I have been trying unsuccessfully to develop a new load for a Moose / Griz hunt this fall in the Yukon. I can not get any of the premium bullets to shoot well from my rifle. My old standard load of a 200 grain Serria BT using 74 gr of IMR 4350 and a Fed Mag Primer shoots sub inch groups if I do my part.

With the bullets I have tried none have shot better then 3 inch groups. I have tried the Nosler Partition, Nosler Accubond, and Barnes X bullet.

Any thoughts? Is there a better powder for this rifle?

quote:

Originally posted by Ryan:
I have been trying unsuccessfully to develop a new load for a Moose / Griz hunt this fall in the Yukon. I can not get any of the premium bullets to shoot well from my rifle. My old standard load of a 200 grain Serria BT using 74 gr of IMR 4350 and a Fed Mag Primer shoots sub inch groups if I do my part.

With the bullets I have tried none have shot better then 3 inch groups. I have tried the Nosler Partition, Nosler Accubond, and Barnes X bullet.

Any thoughts? Is there a better powder for this rifle?

Try the Brenneke TUG(181gr) or the RUAG CDP (165gr!). Should work with rottweil R 905 or Reloader 22 or Norma MRP!

Ryan,

I have always heard that IMR 7828 was the cat's meow in the Weatherby line of cartridges. I tried it in my .257 Weatherby and got excellent results.

IMR-7828 From 73.0 grains to 83.0 grains
Federal 215 Primer

But quite honestly, I woudl stay with the Sierra load.

I thought about staying with the seirra load out of simplicity, but the bullet has performed so poorly on elk and shiras moose that I wouldn't trust it on a griz.

I'm with you on that one. A grizz is not the animal to mess with if you are not confident in your equipment.

quote:

With the bullets I have tried none have shot better then 3 inch groups. I have tried the Nosler Partition, Nosler Accubond, and Barnes X bullet.

See if a Dollar bill will slide between the barrel and the stock. Relieve the stock with a barrel channel tool if it don't.

Retry the Nosler accubonds then.

Personally I'd be trying the Swift A-Frame, Northforks and TBBCs for that trip

Reloader 22 or 25, IMR7828, IMR4831, they are all better powders for the .300 than 4350. I like RX25 and 180 gr most any brand. Inch or better for 3, doesn't open up much after that either. JMO, 4350 is too fast for the .300 Weatherby, load density is too low.

Hello the campfire:
I had a problem with my 300 Wby ( 1989 M70) until I got a hold of some Reloader 22. It has closed my groups up considerable. I just about got rid of the rifle because while it shot 180 grain Weatherby amunition (by Nosler) well enough, I could not do any thing with 4350 or any other powder until I tried Rl22. Now 1-1.5 inch groups at 100 yards are no trick. It will however give you a headach if you shoot too much at one sitting. I am thinking about backing off to about 50 grains and 150 Noslers to see if I can develope a plesant load for practice.
Good Luck
Judge Sharpe
A slow moving , once fast draw outlaw.

I agree with the suggestion to try RL 22. I'd also try IMR 7828. The 200 gr. Nosler Accubond gave the best accuracy I've been able to get from my 300 Weatherby. RL 22 seemed to be slightly more accurate in my rifle; IMR 7828 gave me the highest velocity.

JUdgeSharpe---DO NOT just "back off" a slow powder to 50 grains in a case as big as a weatherby. You can actually increase pressure by not having enought powder in the case by not moving the bullet through the barrel properly. Please follow load manual recomendations and don't fall below recomended published loads. A 150 is pretty mild all on it's own. OR consider a better recoil pad or a muzzle break that is ported straight out.

Another option might be the old bug-a-boo of how far from the rifling lands your seating the bullet. Some say to go right up to the lands, others say stay back a couple of hundredths of an inch. Weatherby's are known for a lot of free bore and you should stay back even further from the lands. I think the Weatherby website has a recommendation in their Q&A section.

Is this a completely new load as in primer brass and bullet, or are you only changing the bullet? I've had excellent results with IMR 7828, Re22, and H1000 and the 200 gr. Partition. H1000 is what I currently use. 86 gr. under a 200 gr. Partition with a CCI 250 primer in Ferderal brass. Is your rifle a Weatherby? I have had the best luck accuracy wise by seating the bullet out as far as the magazine box will allow.

I would try the RL22, I have tried the IMR 4350 and never had any good results. The best my 180gr Nosler BT would do was 2", but with the RL22 it came down to .75" 5 shot groups. I also have it seated .010" off the lands which helped too. It should work the same with the Accubonds which I'm trying next.

Ryan,

You don’t mention what kind of rifle you are using but I suspect that it is a factory 1 in 12†twist. I’ve found that this twist rate sometimes has trouble stabilizing the heavier bullets, especially 200 and 220 grain, in my experience, just a little too slow. All of the above suggestions are good. I would try the new version of IMR 7828 SSC (Super Short Cut). Use the same loading data as regular IMR 7828 but the short cut grains allow better metering and larger quantities in the case due to better compression (provided within maximum). IMR recommends 80.0 grains as maximum but I know a number of the manuals exceed this. I believe the Nosler manual lists 83.0 as maximum but please confirm.

I’ve found IMR7828 to be the most accurate (compared 4831, RE 22 and 25 and H1000, all with Fed 215 primers in Federal brass) and give the highest velocities in my 300 Weatherby (Winchester Model 70, 26†Krieger, 1 in 10 twist barrel) with the 200 grain Nosler Partition shooting 3 shots into about 1.25†@100 yards and a velocity of 3050fps. Seat the bullet out as long as the magazine will allow. I would agree with your assessment that the Sierra might not be up to the task of larger, tougher game. Personally I would accept a slightly lower accuracy standard in order to use a Barnes or Either of the two Noslers. It likely won't matter at the ranges you will be shooting a grizzly or moose. It is a great cartridge. Good luck.

Paul

I actually found RX25 a small bit superior to RX22 in accuracy with 180 grain bullets, and the velocity better as well. IIRC max loads per Reliant data is at or very near 100% load density. Used Fed 215M primers, Rem brass. Had the odd cloverleaf now and then, but 3 shots for 3/4" was fairly common.

Thanks for all the comments!

To answer a few questions... yes it is a weatherby factory gun. The only changes I have made to it have been a muzzle break.

As for the loads. I have been playing with IMR 4350 and bullets. The primer (Fed 215 Mag) and brass (weatherby) have remained constant.

It sounds like I have not been using an optimal powder for the rifle. Can anyone recommend a working range for IMR 7828 and RL 22?

When looking at the Reloader Powders… which would be better RL22 or RL25?

One other thing I forgot to mention... I am seating the bullet out as far as the magazine will allow....

Thanks again for all of the help and comments!

Unless your rifle is from the mid 60's or earlier you should have a 1 in 10" twist rate. Here are the listed max's I have reached in my rifle.

Re22 80.5 grs.
7828 85.0 grs.
H1000 86.0 grs.

All of these charges give me an average velocity of around 3050 to 3070 fps with the 200 gr. Partition. This with a 26" barrel.
I've never tried Re25, but it may be better from a load density point of view than Re22.

Weatherby Accumark. 3.6" OAL was all the magazine allowed. I'm not disposed to share load data but RX25 and somewhere in the neighborhood of 86.5 grains in a Remmy case worked for me. Data from the Swift manual, 180 Scirocco. Works for SGK, Partitions and Hornady's SP-IL too. Your mileage may vary, data is several years old. Data release by Alliant when they first introduced the powder was a few percent more aggressive, don't know what they say now.

Thanks fellas...

Actually the rifle was probably manufactured in the early 60's. Just a guess. It was my grandfather’s rifle originally.

Ryan

Helo the Campfire:
I know not to all of a sudden back off the powder too low, but I have found light loads fot this cartridge. I would go down just as I go up, watching for pressure signs and may need to use a filler over the powder. I have a good recoil pad on the rifle, but part of the problem is the mussle blast, and a break is not going to help that. I also will look at slower powders with more bulk. Thanks
Judge Sharpe
A solw moving once fast draw outlaw.

I have a friend who was having the same concerns, and I did some load development for their 300 Weatherby, with H 1000 and a 220 grain Round Nose and also a 220 grain Partition.... Load was about 85 grains of H 1000 and the 220 Partition was very very accurate... as well as the usual max load of IMR 7828 with a 180 grain partition in that rifle....

Everyone always ignores the 220 grain partition, but in my 30/06s and 300 Winchester, it has proven to be the most accurate of all the partitions those rifles have shot!

Cheers
seafire

In my 1991 Fibermark .300 WM, I use Speer Grand Slam 180 grains and found out that the slowest tubular french powder Vectan Tubal 7000 gives the best results.
Faster burning powders were not producing speed consistent results.

You might want to try Vihta N160 (or even N165) and Edmond, I thought Tubal 8000 was the slowest tubular powder made in France.

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:

Everyone always ignores the 220 grain partition, but in my 30/06s and 300 Winchester, it has proven to be the most accurate of all the partitions those rifles have shot!

If your rifle has a 1-12 twist, as opposed to a 1-10 twist, I do not think it will stabilize those 220 grain bullets.

Thanks guys... all of this is very helpful. I loaded up some new test loads with IMR7828 last night. I'll shoot them tomorrow...

As for the twist. I varified when my rifle was bought. My grandfather purchased it in 1972 for a elk hunt. So I am assuming that would be a 1:10" twist.

Thanks to all!

You can measure the twist yourself by watching the rotation of your cleaning rod as you clean or oil the bore.

Another vote for IMR4831 in the 300 weatherby. I like the new Accubond with this powder.

quote:

Originally posted by jkelly295:
Another vote for IMR4831 in the 300 weatherby.

In my experience, the 4831 powders -- both IMR and Hodgdon -- do tend to give good accuracy with 180 and 200 grain bullets in the 300 Weatherby, but max loads of those powders produce 100 to 200 or more f.p.s. less velocity than what can be achieved with max loads of RL22 or IMR 7828.

quote:

Originally posted by LE270:

quote:

Originally posted by jkelly295:
Another vote for IMR4831 in the 300 weatherby.

In my experience, the 4831 powders -- both IMR and Hodgdon -- do tend to give good accuracy with 180 and 200 grain bullets in the 300 Weatherby, but max loads of those powders produce 100 to 200 or more f.p.s. less velocity than what can be achieved with max loads of RL22 or IMR 7828.

Good point..