When you start reloading, do you have to have a chronograph? I know it could be a great help with load development, but money is an issue right now. I would join a hunting club, but there is only one in my area and it is mostly shotgunners.

[ 09-04-2002, 15:44: Message edited by: jcsabolt-2 ]

The data a chrono provides is invaluable. Rarely does the performance of a given load match what the manuals show. You need to see what the load is doing in YOUR weapon, and the chrono is the best tool for that.

You can get a Shooting Chrony for $100 +/- at MidSouth or Natchez.

R-WEST

You don't need a chronograph. The velocities you get will be close to what every other gun gets.

Before a chronograph I would get or make a bullet run out tool if your shooting rifles.

You can make a chronograph yourself also from a ballistic pendulum. All you need is a log and some rope.

That said I have had chronographs since the early 1960's and have kept records since then. Just offering a different opionion.

The main thing all of us are interested in is how close and how many holes we can consistently put in that little black or orange dot on a piece of paper a hundred or two hundred yards down range.A chrony will not help that.But,when distance starts entering in, speed can start to be a factor.A Chrony is definately a ok piece of equiptment to add later. Midway (I think) has a F1 on sale now for around $60- $70 bucks.

I am a strong proponent of chronographs. I didn't have one for years and couldn't explain anomolies at the bench. Since I have purchased one (Ohler 35) my loads have improved considerably. It allows me to see the differences that primers, brass, seating depth, etc. cause on velocity and standard deviation. I suggest strongly that you get a chronograph as it will greatly aid in reloading. And at today's prices you can get a reasonably accurate one for around a $100. Just my two cents.

You do not need a chronograph to get started. I loaded for years without one. However, I would put it high on my list of things to get when the opportunity arises. The $60 Shooting Chrony works well.

I have recently bought a Chrony, and it is, indeed, very nice to have.

My take is that you are the only one to decide if you need one or not. If all you are doing is loading '06 loads for 200 yard and under shots on deer, anything in the manual will do.

If you are a long range shooter (varminter or competition), the velocity aspect as well as the SD and ES numbers become almost a necessity. At 600 yards, a large velocity spread will put you out of the competition, but I killed my moose with a load that was 200 feet below the book speed, and had an ES of 200! JMO, Dutch.

I loaded without for 3 years and had excellent success producing good accurate hunting loads.

Having a chrono is fun and probably allows one to fine tune something BUT it is also a fair bit of hassle, extra things to lug around, extra time to set up, considerable extra stress when you can't get a reading...

Ignorance can be bliss! That accurate flat shooting load that accounted for all those long range hits is only doing 3,540fps... why the book said I can get 3,600fps and so you start the whole cycle again.

You not only have the cost of the chrono you have the extra shooting you will do as a result!

I would start without and let accuracy be your main concern, only concern yourself over velocity if trajectory is inadequate. Thus when loading for my 6.5x55 I produced a good accurate 100yard load with 39gr of powder. I dressed back to 200yards and the drop was excessive. I went back to the drawing board, worked up to 42gr at which point the load was still accurate and dropped only 2.5" at 200yds.

No you don't...

I loaded for over 25 years before I bought my first one.

The object (in my opinion) of reloading to to obtain the most accurate load possible. The velocity of the load is immaterial. It is nice to know that information AFTER you have developed that special load that will put 5 bullets in one hole at 200 yards, consistantly...

As for the data computed, one of my best loads (5-shots, 200-yards, 0.348" group) had the worst SD I have ever seen! Who cares? Not me, as long as the gun and ammo contimues to perform that way!

I just ordered a chrony after loading for many years - do you need one - no. If you are just beginning, learn the fundamentals first of making accurate reloads. Agree also with more hassle and set up time at the range. If you have access to 300 yrd range or shooting distance you can get an approximation of velocity by the difference in impact point at 100 vs 300 yds - look at drop tables in reloading manuals - plus you learn the performance characteristic of your rifle. When chronies were 300 plus dollars I didn't figure they were worth it - now that you can buy one for $73.00 from Midway - I got one - but I need a toy and I'm curious and its a progressive step to this art of reloading.

you need one.
while getting that rifle to shoot in one hole , at ONE RANGE is nice, you have to know what you're gun is DOING.

In all honesty, this is exactly the same as saying 'you dont NEED a scale, you can get by with a SCOOP"

Further, if you are loading interesting things, like a 450 alaskan, and you know you can get 2150 with 400 grains... but, you have a ton of rem 405, and you KNOW it's max vel should be 1850, then you load it to 1850, or 1800, and then you KNOW your loads are the best you can have to take your game cleanly, AND that it hits x high at 100, and y low at 150... and you know, not guess, what your MPBR is.
jeffe

You certainly don't have to have a chronograph to do basic reloading, after all they have only been within the reloaders budget for a relatively short time. However, you won't really know how your ammunition is performing in your rifles until you get one. There can be enormous differences from one rifle to another. I have rarely had a load perform as the handbook said it would - some faster some slower. The things are cheap enough now - get one as soon as you can and you won't regret it.

I loaded for the first 18 years without one and for the last 14 years with one. Looking back, I'd say I spent 18 years in the dark. You don't "have to" have one but if you are using reloading to improve performance, it is hard to imagine a better tool.

JimF

I've been reloading nearly 30 years, and have had a chrony less than half that. No, you do not need one to start. In fact, if you are a rank beginner, it might be more of a distraction than a help. Learn the basics first. But put it high on the list of "wants".

No it isn't necessary. With you engineering background, you will really want one. The good news is you can get a very adequate Chrony for the cost of a good press. Also, if you are really into reloading, as a hobby just like shooting, it really lets you know what is going on. I'd pass on some of the more exotic reloading stuff like run out gauges, and get a basic chronograph.

I've reloaded for 30 yrs, and I have had a chronograph for most of them. I was wandering around in the dark until I got one. Ku-dude

I like 1894's thoughts on the matter.

If you're experimenting with wildcats, or trying out powders in combinations that load data is scarce for (not the way I want die, by the way), the chronograph would indeed be helpful.

But 1894's contention that a load must, in the end, prove itself in its intended application regardless of chronograph data summarizes my thoughts entirely. A load with great numbers that won't bring down game, or shoot tight at extreme range is not a great load. (And such loads do exist). But a load with "ho-hum" numbers that delivers is, well, a great load.

According to chronograph data, the 6.5 x 55 Swedish Mauser isn't much of a big game rifle, but tens of thousands of big dead critters didn't get the memo...

I use a reliable load development method that allows me to identify the optimal charge of powder for a particular recipe. I don't, however, rely on a chronograph in my method of load development.

The Nosler manual, with their 24" Lilja barrel velocities, is largely responsible for the contention that chronographs are needed to learn the "truth" about a load. But take a look at a Speer manual and you'll get some realistic, useful numbers. I've found that if the Speer book says a load goes 2700 fps from their 22" test barrel, real life results are going to be right about there. I like the Nosler data for the accuracy loads, but I check the Speer book to get an idea of actual velocities.

I also agree with Don that a concentricity gauge is a more valuable reloading tool than a chronograph. Get that first, and get a chronograph later on, after you've developed some great performing loads--if you really want to know the numbers.

I think chronograph data is a lot like the list of ingredients in a good hotdog. Maybe you don't want to know!

Dan Newberry
green 788

[ 09-05-2002, 06:00: Message edited by: green 788 ]

I agree with the NO's.

I have had several of them and presently am without one. I do enjoy knowing what the rifle is shooting but your PBR is not set with a chronograph. It is determined by field shooting and seeing where the actual drop is in your rifle at various ranges. If you use chronograph results and a ballistic program you still don't really know where it shoots, you are only guessing. They are interesting but far from necessary. Don't buy Jeff's argument, the scale is a necessity.

I load up near max anymore and look for an accurate load. Then I shoot it at ranges up to 300 yards plus so I get to know the rifle. The chronograph will not help me a bit in that respect.

Chic

green 788 said it all. I load with several different powders, but the old 4895 has the most prominent place on my bench.When all else fails some combination of it is going to work.Well, almost.

Try to get a Chrony at your first oppurtunity.

To reload without one is like flying a plane with no compass.

I'm going to buy my second chronograph and answer your question with: definately no.
Before you spend your limited funds on a chronograph, spend it on quality tools and literature.
There is no need to rush into the maximum loads - walk slowly, inspect your products carefully and read a lot.

You will find that your reloads will not be perfect at the beginning, no need for a chrony.

After having developed a certain routine (and your wallet recovered), a chronometer will make sense.
But be prepared that the readings may cause severe frustrations: there are only a few perfect reloaders on this imperfect globe.

You can get by without one, but
Get one as soon as you can!

Ask yourself why everyone on this thread has (or had in Chic's case) one.

I personnally wouldn't be without one for load development purposes.

Elmo