Anyone bother using a primer sealant on cartridges they intend to use in wet hunting conditions? I'm thinking about this ahead of my black bear hunt in Alaska in September. I'll be using handloads, which I've had no issue with in the past, but the outfitter advised so heavily on wet weather gear that my mind's turning on whether or not I should be worried about my ammo, as well.

Thanks.

Never tried it myself but remember reading about someone using clear nail polish to seal primers.

Many militaries used a lacquer to seal primers and to a lesser extent bullets. Nail polish is a cheap and convenient form of lacquer. Don't forget a piece of duct tape over the muzzle to prevent rainwater from entering the bore. The late PH and gunwriter, Finn Aagard, swore by it. A couple of coats of auto paste wax over your gunmetal will also retard rust (even if it is SS). SS will rust.

Once I bought ten gallons of primer sealer from the DRMO auction on RIA. I still have some, which are probably solid by now.
It is just red lacquer.
Anyway, from the number of times I have had shotgun shells, and rifle ammo washed in the washing machine, it is a waste of time to seal the primers. They are already sealed.
And what about your bullet? Those are sealed by the military too.

I use clear nail polish to seal primers I load for powerheads used in spear guns.

We dive to about 100 foot, and non has misfired.

Could I use nail polish to get at least one shot out of that new Winchester .45-70 brass I bought, where the primers fell out after loading the cartridges?

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
Could I use nail polish to get at least one shot out of that new Winchester .45-70 brass I bought, where the primers fell out after loading the cartridges?

Sambarman, in your case for a more lasting solution for the loose primer pockets I would feed the cases down over a piece of rod held in a vise and then lightly tap a steel ball bearing of a size sitting on the primer pocket lip, swaging the primer pocket rim slightly. Or for more consistency do the same swaging exercise by clamping between the vise jaws.

If one want one can use different colors for different loads.

I found it to be to much trouble.

Thanks guys. I might give the clear nail polish a try on some loads this weekend to see if there is a velocity or POI difference.

Yes, swage your primer pockets back into shape; do not rely on sealant to hold them in.
And again, sealing primers that fit properly, is a huge waste of time. If you don't believe me, soak them in water. Or just put them in a damp pocket like on a hunt. Totally unnecessary. And you still have the bullet to seal, which, if you get too much on it, will increase pressures.
A solution to a non problem. In my experience with wet, soaked, and washed, ammo.

I’ve used nail polish for sealing primers and silicone caulk for sealing crimps on waterfowl loads before.

Since switching to bismuth shot, I haven’t bothered with it - I was more worried about the shot rusting together- and ammo I loaded 10 years ago still has no problems… even though it’s not stored in ideal conditions. Some shells I left in the bottom of a boat over winter killed ducks just fine.

Kind of an answer in search of a problem IMO.

Thanks Lindsay and Tom.
I'm not sure how the ball-bearing helps though, as I imagine it might widen the pocket further.

The couple of cases I know are concerned have already been loaded, so I'm wondering whether to swage them with the primers in or out. The easiest method for me might be using the vice, if I get the pressure right.

So far, the primers are just held in place with sticky tape (Durex ), and I was contemplating removing it just before use at the range and loading the cartridges carefully. Would the primer expand to obturate doing that or is gas leakage likely?

many have used a ball bearing to swage a berdan primer pocket hole diameter of ~.217" down to a boxer primer pocket hole diameter of ~.210" I've used nail polish as sealant too not often though. BestAll

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
Thanks Lindsay and Tom.
I'm not sure how the ball-bearing helps though, as I imagine it might widen the pocket further.

The couple of cases I know are concerned have already been loaded, so I'm wondering whether to swage them with the primers in or out. The easiest method for me might be using the vice, if I get the pressure right.

So far, the primers are just held in place with sticky tape (Durex ), and I was contemplating removing it just before use at the range and loading the cartridges carefully. Would the primer expand to obturate doing that or is gas leakage likely?

Not sure about the sticky tape, likely to pull the primer out attached to the tape when removing the tape? Finger nail polish will certainly hold the primers in place better than using tape and in either case whether the loose primers would obturate into the primer pocket, probably would! Still not solving the problem of loose primer pockets for future reloading though.

You can get a 'wicking' Loctite which wicks in and locks sleeves etc, in place. This would provide a better hold, seal and obturation of loose primers. Depriming would be a little harder but would likely leave a residual layer of set Loctite around the primer pocket which would see new primers fit tighter in the pocket.

As to the OP's original question, from several experiences of dropping warm ammo into snow feed rivers or pools where you may expect the rapid cooling and vacuum inside the case to draw in moisture, never experienced any problems as in all cases the ammo has fired normally when eventually used.

Swaging with a primer in the case is a bad idea.

Empty case.

You take an empty primer pocket and place the bearing in place, then smack it with a hammer.

The inside of the primer pocket takes a ring like wedge at the outer edge where you made contact inside the pocket... yes the outside (case head side) will get widened but the inside (inside the primer pocket) will narrow.

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
Thanks Lindsay and Tom.
I'm not sure how the ball-bearing helps though, as I imagine it might widen the pocket further.

The couple of cases I know are concerned have already been loaded, so I'm wondering whether to swage them with the primers in or out. The easiest method for me might be using the vice, if I get the pressure right.

So far, the primers are just held in place with sticky tape (Durex ), and I was contemplating removing it just before use at the range and loading the cartridges carefully. Would the primer expand to obturate doing that or is gas leakage likely?

Thanks guys,
I think I can get the sticky tape off without trouble but was hoping not to pull my crimped bullets. After firing, I would just scrap those cases, as they can only get worse.

The ball bearing solution sounds counter-intuitive but your agreement suggests it must work. Could a hollow punch around the pocket be used, though it might leave a mark?

Maybe I could squish the rims a little. If that makes them a thou or two thicker, it should not matter in that Miroku 86.

Could the wicking Loktite possibly leave channels between the 'wicks', Eagle, allowing gas passages to escape through? Nail polish would certainly be easier to find around here, though the girls sometimes tend to stuff with flecks in it.

I wrote more before but swiped down for some reason and wiped my efforts, so must be wary of that with this tablet.

quote:

Anyway, from the number of times I have had shotgun shells, and rifle ammo washed in the washing machine, it is a waste of time to seal the primers. They are already sealed.

Been there, done that.

Worrying about sealing primers is about the last thing I'd think of when preparing for a wet weather hunt. Toss a few rounds in a pan of water and leave them a few days. Then see how many misfires you get. Now, go worry about something else.

I've used primer sealant on some 338 WM rounds I loaded up simply because the primer pockets had loosened up a bit. They seated really easy and I tried tapping a case on a wooden table to see if the primer would back out of the pocket. It didn't back out but I figured this will be my last load with those cases. So, I sealed the primers with George & Roy's primer sealant just to be sure I didn't have any problems.

+1 on tape over the muzzle. Have hunted rainforests in Alaska and Oregon, plus heavy snow in Colorado and New Mexico. Used either electrical tape or a small balloon. Balloon turned out best since it pops through easily when you shoot, and when going through brush and such, you can readily tell if it's still in place. My two cents...

Tape over the muzzle is a great idea, but its main purpose is to stop mud from blocking tbe barrel in case you trip. I have shot through the tape many times with no ill effects.

As to water, someone once pointed out we should leave a gap at the bottom edge of the tape on the muzzle, so that if water does get in, possible from tbe breech, it can run out again and not form a blockage itself. This may not be such a great idea if you carry the rifle a lot with the muzzle up, say slung, however.

I used clear fingernail polish for years when I hunted Alaska, Alberta, British Columbia, Colorado in snow and never had a problem. Also used the balloons over the end of the barrel, Black or colored if I could find them so I would notice if they came off by accident. Good Shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by Brandon.Gleason:
Anyone bother using a primer sealant on cartridges they intend to use in wet hunting conditions? I'm thinking about this ahead of my black bear hunt in Alaska in September. I'll be using handloads, which I've had no issue with in the past, but the outfitter advised so heavily on wet weather gear that my mind's turning on whether or not I should be worried about my ammo, as well.

Thanks.

Quit worrying about stupid shit?
I would spend my time before the hunt getting in shape like running with a full pack and shooting off hand at a paper plate @ 100 yds. Remember your plane could always crash, boat sink etc. if your looking for worry shit?

SAmbarman,

You're in trouble, blown primers that fall out are signs of high pressure and those cases should be dumped..The other probable cause is excess head space and your old Winchester needs those two locking lugs replaced and hand fitted. If its a Marlin Im not sure what the cure is. New 45-70 brass is available state wide.

Thanks Ray,
As it happens the cases that had the primers drop out were unfired Winchester brass - they haven't even been in the rifle yet. I can see where you're coming from, though, as it would be easy to link it with the Miroku-misfires thread.

Can you think of any answer to that problem?

I once conducted sort of an experiment of sorts. I accidentally left a factory case of 1000 I’d Avila 45 ACP in the back of my pickup for a year. Since I park outside it got rained on, snowed on, heat, cold, and 57,000 miles of road vibration.

I took tut ammo to a revolver class at Thunder Ranch (I took another 1000 rounds with me just in case) and out of all of that. It a single misfire.

So unless you are part of one of our Naval Special Warfare units and are entering Africa on an SDV pool eyed by SEALS I think all of this primer sealant is overrated.

Primers are very hard to kill.

I think the purpose of a sealant is to avoid water getting to the powder.