I have some new in packet RWS .404J cases which I will soon start to load. I have had the brass for 36 years now and not sure how much older it would have been when given to me by a friend in Germany.
I understand RWS brass is of high quality and properly annealed from the factory and other packets of this same brass I have used so far have given sterling service with multiple reloads. I did lose two cases with neck cracks before I got around to annealing but this was after many years of use. I annealed all the cases I was using and they are still going fine.

Despite the age, because the new cases are held in thin plastic separators in the cardboard boxes they are absolutely unmarked just as they left the factory so no concerns about corrosion brought about by touching the cardboard or other cases.

Would it be a good precautionary measure to anneal the new brass before use, or does new brass not lose its elasticity with age?

I would as a precautionary measure. Your other brass has been annealed to prolong its life through many years and reloadings so you have a good handle on it. Some brass, regardless of initial quality can age harden.

RWS brass are high quality, but you would find that their inside volume might be a little bit smaller due to thicker sides. Try to develop a load by starting a two grains below and then increase gradually. Annealing these cases is the right way to go. It can only benefit them. When you have cracks in the necks, it is a sign that you need to anneal. Most reloaders anneal after every 3 - 4 reload.

Metal does harden with age alone, but age in this case is measured in centuries, not a few decades. I suspect that your RWS brass has virtually the same level of anneal that it had when it left the factory and annealing further might turn it to the hardness of warm butter.

Stonecreek

That is an interesting comment. I was of the opinion that the temperature reached and not the frequency of annealing determined the hardness. Quite a few of the competitive shooters now anneal each time they load to assure load to load consistency (such as fclass shooters).

Please clarify if possible. If you are correct that is a very important bit of information.

The "cheat" here is simple. The very best temp for anneal is around 450 C as I recall. You can melt pure lead at around 400 C. You hold the case in your fingers, melt pure lead (alloys melt cooler and DO NOT work well!!!), dip the neck area that you want annealed for sure into the lead and when your fingers get too hot to hold, drop into water. Obviously the case needs to be without primer to permit the lead to contact both sides of the neck. Luck.

quote:

Metal does harden with age alone, but age in this case is measured in centuries, not a few decades.

I bought brand new Herters brass (I've read that is is Norma or Hirtzenberger) for my 222remmag. The seller said he bought it new back in the late 1960's. I trimmed, loaded and shot 20 pieces and had neck splits on 7 or 8 of them. I annealed the rest and have had no neck splits after multiple loadings. FWIW.

Thanks for all the replies.

I think I will err on the side of caution and anneal the 'new' RWS cases before loading. I have got a supply of early Kynoch factory loaded ammo and out of every 10 or so fired I will usually get one or two cases with split necks. Once the cases without splits are annealed they are fine and I have not lost any of these yet.

I've got a good set up for annealing so not a problem to do.

If you want to shoot much of that Kynoch ammo, wou could pull the bullet and save the powder from each case - deprime, anneal and then reprime and replace the powder and bullet so that you might save all the cases. I have a cam lock bullet puller to suit if you want to do that.

Thanks VG, I had thought of that and do have a RCBS collet puller which would do the job. The Kynoch cases are berdan primed although that is not a issue as I have a decapper and new primers to suit.

I don't have too many more packets of the old K ammo so will probably keep them for serious use one day or even collector items.

The RWS brass will keep the old Mauser going for a while and I see Gun City has 404 Norma brass in stock too, a touch pricy though.

Here's a question no one has been able to answer. Why does brass soften (anneal) when it is quenched, but any other metal hardens when it is quenched????

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Originally posted by Max503:
Here's a question no one has been able to answer. Why does brass soften (anneal) when it is quenched, but any other metal hardens when it is quenched????

Brass softens or anneals without quenching. It is just the heating that does the annealing. Quenching is only done to halt heat transfer past the neck and shoulder area of the case. You are correct though in that quenching does not re-harden the brass.

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Originally posted by AFRICAN LEADWOOD:
Stonecreek

That is an interesting comment. I was of the opinion that the temperature reached and not the frequency of annealing determined the hardness. Quite a few of the competitive shooters now anneal each time they load to assure load to load consistency (such as fclass shooters).

Please clarify if possible. If you are correct that is a very important bit of information.

By "further annealing" I meant raising the temperature of the brass to the point that it softened from its current hardness. I did not intend to indicate that annealing to a relatively low temperature would make it softer.

quote:

Originally posted by k-22hornet:

quote:

Metal does harden with age alone, but age in this case is measured in centuries, not a few decades.

I bought brand new Herters brass (I've read that is is Norma or Hirtzenberger) for my 222remmag. The seller said he bought it new back in the late 1960's. I trimmed, loaded and shot 20 pieces and had neck splits on 7 or 8 of them. I annealed the rest and have had no neck splits after multiple loadings. FWIW.

Curious. I have a large supply of the identical .222 Magnum brass which I purchased new directly from Herter's in 1971 according to my records. I have loaded it many times without annealing and have never lost a case. My lot of brass was labelled "Made in Finland", which causes me to assume that it was from either Sako or Lapua (but Herter's was famous for its B.S. and it could have just as easily been from Panama). I also have several hundred rounds of ancient loaded Herter's factory .222 ammunition obtained in a trade (also labelled Finland). I've fired about 150 rounds of it with no split necks and reloaded 100 rounds which has performed perfectly.

I don't think that your split necks have to do so much with age as with the original condition of the cases. After all, a brass case is not metallurgically much different from a copper pipe sitting under a slab or a copper wire in your attic. Many of those are well over a century old and I've never heard of age-hardening being a problem. I haven't heard of the need for an expiration date on bullet jackets, either.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:

quote:

Originally posted by AFRICAN LEADWOOD:
Stonecreek

That is an interesting comment. I was of the opinion that the temperature reached and not the frequency of annealing determined the hardness. Quite a few of the competitive shooters now anneal each time they load to assure load to load consistency (such as fclass shooters).

Please clarify if possible. If you are correct that is a very important bit of information.

By "further annealing" I meant raising the temperature of the brass to the point that it softened from its current hardness. I did not intend to indicate that annealing to a relatively low temperature would make it softer.

Thanks for clarifying. We agree on that.