I have a problem with a .40 S&W load that I can't figure out. Using 180 gr. golden sabre bullet, 4.4 gr. Titegroup, WSP primer I am separating caseheads. I started with 4.2 gr and worked up to 4.4 and all was ok. I loaded 200 rounds go to practice and get the pressure problems. I pulled 5 bullets and weighed the powder. Each weighed 4.4 gr. OAL is 1.325 which should be ok.
I had been using Accurate #9 with the same bullets and OAL with no problem but whin I loaded this combination recently I was getting pressure signs even at starting loads so I thought I would change powders. I still have a problem.
I am firing these loads in a Springfield XD40.
Does anyone have any suggestions on what to check? Thanks

When building IPSC major Super loads, I found I had to control not only the OAL but also the diameter of the end of the case after crimping. This assures the same tension on the projectile every time.

In general however, if you're separating case heads you're running too hot!

Still leaves lots of questions. What kind of chamber support does the XD40 provide? How many times has the brass been fired? Has it work hardened due to case head expansion and resizing?

By the way, I like #9 in 40. Has worked very well for me.

Agree with mstarling.
1. Does the XD have a supported chamber?
2. Be very careful with OAL. With a case this size (small), small differences in OAL can cause the pressure to rise dramatically.
3. AA#9 is also a fast powder.
peter.

According to Springfield the case is fully supported. I asked them before I purchased the gun. It does not look fully supported to me, but I am not a gunsmith. What I don't understand is I had been using #9 previously with no problems.
I will adjust AOL and also adjust crimp and resizer.
Thanks for your help and let me know if you think of any other possible cause.

I've never separated a semi auto case from 9mm, 40s&w, 10mm, .357sig or .45acp. I suspect you have a problem w/ the chamber. Your load is within pressure levels assuming your OAL is to spec.http://www.hodgdon.com/data/pistol/40sw.php
When you say "separated", is the case blowing out one side? There is obviously a diff. in cycle time between the faster TG & AA#9, maybe this is causing the slide to unlock prematuraly.

Tikka, look at the barrel. A fully supported chamber has the feed ramp as part of the barrel, whereas an unsupported chamber has the feedramp as part of the magazine well (frame). Remove the magazine for this, and you can see it clearly.
Peter.

...more specifically, on the supported chamber, remove the barrel and drop in a case. If you can see the case walls above the extractor groove, it would be considered 'unsupported' by most 'experts'. I'm a Glock .40 shooter and have heard all the arguments ad nauseum...

Anyway, the only time I saw this was with some 'remanufactured' ammo from a local shop I tried. It was from hot loads and work hardened brass, and the entire head ripped off, leaving the case sides in the chamber. After 3 rounds in the first 9 I shot did it, I ditched the lot!

If your brass is more than 2-3 times reloaded, ditch it and try some fresh stuff...your load looks fine (4.7 max per Hodgdon's web page).

Describe the separation in detail or provide us with photos. How many times have they been reloaded ? have you cut open a case to check for thinning of the brass ?

The brass in question was "once fired", purchased from Midway. It is of mixed manufactures. I have not examined it as close as I probably should have because I have never had a problem with once fired. Maybe someone miscounted the times fired?
The case head is blown completely off.

Now don't come to my house and threaten to lynch me up for what I'm about to say.
I read somewhere can't remember haven't we all heard that one before anyhow that try avoid brass that was fired in a Glock. I don't know how we are supposed to know this when one buys used brass i guess you could look at the primers. If i remember right ammo fired from a glock will have and odd indent on the primer. Not the usual look like if someone hit with a nail. The reason is since glock barrel don't fully suppor tthe cases it weakens the brass. Like I said don't load up and head to Huachuca with your ropes and gasoline if you do give me a heads up so I can get my family out of the AO.

John

Glock uses a triangular striker, not a round pin, so if the primer is dimpled round...it's not from a Glock.

FWIW, I reload for my .40 Glock. All my brass is originally factory loaded, and I pick up the fired empties...reload 3-4 times, and chuck them.

I did an experiment and got to 5 reloads (plus the factory firing) with no problems (under close scrutiny with calipers to monitor case bulges and growth) with a batch of 100...but I load light out of an abundance of caution (and cause I'm cheap). Nary a shooting related scar on my body. YMMV.

I have always been leery of 'once fired' brass and consider it in the same category as range pickups...you are never sure how many times it has really been used. When I am done with mine, I dump them in the range bucket...who knows if they go for scrap or become 'remanufactured'.

No gasoline or tar & feathers...just my first hand experiences.

Titegroup is a MUCH faster powder than is #9.

Long ago, there were reports of case failure in 40 S&W that was sized with a process that rolled the cases into shape. Was not in common use amongst handloaders, but large commercial places used it.

I gotta tell you that quality brass can be fired many times if used with practice loads ... that is, not barn burners. Is even true of major Super.

However, case failure (usually splitting down the sides) does happen.

For "business" loads, new or x1 brass (that you have fired your self the first time) is the smart way to go. Then toss it into the practice pile and shoot it until is splits or looks so disgusting you just have to throw it away. Much better safe than sorry!

Extreme care should be exercised in loading at the max performance end. Also, you should be chronographing all "business" loads and perhaps using small rifle primers for them as well.

quote:

Originally posted by CDH:
Glock uses a triangular striker, not a round pin, so if the primer is dimpled round...it's not from a Glock.

That is what I was trying to say about the primers, thanks for clarifying for me. Supposedly there are a couple of other gunmakers using the same system again that is what I heard?

John

The "once fired" brass was deprimed and tumbled clean when I got it so no way to tell if it was Glock fired or not.
I'm going to load new brass, working up to the same Titegroup and #9 loads and see what happens.
Thanks for all the input. This is my first visit to this sight and I'm impressed with all the helpful members. Maybe some day I can return the favor.

quote:

Long ago, there were reports of case failure in 40 S&W that was sized with a process that rolled the cases into shape. Was not in common use amongst handloaders, but large commercial places used it.

I have a friend that shot .40 in IPSC and IDPA for a while. He had several case separations after buying once-fired brass from Scharch (sp?). Grady called Scharch and was told they "rolled" the brass to re-size it...

You might call Midway and ask them where they got their brass...

I had this same problem with my Beretta M96, after buying some once-fired brass. I was using Bullseye 4.2 gr and 180 gr cast SWC. I fired probably 40 or so rounds, then the problem. The gunsmith inspected everything and established that the brass was the problem.

I use only brass that I know the history, now. I get my best results with 7.2 gr Blue Dot with the 180 SWC or 9.8 gr AA#9 with the same bullet. Not a hot load, but good accuracy and easier on the gun at range sessions. No more problems.

My S&W Sigma 40 leaves the same kind of indentation in the primer as does a Glock. Looks rectangular.
Peter