No matter what I use for lube or what caliber I'm loading for I am always having a problem with the cases being hard to re-size. So much so that the stuck case remover has become my new friend! Any clue as to what I'm doing wrong? I vibrate clean my cases, wipe them off, put a small amount of either Imperial case lube or RCBS spray lube on the neck and body of the case and then re-size them. The down stroke is a bear and the up stroke is just as hard and sometimes ripping the rim off of the case. I have cleaned my dies but I'm still having the problem. I'm open to suggestions.

IMO, if you are have the same difficulty with more than one die/caliber then I would look to a few common denominators. Lube, I use the old tried and true RCBS lube and pad. I have never had a stuck case with this, never. I have tried the new and improved spray lubes and have stuck a case or two with them, I always go back to my lube and pad.

Can you tell us more about your press, dies and what you are loading for? If it's not your lube maybe more info on your set-up may help diagnose the problem.

You don't say if you're lubing the inside case mouths. If not, you should be. Also, you can disassemble the sizing die and polish the expander ball.

Polishing the expander ball will help some, but you shouldn't have that much difficulty. I'd try a different lube. I used the old RCBS pad and lube for many years without any problems. A couple of years ago I decided to try a spray lube and use the Dillon spray stuff. Works very well and the only time I've ever stuck a case in a die was when I forgot to lube it.

Polishing your expander ball is easy. Take the die apart and chuck the stem in an electric drill then spin it against a small piece of 400 grit emery cloth with some oil on it. The ball will polish up and I found that this eliminated all chattering when the ball passes through the case neck. Of course, I also lube the inside of my case necks as well.

quote:

Originally posted by reelman:
No matter what I use for lube or what caliber I'm loading for I am always having a problem with the cases being hard to re-size. So much so that the stuck case remover has become my new friend! Any clue as to what I'm doing wrong? I vibrate clean my cases, wipe them off, put a small amount of either Imperial case lube or RCBS spray lube on the neck and body of the case and then re-size them. The down stroke is a bear and the up stroke is just as hard and sometimes ripping the rim off of the case. I have cleaned my dies but I'm still having the problem. I'm open to suggestions.

If you have any junk brass do this.
Take a clean junk case and put an extra heavy application of lube on it and not the spray on crap. Make sure it is greasy enough to cause lube dents.
Size it. This will transfer some lube to the inside of your die. The next case can be sized with a normal amount of lube. I usually apply the Imperial with greasy fingers. Use multiple junk cases with lots of lube until you learn how much it needed but always start out with too much.

Parting thoughts
If you have a mickey mouse press you may have a chronic problem that only another press will solve.
If you are having problems with .223 or similar brass with small rims the only cure is more lube. There is a small window between too much lube and too little lube with these small rimless cases.

Thanks for the help guys. I'm running a older Lyman turret press. It's a solid piece of equipment and I don't think that is the problem.

I mainly load 308, 243, and 300Wby. The 243 I am full length re-sizing with a small base die so I can understand it being a a little more difficult but the 308 and 300 I'm only neck sizing

You're getting stuck cases neck sizing 308 and 300Wby? Something ain't right.

Check your case length. I found if the cases are over max. case length they tend to get stuck in the die. I trim my cases 0.010" below max. case length and have not stuck a case using RCBS spray case lube.

Which brand dies are you using? One or two brands allow you to move the expander ball way up the dcapping stem into the die if you don't adjust it right.

If that happens, then the ball can be still slightly into the case neck, with the case neck into the neck sizing part of the die.

Naturally, that pinches the case neck wall between the expander ball and the die neck, which can make it danged near impossible to shove the case all the way into the die, or get it started back out of the die once it IS in there.

IF that should turn out to be your situation, just remove the decapping stem from the die, and turn the expander ball down the threads a little closer to the decapping pin. Put the decapping stem back into the die and the trouble should disappear like magic.

Been there, done that, 25 years ago.

Have you ever really cleaned the inside of your dies?
On delivery they are usually treated with a very sticky grease for rust protection, which makes using them almost impossible.

Give them a good scub with WD40 or a solvent and a bronze bore brush. Them wipe them out with tissue very thoroughly. Give it a try!

quote:

..... older Lyman turret press.

I mainly load 308, 243, and 300Wby. The 243 I am full length re-sizing with a small base die ..... but the 308 and 300 I'm only neck sizing

I used a .243 Winchester RCBS F/L (marked) Die for years and wondered what all the fuss was about. Until a Buddy said I should send it back to RCBS since that much effort wasn't indicative of re-sizing a normal .243 Winchester in a F/L Die. He was correct; it was indeed a Small Base Die instead of a F/L Die, incorrectly marked.

Yes, Martha those fired .243 Winchester cases REALLY did require some muscle to get in/out of that Small Base Die, for both the up & down stroke so from my perspective the amount of effort you're describing is "normal" for a SB Die; like yourself I also used as much lube as I could safely get away with in an attempt to make this process easier - to no avail. The amount of effort with a SB die is also dependant on the load & how tight/much slop there is in your chamber when the brass is fired.

Also, a Turret Press isn't as rigid as an "O" or "D" shaped press; so while Lyman is indeed a solid name in reloading the press may not be ideal for the amount of effort required when using a Small Base Die. If I didn't require the use of a Small Base for my purposes, then I wouldn't use one - it's your choice.

Now the 300 Witherbee & 308 Winchester are another Kettle-of-Fish altogether. If you're Neck Sizing these two cartridges with a small smear of lube between your fingers applied only to the case necks and graphite (applied with a brush or Q-Tip) on the inside of the necks; they ought to simply pop in/out with virtually no effort whatsoever, especially if you've polished the expander ball in the Die - then they really should be effortless.

quote:

Originally posted by reelman:
The down stroke is a bear and the up stroke is just as hard and sometimes ripping the rim off of the case.

Nothing wrong with the Imperial case lube you are using, I find it one of the best and have never experienced any problems with any case including the big tapered 404 case. Just a good smearing of Imperial from greasy fingers and thumb, a brush of graphite in the neck and as smooth and easy as you like in and out of the FL die.
The extract from your post says a lot "the down stroke is a bear" i.e. poor lubing, grossly oversized cases, dirty dies or coated with some sticky substance. The up stroke of course is where the case is partially or fully stuck and you are ripping the extractor rim off sometimes. Lack of inside neck lube is not usually a big issue as by the time the case is pulled over the sizing ball it is, or should be, clear of the die wall grip.

Has to be lube related as you are having trouble with all your cartridges by the sound of it.

Sometimes there is a residual preservative oil
from the maker. It will really stick to the
case until it is cleaned out. Brake cleaner
works well. Then Imperial lube (toss everything
else).

You aren't lubing the lower/thicker part of your cases well enough, that's where they stick.

Older presses with a 'single toggle' lever system have much less leverage and do require more arm force. And a lot stronger bench too.

No amount of lube inside a neck or polishing an expandeer will affect stuck cases, they don't even come into contact until the case itself has been released by the die wall.

quote:

the 308 and 300 I'm only neck sizing

Are you trying to neck size in a full length die? Are you lubing the inside of the case necks?

exercise more

quote:

Originally posted by reelman:
No matter what I use for lube or what caliber I'm loading for I am always having a problem with the cases being hard to re-size. So much so that the stuck case remover has become my new friend! Any clue as to what I'm doing wrong? I vibrate clean my cases, wipe them off, put a small amount of either Imperial case lube or RCBS spray lube on the neck and body of the case and then re-size them. The down stroke is a bear and the up stroke is just as hard and sometimes ripping the rim off of the case. I have cleaned my dies but I'm still having the problem. I'm open to suggestions.

I had similar problems with Lyman Spray Lubricant. Terrible to remove so many cases. I followed instruction as indicated on the can, but I still had stuck cases. I then switched to RCBS Lube II (water base) and never had any stuck case again. I later started using Imperial Case wax. Before sizing the first case, thoroughly clean the die with solvent. Then the first 2 case I lube thinly between the fingers and resize them. From there I only lube every second case. Never had any stuck cases. For inside neck lube I would dip every 2nd case in the wax. Just wipe it clean so that there is not excessive lube.

None of the older Lyman turrets have compound leverage of any note. The Spar T has the common linkage found on C presses and is adequate for ordinary work. The Lyman All American and Tru-line presses are not adequate for heavy tasks.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim C. <><:
You aren't lubing the lower/thicker part of your cases well enough, that's where they stick.

No amount of lube inside a neck or polishing an expandeer will affect stuck cases, they don't even come into contact until the case itself has been released by the die wall.

+1

The only case I have ever stuck in a sizing die was many years ago with one of the spray on lubes.

I know lots of folks use and swear by Imperial, but if you want to really test a case lube, try resizing any of the WSSM cases. The cases are extremely thick brass and commonly run breech pressures up to 63,000 psi. Especially when fired in an AR, they take a lot of resizing since the bolt starts to unlock before the breech pressure has completely subsided expanding the case even more than one fired in a bolt gun.

I tried Imperial on the first 243 WSSM case sized and a banshee would have been proud of the squall emitted from my sizing die! Wiped off the Imperial and re-lubed with Hornady Unique Case Lube; end of problem.

Regards,
hm

The best case lube I have ever used appeared to be a common chassis lube. On a heavily tapered case it actually allow the case to push itself back out of the die one I broke the press linkage over center.

I suspect all you did with the Imperial was coat the die so the Hornady could then work. You might have gotten the same results the other ways around.

For a better test of your lube try squashing a .444 Marlin solid case head at .464 diameter flush into a .450 diamter steel .44 Mag die. I have split two of them doing that.

quote:

and a banshee would have been proud of the squall emitted from my sizing die!

hm-96,



A man after my own heart - with diverse loading experience(s) for sure! Sounds similar to my attempts with that .243 Winchester Small Base Sizing Die.

quote:

Originally posted by Gerry:

quote:

and a banshee would have been proud of the squall emitted from my sizing die!

hm-96,



A man after my own heart - with diverse loading experience(s) for sure! Sounds similar to my attempts with that .243 Winchester Small Base Sizing Die.

Gerry, if you can get some, give the Horandy lube a try. I had used Forster brand lube which I think is the same thing for many years. It comes in a small tub (about 2" or so in diameter) and seems to be similar to lard so I think it is animal fat. Directions say it works well to waterproof boots also. I put some on my snake boots and sure enough it does that well also.

Here is a link to Midway listing on Unique:
Hornady Unique Case Lube

As for "seasoning" my die with the Imperial, I don't think so since the WSSM's still squall w/the Imperial but not with Hornady.

Regards,
hm

Edit to add:
reelman,whatever lube you find works best, be sure to put plenty on the bottom half of the case as that is where 90% of your friction is. If your cases are expanded considerably in the thicker area of brass (as is the situation w/AR fired WSSM's), it takes a lot of force to squeeze it back to specs.

I'm a RCBS lube and stamp pad man myself. I roll the case(s) on the pad and then turn the case up and press the mouth into the pad. Like I'm trying to cut a small doughnut out of the pad. This puts a trace amount of lube on the inside of the mouth. Also, before I wipe the brass down with a soft cloth and do a visual on them, before resizing, I brush out the necks with a proper sized bore brush in a drill motor. I'll tease a small amount of 0000# steel wool into the bore brush.
None of my presses are compound and I find that brushing out the necks and the small amount of inside lube makes a great difference.

hm,

quote:

I'm a RCBS lube and stamp pad man myself.

Like Wassa-Bee, I've always used RCBS & their Pad. Currently I've got RCBS, Lee & Imperial sitting on the bench and grab whatever I require for the task at hand.

I'll be happy to take your advise and if I stumble across some Hornady lube I'll certainly give it a try altough here in the Fatherland I've never seen any.

'Cept for those troublesome .243 Winchester Small Base Dies, in 40+ years of reloading I've never had any issues with lubing/stuck cases and getting them in/out of the Dies with less than considerable ease.



Do you use it on your Snake Boots as a repellant or simply to waterprooof?



We don't have any isues with snakes here in The Fatherland when compared to the U.S. - I've seen 3 in many yes, and the European Cross Adder is so lethargic as to be a joke. You'd have to work prettty hard to get bit by one.

quote:

Originally posted by Gerry:
hm,
Do you use it on your Snake Boots as a repellant or simply to waterprooof?



We don't have any isues with snakes here in The Fatherland when compared to the U.S. - I've seen 3 in many yes, and the European Cross Adder is so lethargic as to be a joke. You'd have to work prettty hard to get bit by one.

Gerry, I use the Forster's on my boots to water proof them and it works quite well.

Have lots of pretty good sized rattlesnakes on the ranches I hunt. Fortunately, most are not aggressive and, given the opportunity, will try to escape. Over the years have had two that exhibited aggressive behavior, however.


Regards,
hm

lube the inside of the case neck with a q-tip. I have to do this with all my rifle brass.

Had similar problems when I first started. Critical to get just the right amount of lube and have to lube the insides of neck. I also had used this walnut media that had red dust mixed in, got all over insides of brass and when I resized, the red would build up on expander ball and top of die wall inside, caused problems and I'd take apart to clean. Then I screwed up expander ball location, had to get it right. On Forester dies, there's a pin hole that should match up with lower third of expander ball. No problems anymore.

Thanks for all the help guys. After getting a case stuck in the SB 243 die so bad that I could not get it out no matter what I did I bought a new set of standard RCBS 243 dies. A little Imperial lube and they slide in and out for resizing like nobodies business!