I had a bunch of brass in the oven at 150 drying it. The oven was turned off (not sure how).

My wife went to cook dinner, didn't look in the oven and it got to almost 400 F before she noticed.

It did tarnish the brass, but is there a risk that any annealing occurred? I read the transition point is 482 F.

It's scrap metal now.
If I put brass in my wife's oven I would not have to worry about it at all. First priority would be the 8 inch chef's knife buried in my chest.

Yep scrap metal for me.

That's what I was afraid of. Better safe than sorry. I know there is an annealing paint that reacts at 475, so I figured 400 or below was safe.

I have enough of all the brass, except for the dang 358 Norma brass. And you can't find that anymore. Now, will I ever need more than 75 rounds loaded at once (the good brass I have)? Probably never and I can alway make it for from another belted mag.

I would try one. Start with light load using H4895, 5744, etc.

I'm not sure a brief trip up to 400° would ruin brass.

What calibers? I might volunteer to try one for you.

quote:

Originally posted by delloro:
I would try one. Start with light load using H4895, 5744, etc.

I'm not sure a brief trip up to 400° would ruin brass.

What calibers? I might volunteer to try one for you.

300 WBY, 308 Win, 35 Whelen, and 358 Norma

Eric,
After that little "mishap" did you still get to eat dinner that night, and I don't mean takeaway food ?

Of course my response was, "I look in the oven every time I turn it on."

Don't know if I caught something on fire when I was a kid, but it's burned into my subconscious.

Check the oven!

Sort like a gun - treat every gun as loaded and every oven as if there is something in it!

quote:

Originally posted by delloro:
I would try one. Start with light load using H4895, 5744, etc.

I'm not sure a brief trip up to 400° would ruin brass.

What calibers? I might volunteer to try one for you.

There has been tarnishing of the brass which indicates it has been changed in someway by the heat. The cook up in the oven may not have reached the annealing point but while a crack in the shoulder or neck area as a result of firing a cartridge does no harm, a head separation or separation along the main body of a case is a different story and has potential to cause damage to the firearm or shooter, let alone the problem of removing the remaining piece of headless case in the chamber. The later problem not good if out on a hunt.
Bit of a bugger to lose the cases but better to have peace of mind and work with known good brass.

I believe that 400 F is not a problem. But to be sure, I would:

Take samples of "oven processed" and unprocessed brass and send it for hardness testing to anyone with apropriace testing equipment.

Or test its hardness or strength by any other way.

Jiri

quote:

Originally posted by Austin Hunter:

300 WBY, 308 Win, 35 Whelen, and 358 Norma

Ouch!

If the case heads were in 1/2" of water they would be fine. The rest of the case doesnt matter. Soft case heads are no good though.
You could try working up your charge and measuring the case heads to see where they begin to stretch. But that would be a lot of fiddeling around and the testing would have to be thorough. Even if they held up to a full power charge the primer pockets would likely not last. Probably best to chalk it up to bad luck and move on.

You'll be fine.

Here's a test. Squeeze a suspect case and a good case against each other in a vise. If they deform equally, they are similarly work hardened.

I question the validity of that "test".
And I also recommend that Brass, and Ovens, should NEVER come into contact with one another. I never understood why anyone would put brass into an oven. I know, to save time drying it. I usually have more time than that.

I would measure before and again after; I have no clue what a reloader would be looking for when measuring case head expansion after annealing the case head. I do not anneal case heads.

F. Guffey

I'm not a metallurgist but have done research on annealing because I do it on a very regular basis.

My premise is that it's NOT annealed because you didn't reach the critical temperature to do so.

Hot brass is NOT annealed brass. To actually change it on a molecular level, the temp needs to be around 600+ degrees F to have an effect (I anneal at 750 for about 8 seconds).

Brass can be annealed, cooled and annealed immediately again over and over and it changes nothing, in other words, it's not OVER annealed. This has been scientifically proven.

In MY opinion, it's not annealed, therefore it's not ruined.

Zeke

I do not anneal case heads and then I measure before and again after. If you do not know how to measure before and again after and if you do not know what to look for, you can assume. I do not assume.

F. Guffey

Id recommend a suit of Armour, with gloves and a deep sea divers helmit crawl inside a 55 gallon drum, pray several hail Marys and two our fathers,scream like a banshee and pull the trigger.
Adios amigo mio

You could however saw the heads off and use them for buttons on your safari jacket!!

iirc a case see's about 600-F briefly when it's fired.

they always tarnish in the oven, I tried it once and ain't ever doin it again.

Just for the Hell of it, I would call Star-line Brass and ask them. I would not necessarily tell them you had done it.... because of liability, they might just tell you to scrap it to cover their ass. I would just ask them what would be the max temp that a rifle case can reach, and for how long, before softening of the case head area would occur. They would probably tell you a range and that would be great, Hell, we would probably all like to know!

quote:

Originally posted by lee440:
Just for the Hell of it, I would call Star-line Brass and ask them. I would not necessarily tell them you had done it.... because of liability, they might just tell you to scrap it to cover their ass. I would just ask them what would be the max temp that a rifle case can reach, and for how long, before softening of the case head area would occur. They would probably tell you a range and that would be great, Hell, we would probably all like to know!

I agree^^^

The safe answer (throw them away) is probably not the correct answer (you didn't reach the temp needed to change the brass on a molecular level so the base isn't annealed).

I've been starting to play with a new wildcat so I had to turn the necks a bit, neck down a little step, then neck down all the way, turn to correct neck wall thickness.

With all that working and cutting, they needed to be annealed last night to 750 degrees. Anything below that is just hot brass... like what comes out of a full auto rifle... or even a rapid fire semi-auto!

Obviously YOU DO WHATEVER YOU WANT and listen to whomever you want but a couple calls to brass manufacturers would put this to bed for you sir.

Zeke

When annealing its best to paint the shoulder andneck with that stuff who I can never remember the name as I anneal so seldom..Its easier to toss a 100 or so cases and buy new ones these days, at least so far..I only anneal old win cases of hard to locate brass for instance.

I asked Starline, they said no issue. Don't worry until 465 or higher.

To keep this from happening to me along with keeping a butcher knife out of my back, I spent $100 on a dehydrator. Drys brass at 140ºF and has a fan to move air. Also keeps me out of the house.

quote:

Originally posted by Barry B.:
To keep this from happening to me along with keeping a butcher knife out of my back, I spent $100 on a dehydrator. Drys brass at 140ºF and has a fan to move air. Also keeps me out of the house.

Yeah, I have a dehydrator as well. Better setup in the garage

I put the wet brass in a small cookie sheet on top of my oil burner.

Hip

Have had some of the same drying issues.....

We have a new kitchen stove/oven. I dried just cleaned/wet brass by setting the oven temp to 175 F. Yes, i looked in the oven first. Warned spouse to leave it alone. :-) After an hour or so, shut off the oven and let the brass cool in the oven. No color changes.

Had 55 just-cleaned 223 cases. Shook em to get rid of most of the water. Put them in our Ninja Max air fryer. It has a 'dehydrate' function. set the temp at 175 F [was the minimum setting] and the timer to 2 hours. Worked well.

As of lately my physical well-being has not been threatened.

quote:

Originally posted by Austin Hunter:
I asked Starline, they said no issue. Don't worry until 465 or higher.

Exactly as I suspected based on the temp needed to actually anneal brass.

Thanks for the update!

Zeke

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
When annealing its best to paint the shoulder andneck with that stuff who I can never remember the name as I anneal so seldom..Its easier to toss a 100 or so cases and buy new ones these days, at least so far..I only anneal old win cases of hard to locate brass for instance.

Tempilaq is the stuff and you can buy it in different temp sensitivities.

Zeke

My simple way. Dry partially in bigger towel and put on the heating. That old style heating works beautifully.

All that said, whats the reasoning behind broiling ones brass in an oven?? seems superfluous?

As to annealing most seem to recommend waiting until necks start splitting??but I use a turn table annealer given to me by Norman for off ball brass..By the time I need annealing on 06,270 etc its time to buy another 100 or 2 and start over. But just speaking for myself, not recommending anything, just another way to skin cat..

I like Jiri's idea of putting the cases out to dry. It certainly works when I wash cases in white gas and I would think water would evaporate overnight in warm circumstances.

quote:

Originally posted by Austin Hunter:
I asked Starline, they said no issue. Don't worry until 465 or higher.

Domestic oven thermostats are not always particularly accurate. How do we know it only got to an 'actual' 400F. Not much of a leeway between 400F and 465F. Starline will be talking in accurately measured temperature not degrees maybe in a domestic oven.

Still not my ammo or rifle, load'er up and shoot

Perhaps AustinHunter could ask his wife if she thinks the oven is up to the dial's temperature marks. Mine always complains that ours is 'slow'.

Our oven reads high - temp lower than reading