I have just received the first installment of the large bullet order I placed with Girrard while in Cape Town this last fall. It has taken a while to get the bullets here but at least a third of the order is here now.

Thats great, just really great. Congratulations.

And you call that coming through?

Mike, your snide comment is unwarranted. You look a fool when you shoot off your mouth like that. There are weight restrictions (44lbs max) on mail parcels from SA. In the USA there are value restrictions on what a person may receive of certain classes of goods within certain time periods, if you wish to avoid mountains of paperwork. These restrictions required that we split the shipment into three lots and stagger the delivery.

Gerard,

First, my comment was with respect to seven months to receive the first shipment coupled with LB404's personal opinion that this equates to "coming through".

Last I checked this was 2006 and we seemed to have resolved transcontinental shipping issues by something measuably better than 7 months and yes even from Africa.

Second, I am curious as to the ship dates for the rest of the order? is another 1/3 shipping next week? next month? or is the next 1/3 shipping in another 7 months?

Once again you are assuming and you wind up with egg on your face. First of all, lb404 is satisfied with the process thus far. This is a small indication that, as far as he is concerned, the order is proceeding as expected. lb404 was in SA in October and contacted us to place an order. We did not have anywhere near the quantity he wanted available and he then finalised and e-mailed the order after his return to the USA. The order was actually only finalised and placed with us on the 4th of January this year. We then started manufacturing it. Due to the weight of the parcels, they are sent by surface mail. In many cases surface mail takes three months and more, even from the USA to Africa.

The point here is that we discussed this with lb404 and he is satisfied with the process. The title of the topic tells you this. I am curious to know what business it is of yours to butt in here with your own personal brand of good cheer and cast aspersions based on your sour and suspicious outlook on life?

Why is it that you have a problem with us while other manufacturers who blatantly copy our products and move in and out of businees at the drop of a hat, or even disappear completely, do not ever warrant a mention by you? Do you have any idea how long it takes Woodleigh to manufacture and deliver a large shipment to the USA? I have ordered goods, including bullets, from the USA and Europe on many occasions and, if the order has to go surface mail, due to weight, the calendar is marked off in months. You should take a look at real life some time.

Gerard,

You may wish to read my posts as well as all the posts above more carefully but then again you may not.

My original post is regarding LB404's opinion that receiving goods seven months after placing an order equates to "coming through." As my first post implies, I do not equate that to "coming through" even from a supplier in RSA.

This is a public internet forum and by its very nature deals with rendering of opinions.

Your reply brings up a couple interesting points/issues:

1. Based on the content of the above posts (you should read the posts above carefully) LB404 seems to think he placed the order last fall. You seem to think the order was not actually placed until January. Of course I actually don't know what LB thinks regarding the placement date of the order but as I recall he has a business and seems to be a pretty intelligent fellow and I suspect he knows the difference between placing an order and not placing an order and what the current day is.

My profession is a consultant in commercial contract negotiations and supplier management. One rule that all good suppliers follow is there is no such thing as an "incomplete order." The information to complete an order is either available or it is not and order is either accepted/placed or the order is rejected and the customer is promptly notified that no order exists.


2. Rather than answering (or stating you choose not to answer) the question posed regarding the rest of the order and expected shipment, you chose to disparage your competitors. I find that interesting as it has been my experience that suppliers who disparage their competitors do it out of weakness, insecurity, or because the have something to hide.

Before you comment on your competitors, you may find it prudent (then again you may not) to do a search on this forum regarding the level of customer service members of this forum have received from GS Custom.

I happened to do the search myself and found it quite enlightening. If your not sure how to do a search on past posts, please let me know and I would be happy to assist you.

nothing like beating a dead horse--keep it up and you will get your upcommence.

Mike,

quote:

My profession is a consultant in commercial contract negotiations and supplier management.

If you hope to draw fire away from your faux pas by implying that I do not understand what has been posted, that tactic won't work. No doubt such techniques will distract your opponent when negotiating contracts and such. It does not cut any ice with me and many others here.

quote:

One rule that all good suppliers follow is there is no such thing as an "incomplete order." The information to complete an order is either available or it is not and order is either accepted/placed or the order is rejected and the customer is promptly notified that no order exists.

On that basis lb404s order was only finalised on the 5th of January although we had been working on it since November some time. lb404 will confirm that we accommodated a change to the order in January just before shipping. If we had to be as inflexible as you suggest, and not start work on incomplete orders, the wait would be extended from what it is now. We have customers who change their mind when we tell them the order is packed and ready to ship. With your system, what should we do? Tell them to take a hike and that the order does not exist? We choose to accommodate them and give them what they want. I guess our system is flawed but we will not take your advice on this.

quote:

you chose to disparage your competitors

You choose to ignore the question I asked with the diversion that I disparage my competitors. No disparagement here, just a statement of fact, which you no doubt choose to "misunderstand" as a trained negotiator. Let me spell it out: Large orders placed on any small manufacturer cause delivery lead times that easily stretch into months, regardless of who they are and where they are located, but especially if the shipment is trans-continental. The good news is that we are solving this problem as well.

quote:

you may find it prudent (then again you may not) to do a search on this forum regarding the level of customer service members of this forum have received from GS Custom.

If you thought I would be scared of going there, you are mistaken. We have solved the problems that were caused for us, and many others, by the upheaval in global freight systems. The changing regulations and more stringent controls that started after 9/11 and has not stopped yet. Regarding the comments your search found, tell us what they are and make sure you mention the comments of the last 18 months also.

You are indeed flogging a dead horse here and you know it.

For good measure, you may want to take a look at this.

Gerard,

No distraction at all. What faux pas? I don't think it is a faux paus to express my beliefs about what I would be satisfied with regarding delivery of product from RSA when that delivery was described as order in Fall 2005 to receipt of goods in April 2006.

I think all of the above posts speak for themselves as well as all the history on this forum does.

You stated I did not answer your question...Is this question you are refering to?

"Why is it that you have a problem with us while other manufacturers who blatantly copy our products and move in and out of businees at the drop of a hat, or even disappear completely, do not ever warrant a mention by you? "

Here is my answer: I have no problem with GS Custom accept for the manner in which you have replied to these posts. If you read my original post there is no negative comment about GS Custom at all.

My second posts merely asks a clarifying question regarding your statement about the service you provide. I'll repeat it below for you.

"I am curious as to the ship dates for the rest of the order? is another 1/3 shipping next week? next month? or is the next 1/3 shipping in another 7 months?"

The other part of your question is with respect to the other bullet manufactures. I have never heard anything bad about them hence no comments.

Interesting you reference to September 11, 2001 and all of the problems it caused you and others.

I actually looked over some of the posts regarding GS Customer service from 2002-2004.

Seems the majority of the difficulties cutomers' had were about their credit cards being charged immediatley and product not being shipped for months or even over a year. Additionally, there were concerns with the failure of GS Custom to reply to emails. I don't see a connection between charging credit cards and not returning emails to the events of September 11, 2001.

I read your web link. There is 1 comment about service from a gentleman in RSA. The rest of the comments are about product performance. Product performance and customer service are two very different attributes of a business. I don't think I have ever heard a single bad comment about your product.

Since this discussion is about customer service and more particularly about customer service to US customers given the post was originated by a US customer, I don't see the relevance of a bunch customer comments about product performance and 1 comment about service from a customer in the RSA to this discussion.

This discussion has taught me alot about GS Custom.

If I were the owner of a manufacturing company and I had seen the response posted by me, here it is for clarity "And you call that coming through?"

I think I would have replied in the following manner:

"Mike,

I know GS Custom has had some customer service and delivery problems in the past but that is all behind us now. Although we first received an order from LB404 in October we did not finalize the order until Janaury 4th and then still had some manufaturing to do. The product actually shipped on X date and was received in early April.

It is GS Custom's goal to provide good customer service, so I invite you to place an order with us. When we receive your order we will provide you with an estimated ship date and your credit card will not be charged until the order is shipped. We will advise you of any changes to the estimated ship date and advise you of the actual ship date.

We look forward to your business

Gerard"

Your reply was:

"Mike, your snide comment is unwarranted. You look a fool when you shoot off your mouth like that. There are weight restrictions (44lbs max) on mail parcels from SA. In the USA there are value restrictions on what a person may receive of certain classes of goods within certain time periods, if you wish to avoid mountains of paperwork. These restrictions required that we split the shipment into three lots and stagger the delivery."

Quite the contrast in communication styles with marketplace.

Mike,
Very slick indeed. You have been taught well and your negotiator skills are well honed. However, your opening snide comment remains exactly that, despite the spin you put on it and you cover no new ground regarding the problems we had. The bottom line is that we made good and ensured that not a single person was out of pocket as a result of doing business with us. A number of customers who were extremely vocal about their orders at the time, have reordered and expressed their satisfaction with our solutions, on this forum.

Pretending to be a potential customer at this point is rich. You do cover all the possible angles when you spin. I am impressed.

Mike, goodness, what's gotten in your Wheaties? Dutch.

Oh My! I am not going to take sides just relay fax. I decided to try to make a big purchase of GS custom bullets. I purchased many from forum members but not all the ones I wanted were available. I posted about the concerns some members had with GS custom and received many PM's saying that they were satisfied with GS custom. On this basis I formulated a plan to pick up the bullets after my hunt in Zambia not knowing that there were not that many bullets laying around the GS custom shop to be bought. After arriving in Cape Town I called Gerrard. He called me back a day or so later and told me he didn't have the quantity I wanted to buy on hand. Much would not be produced until after the Christmas Season was over. I e-mailed an order when I got some time in October. Gerrard gave me an estimated time for production. When the bullets were made, I wanted to ammend my order to increas the number of some of the bullets. He said he could do it but it would delay the order. I was in not particular hurry so that was OK. When it was time to ship, one of the boxes was a little lighter than the other so I asked him to add enough bullets to the order to make a full shipping box. He said it would delay shipping a couple weeks longer which was OK with me. I just wanted to have a complete order so I would not have to go through all of this process again real soon. Gerrard notified me when the primary order was ready and a bank transfer was arranged. When the final lot of bullets were ready I sent another bank transfer. Gerrard said that once it got in the mail, it would come surface and could take quite some time. I e-mailed him the middle of March and he told me they were on the way and if I did not receive them by end of April to let him know. The only suggestion I have for Gerrard is perhaps he could drop an e-mail occasionally to let his client know the status of the order, basically keep the customer in the loop. So far I am happy. It is a little scary sending several thousand dollars overseas to Africa. So much can happen that is neither my fault nor the fault of the business man. A little communication periodically would go a long way in arresting those anxieties. I don't know why I ordered so many bullets. The two buff shot with the 380gr. 416 FN solids were one shot kills so two out of 50 leaves 48 more buffalo to kill!!!!!! from the first box!

lb404, can we assume you are willing to sell a few of your bullets? Which ones?

Yet another example of the trend in these forums. Why in heavens name would someone jump in and dump on someone? Especially rehashing old material. I have GS Custom bullets and I am very happy with them. Fortunately I have a good supply. If I run out, maybe LB will sell me some of his! Why rain on someone's parade?
Peter.