer for years with this bullet in my old 300 H&H, and it has been to Africa many times and has shot Impala to large Eland without a flaw. I loaned to a lady who shot her Cape Buffalo with it with good results and a friend of mine in Twin Falls, has shot everything in Africa with that combo or the 220 gr. Woodleighs in his old Rem 722 in 300 H&H.

Maxx :

Try the mrx bullets from barnes it has a higher

bc than the tsx . They shoot alittle better

for me than the tsx out of my 300 wsm.