Hello Everyone,
I am hoping to get some sound advice on how to get started in reloading.
I just finished reading "The ABC's of Reloading"
as well as watching numerous video's on Youtube, but I must admit that I am a bit intimidated on where to go from here.

Here is my situation and what I am hoping to do:

1) I want to reload primarily for my favorite hunting rifle which shoots 1/4MOA with recently discontinued factory ammo. I want to duplicate this particular loading (velocity/accuracy) the best I can.

2) I only shoot a few hundred rounds from this rifle per year, so I do not need to load quickly or have an elaborate set-up.

3) I do not want to spend a ton of money, but I am willing to spend what I have to for my purposes.

4) I am willing to obsess to the 100th of a powder grain to get exactly what I want.

5) Finally, although I do have a chronograph, it is not easy for me to get range time as I need to drive an hour and 1/2 to an indoor range to test for accuracy as I live in a big city.

I am hoping that this is not too tall an order, and I would like to pick your brains here on how to move forward regarding learning the correct way to reload and what would you consider essential equiptment.

I truly appreciate your time and look forward to your advice!!

How about this

Or maybe this.

All can be configured so as to fit neatly in a bag of your choosing.

If your rifle shoots Bona-fide 1/4 MOA with factory ammo... then look no further. Keep using it.

You will likely find that you won't get any benefit from reloading... and that it will take you a long time to develop loads that equal real life repeatable 1/4 MOA groups....

Best I can say is that you ought to shoot in local benchrest matches...

Hey TruckJohn, can I send you a PM? have a couple questions about a 527 Carbine..

Apologise for the partial thread hijacking.

This is a two part question and answer for sure.

Part 1) Loading equipment. For what you want to load I'd recommend a cast iron press. Take your pick Lee is less expensive and they go up from there. For the most part a beam scale and good powder measure will do. My first reloading kit was an RCBS had everything except calipers and dies. The kit doesn't have a case trimmer now but has everything else, except calipers and dies. I'd look at either that or the Hornady Lock and Load set up on a single stage press. The loack and load leaves your dies set when you swap them out. I've also heard good things about their presses.

Part 2) The Load. There are probably thousands of component combinations out there. You lucked out if you found a 1/4 minute load from the factory. The first thing is hopefully you have kept your brass. Then if the bullet your factory load used is available buy them. Powder is trickier but not overly so. Run a batch over your chronograph. This will tell you two things; one, an average velocity and two (maybe three but they are related), extreme spread and deviation. For these numbers the lower the better. Spread is the range of your velocities, the high and low. Standard of deviation is formula based and represents the consistancy of the velocity. (At this point I'd say if you want to know more look it up on wikipedia.) Anyhow, back to powder with the velocity you can determine a powder and charge weight to start with. There are a couple ways to determine the best charge and you'll probably try one or two powders before you settle on one.

Without gun and ammo info that's about the best I can tell you. PM if you'd like more info.

Ingwe
Bear in mind that you may not be able to duplicate the velocity that you get from the factory load. It may be that they are using a powder unavailable to the general public. With careful, no ANAL, attention to detail, you can do as well or better with your handloads. Good equipment, a damned good scale, a caliper to measure bullet seating depth, several loading manuals and a selection of powders. It may take a bit of elbow grease and time but, when you're done, you won't be disappointed.

Good stuff fellas thanks.

A few thoughts...

I would continue using the factory ammo (I am only shooting 100 rounds per year from this rifle) but they discontinued it.

How difficult will it be to find a 1/4MOA handload?

How did you guys LEARN?? Where/how should I?

How do I determine a list of essential equiptment??

Sorry Fellas!

About 14 years ago I bought an RCBS Rock Chucker kit. Read the manual that came with it. About a week later I hit a site called Accurate Reloading. Then I started hanging out with our local shooters.

To determine equipment think about the steps you need to reload.

1) Clean brass, lots of methods available. I use corn cob tumbling for this step.
2) Size and Deprime. For this you'd probably try neck sizing. I do a few full sizing for semiauto. Dies can be bought for either sizing method or a set that has both. I've read that most neck sizers end up full length sizing every few firings.
3) Trimming. Obviously a caliper to measure with and a trimming device. For ones or twos a hand crank works, for bulk work Giraud is about $400.
4)Delube. Sizing requires lube. This will need cleaned off in most instances. I use an ultrasonic but there are again more ways than one to do this.
5) Prime. You can do this on a press or with a hand held tool.
6) Powder. Load the charge into a preped and primed case. This is a powder measure, scale, funnel, etc.
7) Bullet seating. Our second trip through a die. Measure the complete round.

As for cost of tools, I'd estimate about $400 to $500 up to a few grand depending on what equipment you buy. Lee is the least expensive but some of their products are not the best, I have one of their progressives but have only ran a couple of large batches on it. I prefer an iron press to aluminum. They make both.
On the top of the range Forster makes a coax press or Redding presses are expensive but great quality. In between RCBS and Hornady are good. I haven't used the Hornady Lock and Load but I compete with shooters who do and they'd recommend it.

I'd say to start affordable but don't go cheap on the press or dies. Both should last a long time there's no reason to save $3.00 for 20 years of loading. For a good load on a good rifle I'd look at Redding Comp dies. Maybe something that doesn't use an expander ball.

Learn?: I learned on a Lee Loader in 30-30 in 1968. That will teach you the basics for a few dollars investment. Once you get the hang of it, you will know which press to get. And Lee Loaders can make very accurate loads. Read a lot. Be careful about things you read on the net; a lot of guys are scary. Reloading is very easy hard to do damage, but there are idiots out there who do.

I think that maybe I need to find someone to show me what to do step by step.
For example, let's assume that I learn the proper steps to load a round...I know that I need to "measure and trim the casings" but to what measurement? I have no clue. Also, I have no idea how far to seat the bullet into the casing.

How do you learn this...did you learn from a book??

I learned from a book.

YouTube has a video for everything. Go back there and watch some more.

quote:

Originally posted by Ingwe623:
I think that maybe I need to find someone to show me what to do step by step.
For example, let's assume that I learn the proper steps to load a round...I know that I need to "measure and trim the casings" but to what measurement? I have no clue. Also, I have no idea how far to seat the bullet into the casing.

How do you learn this...did you learn from a book??

A few thoughts and answers to your last questions.

1. Buy a loading manual from the manufacturer of the bullet you shoot. These manuals will have loads for all calibers in which they manufacture bullets for, so you'll only use one section. But buy it anyway, the manuals will also take you through the reloading steps and they're quite simple really. In fact you may want to do this first and read those sections. Once you do so, I think you'll see just how simple this really is. The manual will have all the maximum dimensions of the casing for each caliber.

2. Typically the manuals will encourage you to trim to 0.01 inch less than maximum length. This gives room for the brass to stretch through a few shootings before the cases need trimmed again.

3. Even with new unfired brass, I always measure the case length to ensure it's less than max. I don't think I've ever found one that needed trimming before it was shot at least once, but it makes me feel better knowing.

4. Do be very careful as has been stressed, but don't be intimidated by this either. It's not that difficult.

5. You seat the bullet typically to the max COAL. COAL is cartridge overall length. Depending on the brass length, you'll have different amounts of the bullet protruding from the neck. This is fine and normal. Note that some bullets will be seated deeper to have less than max COAL per the manuals.

6. As you're a beginner, I would start loading with the minimum charges listed in the manuals. After a few go arounds and you gain confidence, then you can start working up the charges. At that point, your newest addiction otherwise known as load development will begin.

7. Always work up charges slowly and become familiar with the signs of high pressure. Load manuals such as Nosler's have pictures of brass showing pressure signs.

quote:

Originally posted by Ingwe623:
I think that maybe I need to find someone to show me what to do step by step.
For example, let's assume that I learn the proper steps to load a round...I know that I need to "measure and trim the casings" but to what measurement? I have no clue. Also, I have no idea how far to seat the bullet into the casing.

How do you learn this...did you learn from a book??

Yea, its not that hard. I suggest you get a couple of manuals. They have case and cartridge overall length in them. AND you have come to the right place to learn.

A list of some basic items are.

A manual (or two, or three) I like Speer and Lyman.

A press.

A scale.

A set of dies.

A powder measure.

And a set of Harbor frieght verneer calipers can be pretty usefull too. You will also need some case lube and of corse primers and powder. A case tumbler is a great addition to any reloading setup, but not essential.

If you are loading for one caliber then Lee sells a little two piece trimming setup for about ten bucks that works real good and you dont need to worry about length because they are pre-set.

I have and have been through several presses. If you are on a budget then I suggest watching Ebay or Gunbroker.com for a good used cast press. There are some old ones that many consider obsolete (like some of the old steel "C" presses) that are really very good, dirt cheap and virtualy last forever. They are typicaly far better than the cheap Aluminum presses IMO. You could also find other such items there, like a scale or powder measure. I currently use two presses and one of them is a refurbished Rochchucker from Ebay that I only paid about $60.00 for. If you can get a cast "O" press then they are stronger than a "C" press and are a better way to go.

I use a lot of other stuff, but RCBS is a good brand of equipment to buy IMO because they garantee their equipment for life and they back it up, no questions asked, and most of what they make is top notch.

Good luck and welcome..

Make a friend, then learn how to. I'd just try a bunch of other factory loads first -- you don't plan on doing enough handloading to learn anything...

If you prefer to learn in a classroom enviroment and get some hands on experence look for an NRA Basic Metallic Reloading Course near you. Often clubs or shops host them. You can also contact the NRA Education Dept. for a course / instuctor near you. I have been teaching these for years now and many prefer this method of learning a skill and then they can see what is needed to get started.

Again, the easiest, cheapest, and most effective way to learn is with a lee loader; once you learn the basics from that you can move up to a press, etc. All those things at once to a novice are just confusing. All you need is a lee loader and a plastic hammer ; instructions come with it and it is idiot proof. The kits come with a powder measure (dipper which is as accurate as a measure) and charts that tell you which powder to use. And how deep to seat the bullets, although if you get bullets with crimp grooves, seat them to the groove. I have started lots of people out that way and they make some very accurate ammo whilst learning the principles of it. For example, trimming cases is not one of your first concerns so that skill and tools can wait. (Lee makes idiot proof trimmers too) and I do not sell reloading tools. Where do you live; someone here might live close.

I really do appreciate all of your responses.

After reading them closely, I have decided that I am going to take an NRA class and go from there. There are several in my area and they look pretty comprehensive.

I am definetly going to continue reading here and all that I can find in the mean time.

Thanks Again!

My advice, coming from a guy that took years and years to get into reloading is this:

1) Don't get too hung up on particulars of equipment...the equipment debate is like a lot of things; there are alot of brands and everyone has their opinion on what's best. Just pick up the basics in your price range (usually there is noting wrong with used to get yourself started)

2) Don't get too paranoid about not being able to do it right...just read up a bit, maybe pick up a dvd if you want to actually see the process (I'm sure youtube could be a cheap supplement on this)

3) Utilize AR as there is a TON of knowledge on this site!

4) Just stick to proven data and recipes and you'll be fine. The fun will be in producing those loads and then seeing how your set-up responds to those loads. IMO some folks get hung up on trying to create their own 'new' loads - why? There are more proven and tried loads out there than I personally have time to try out, so if you keep playing around with whats out there, you'll find that 1/4 comdination that you are looking for!

5) I'm like you as far as not being a high volume kind of reloader, for my needs a balance scale and a powder trickler allow me to keep things very precise. (A quick tip that helps me: I set my powder measure up to drop a little below my desired weight, then just trickle the last little bit of powder in each load to achieve a precise powder measurement each time. It takes a little time, but its worth it to me to know that each round has the same amount of powder... with practice, you'll get pretty quick at this.)

6) Just have fun and be safe!

The Speer Reloading Manual in my kit had everything I need to get started. There are several different ways of doing things and tips that may help you'll pick up from others.

Everyone learns differently. A class that one person thinks is too basic may give someone else more information than they can use.

One thing I didn't see here is a Cartridge Overall Length Gauge. This is used to determine length to the lands in that specific rifle. You use it with the specific bullets you intend to shoot. Maximum OAL will vary with bullet profile.

Good luck.

When you are reloading casings fired from the same rifle then your casings are "fire formed" correct?? If this is the case then the cases do not need to be resized...just the overall length and neck size, correct??

Do you use the length of the case from an unfired case or a once-fired case?

As to your last comment, that is correct--sort of--actually it is more complex than it seems, but if all else is equal and you can neck size your brass and it will chamber in that rifle then you should be good to go. The fact that you have a factory load you are trying to duplicate actually makes several things more straightforward. For an example I would guess your rifle likes the brass the size that it comes at on those factory loads, so you'd probably be talking about Full Length Resizing to get the cases close to their original specs. Also You know what bullet your rifle likes, so get those and load them to the same COAL as the factory loads. You also have a good start on what type of components to look for, as an example if it's Rem factory rounds, your should look at Remington primers, brass, bullets.

Basically you are trying to replicate a load that you already know shoots good in your gun. So, take all the info you can from that load and try to duplicate it! That's where your new calipers are going to come in handy. Good luck--as others have said prepare for loading to become an obsession!

Everything in handloading comes with practice

1/4 min accuracy though........