Looking for some advice.

Recently, my father gave me his S&W model 36 chief's special. he carried it as a back up gun when he was a police officer in the 70's. he bought it in the late 60's and its been shot very little.

i planned on loading for it, and bought some lead swc. but, i wanted to carry it, and therefore bought some factory rounds to test through it. bought a box of 115 federal hyrda-shocks, and a box of buffalo bore 158 grain lswc hollow points. both are standard pressure rounds, not the +p rounds.

shot the federals first. i noticed, when ejecting the rounds, that one of the cases was particularly tight coming out. i shot a few cylinders, and each time, it seems that there was a case that was difficult to remove. when i shot 5 of the buffalo bore bullets, there was a case that came out about 1/4", then i practically needed pliers to pull it out the rest of the way. when i got it out, i noticed that there was a split in the wall of the case, and it was bulged a little.

clearly, something's wrong. i don't want to shoot it until its looked at, and i certainly don't want to carry it yet.

any advice as to what could cause this? i gave the gun a good cleaning before shooting. can't see anything obvious in the chambers.

is this something that can be fixed?

My thought is that it is not the gun but the ammo. Try shooting the buffalo bores in a different gun. You may have one chamber in the cylinder that may be a little rough. Try marking it with a felt tip pen and shoot again.
Peter.

Are the rounds you shot in it nickel plated cases? These are notorious when reloaded for splitting. I would try some regular brass cased ammunition in it.

Try 148 HBWC with a brass case. If you still get a split and extraction problems with that one chamber then it is bulged. Sorry.

If a bulge it can probably only be fixed with a new cylinder. Just remember to sawp over your existing ejector star.

You'll also need to know it is a 36, 36-1 or 36-2 stamped inside the crane.

I'd look through the cylinder in good light and verify that you don't have a bulged chamber.



AD

You can tell somtimes from the position of th split. Is it from mthe case mouth down about a third or half way, or is in from just above the case head going up to BUT NOT REACHING the case mouth?

If it is the last of these you have a bulged chamber.

thanks for the info, guys..

i've not actually loaded for this gun yet - the rounds i was shooting were factory rounds.

the one that got the split was a brass case - a 158 grain standard pressure buffalo bore lswc hollowpoint.

what would cause a bulge in the chamber? this is an older gun, but it hasn't been shot much at all.

here's a pic of the buffalo bore case - sorry, its the best i can do with a camera phone..

well, i called smith and wesson, and the tech told me that it may well just be the ammunition.

he said that those older guns just aren't up to shooting this "new" ammo. i thought the buffalo bore was a standard pressure load designed for guns like this.. anyway, he recommended that i simply pick up a 158 grain ball ammo to use.

i pressed it a little, saying that i wanted to be sure it was safe to use, and he said i could send it in if i liked, and they would look at it, as a cylinder replacement would be a factory job anyway, if that's what it needed.

he said about $170 round trip for a new cylinder. about a 6 week turnaround.

not sure that the $170 wouldn't be better spent as a down payment for a new j frame that can handle today's loads?

quote:

Originally posted by harvester:
well, i called smith and wesson, and the tech told me that it may well just be the ammunition.

he said that those older guns just aren't up to shooting this "new" ammo. i thought the buffalo bore was a standard pressure load designed for guns like this.. anyway, he recommended that i simply pick up a 158 grain ball ammo to use.

Hey Harvester, That was absolutely excellent advice concerning the "older" S&Ws. They simply weren't made for +P or some of the current factory ammo.

That doesn't mean it is a bad revolver. They were designed to be very light and in order to keep them from shaking apart, the Loads need to be light as well.

quote:

i pressed it a little, saying that i wanted to be sure it was safe to use, and he said i could send it in if i liked, and they would look at it, as a cylinder replacement would be a factory job anyway, if that's what it needed.

If anyone has been shooting +P Loads through it, that is what I would do. Too nice of a revolver to set it back and not use, but also questionable about what it has been subjected to. It may have had +P Loads shot through it - with or without your Father's knowledge - if one of his buddies shot it.

Had a buddy damage an older Rossi with +P Loads about 20 years ago. They repaired it, but it clearly stated in their Manual not to use +P Loads. It was a clone of the older S&Ws.

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he said about $170 round trip for a new cylinder. about a 6 week turnaround.

That seems like a very reasonable price "if" the cylinder has been damaged. But, it might not need replacing.

quote:

not sure that the $170 wouldn't be better spent as a down payment for a new j frame that can handle today's loads?

I understand your problem. No doubt the current generation of S&Ws is w-a-y ahead of the older models when it comes to strength. Some would not be near as nice as the old one for concealed carry though.
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The Case Rupture could be as simple as a Case being "too Hard", or it could be that the cylinder is damaged. I've also had some new factory ammo have Case Splits and there is not always an easy answer.

Ammonia based solvents(Windex with Ammonia D, etc.) can create Brass Embrittlement. And sometimes an old Case will simply split.

So, I'm reluctant to tell you to go on and shoot regular 38Spl factory Ammo or non +P Reloads, because we really don't know what the revolver has been subjected to over the years. That does NOT mean your Father treated it badly, it is simply that we don't know if +P was used in it - years ago.
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If it was mine, I'd probably let the factory folks give it their blessing. And if it needed a new cylinder, I'd probably stick the money in it and use it as it was intended, with non +P Loads.

Then if I wanted to get an additional, stronger revolver, I'd either keep the old one and just buy a new one outright, or swap the old one in.

Best of luck to you.

I would try some standard Remington or Winchester ammunition - 148 grain Hollow Base Wadcutter if you can get it. If you still get the split then the chamber is bulged.

Will the case go easily into any of the other four chambers on the cylinder?

$170 seems a bargain to me for a replacement cylinder factory fitted by S & W. They will also be able to check all the other dimensions on your gun and give it a clean bill of health.

thanks for the advice, guys..

i'm pretty sure there must be a bulge in the chamber.

i indexed the chambers with a marker. i confirmed that it was the same chamber that was acting up each time.

shot two cylinders. didn't have any more factory rounds on hand, so i shot some mild loads of blue dot with a 125 grain xtp, and a 158 grain lswc.

didn't get another split case, but the case for both loads was difficult in coming out.

when the case in question is removed, it doesn't fit back into any of the chambers.

since it was my dad's gun, i doubt i'll ever sell it. so it looks like i'll be getting the cylinder replaced.

so, can standard pressure loads such as the buffalo bore cause the chamber to bulge? assuming the cylinder gets replaced, should i refrain from everything but the mildest loads, even if they are listed as standard pressure? seems like that would exclude nearly all the "self-defense" rounds, though there's not that many in the standard pressure category...

quote:

Originally posted by harvester:
...when the case in question is removed, it doesn't fit back into any of the chambers....

Hey Harvester, That does sound like that Chamber has been over stressed.

The replacement Cylinder might be able to handle more than the original one, or they may still make it very light so it still works as originally designed. I'd ask the S&W folks and let their answers be the guide.

Since you Reload, it should be no problem at all finding hundreds of adequate (non +P Loads) which will work great in your revolver.
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One of my old buddies in FL is currently trying to decide what he wants as a daily carry handgun. One similar to your S&W would serve him and/or his wife just fine. There used to be a lot of fine old revolvers just for that purpose.

The current S&W folks are some of the best in the business. They will head you in the correct direction.

Let us know how you like it when it gets back.

Unless it was a faulty cartridge no NONE of the ammunition you used should cause your S & W to bulge. In the UK all imported firearms have to undergo a proof test where each chamber is fired with an over pressure round.

I was never aware of any problem with these J Frame revolvers. Or indeed with the lightweight Model 12 or Model 37.

I suspect a faulty handload long ago caused the problem. A double dose of a light Bullseye loading usually being the cuplrit! 5.6 grains where 2.8 was intended.