I recently purchased an A-bolt in 325 WSM. There is not much data on this yet and I got what I could off the net. Just trying to "get it in the ball park", I'm using 185 gr Rem. cor-lok bullets and since I have a pile of each, I used CCI 250 primers and H414 powder. Using an educated guess, I surmised that the starting load would be about 62. grains and that the top end should be about 64.5. I loaded up the 10 rounds adding .3 grains to each subsequent load. I am looking at a 300 yd group that starts off at around 14" low, wanders up for the next 5 rounds and settles back to a group that is less than 2" across for the last 4 rounds. Funny thing is that I believed that the group would be much closer to the aiming point. The group actually centers slightly above the first found. If I count round one and two, I have six rounds in this two inch cluster.

Thanks,Hot Core for keeping this info alive.

quote:

settles back to a group that is less than 2" across for the last 4 rounds

The ladder method kinda pokes holes in the theory that it is necessary to weigh each charge for accuracy, doesn't it?

Regards,
hm

Hey DuckHunter, You are welcome.

The only thing I ask is that you spread the word when you see folks asking about Developing New Loads.

No telling how many folks never get to see the actual "Best Accuracy" their rifle is capable of, simply because they don't use Mr. Audette's Method.

Good Hunting and clean 1-shot Kills.

"The ladder method kinda pokes holes in the theory that it is necessary to weigh each charge for accuracy, doesn't it?"


No it doesn't. Go read Mr. Audette's actual report on the "ladder method". You'll find it is for developing loads at known distance (that meand one specified distance, i. e. as in target shooting). Those loads of different powder weight may hit close together at 300 yards. But do they at 150 or 500? If the velocity ES between them is more than 100 fps then there will be condierable difference in point of impact at other ranges. That is a fact of exterior ballistics.

Larry Gibson

I'm a fan of this method as well. Since HC pointed me to an early post, I've tried several ladders on a couple of rifles with excellent results. An example of the results is a .270 I have that I could never get to shoot better than 1.5" at 100 yds with factory ammo. I found a load using H4350 powder and a Hornady Interlock bullet that two weekends ago shot a .45" group. The same rifle likes R22 powder too and I shot a 5 shot group at .65" early this year with a load found using this method.

Good stuff.

Larry, I'll let you know how the accuracy is at 100 and 200 yards as I work with this rifle. It has been my experience that a rifle and load combo that won't group at 100 yards won't group at 300 or 600 yards. The trick now is to settle on a load using something near 64 gr. of H414, CCI 250 primers and Rem. 185 grain Cor-lok bullets. The chronograph is the next step and I'll use it to check SD, extrme spread, and avg. velocity. Then I'll start over and use some really good bullets (I think Rem. bullets are "really good bullets") but some rifles like other bullets or bullet weights. Point is, I think I have found a good combination with out going through all the trial and error I did with my 30-06 back in '73. Time will tell.

I will be watching for your results, too.

Any load that is accurate at 300 yards should be accurate at lesser ranges.

I have heard several different ways of finding "the load". Audette Method, is good, for being as fast as it is. But it doesn't work for some things.

Yes, I am a believer too!
For details, go to
https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2511043/m/571104925
Nice day,
Jan

quote:

Originally posted by hm1996:
...The ladder method kinda pokes holes in the theory that it is necessary to weigh each charge for accuracy, doesn't it?

Once the Harmonic Node is located, if your Powder Measure/Powder combination is consistent enough to fall within that range, then it works right well.

May be wrong, but I believe most of the BenchRest folks tend to use Volume instead of Weight measurements for 600yds and closer. I still use Weight for my measurements, but have no argument with the folks who use Volume.
-----

Hey DuckHunter, Once you get comfortable with the never improved upon Creighton Audette Method, you will understand the chronograph is not a whole lot of use to you. Basically a HUGE total waste of time and money.

You eventually ask yourself, "What is it providing me that I really need to know?" And of course the answer is - "Nothing at all!"

Knowing the Velocity can be a help in guessing at the Drop Rate from the External Ballistic Charts. But there are two things that negate that value:
1. You can look at the Manual and "guess at the Velocity" close enough to do the same Drop Rate Estimates.
2. Since a person needs to actually "Shoot" to see what the real Drop Rate is, it really makes knowing the Velocity totally meaningless.

And of course most knowledgeable Reloaders know that you can not determine Pressure from a Velocity. Regardless how many times the Chronograph Commandos want to try to convince folks otherwise, it just isn't true.

Good Hunting and clean 1-shot Kills.

quote:

Once the Harmonic Node is located, if your Powder Measure/Powder combination is consistent enough to fall within that range, then it works right well.

Spot on, HC.

Regards,
hm

quote:

"The ladder method kinda pokes holes in the theory that it is necessary to weigh each charge for accuracy, doesn't it?"

It does or it doesn't depending on your viewpoint. The whole point of the Audette method is precisely to identify those loads that are relatively insensitive to small changes in powder charge.
Peter

I used this method for my 7mag and 300 RUM. Worked for me.

quote:

The whole point of the Audette method is precisely to identify those loads that are relatively insensitive to small changes in powder charge.

And,once found, if you load to the center of the node, no need to weigh each charge. Works for me.

Regards,
hm

quote:

Originally posted by hm1996:
[QUOTE]The whole point of the Audette method is precisely to identify those loads that are relatively insensitive to small changes in powder charge.

And,once found, if you load to the center of the node, no need to weigh each charge. Works for me.

Edited to add:

quote:

If the velocity ES between them is more than 100 fps then there will be condierable difference in point of impact at other ranges. That is a fact of exterior ballistics.

I should have stated that once the node is found (at 300 yards), load to center of node for 300 & under works well. Larger ES will affect dispersion at longer ranges moreso than shorter ranges. Once in a while we get lucky and the nodes will produces low ES as well as small groups.

Regards,
hm