I've heard many folks say "I load over book by XX amount" when I reload for my 7X57. My observation has been that after reading many manuals for this round, the max loads vary by a large margin over the years. So, to keep it simple, I'd like to hear what YOUR "book" shows for the maximum charge for this one round using the following common powder and ***150 grain bullets*** for an apples to apples comparison. Please include the copyright date of your manual (or something close). This should be interesting. I'll post my book load later.

H-4831

Looking at the two books I have next to the PC

Hornady bookVolII 1973 154gr 51.1gr 4831 (doesn't say which)


My Nosler #4 1996 doesn't list 4831 for the 150. For the 160 it lists 49 Using the same ratio to 4350 that would put max for the 150 as 51 grs.

I think H4831 is a poor powder for your study. Says 51gr is only 55,000 but 110% of volume capacity. So unless you seat the bullet out you are volume limited.

Looking at the Hornady book comparing their max to QL they appear to stop in the 51,000-55,000 range except for 4350 that is 63,000.

The Nosler manual appears to stop in the 51,000-54,000 range.

A lot will depend on the COAL you are using. I load several grs above book max but I also seat the bullet out long.

Sierra, 50th Anniversary and 2nd edition.
7x57
150g
H4831---52.7 Max/2800 fps
Win brass/WLR primer
Mauser 95, 29in barrel

Loading H4831, or IMR for that matter in a 7mm, is like loading black powder; fill the case as full as you can. Pick a faster powder.

1996 Lee 52
1998 Hodgdon 48

Nosler Online Load Data (Version 7.0)

49.0 gr. H-4831SC

Still trying to understand what you are wanting to prove using 4831. What you are seeing are volume limits that will vary slightly due to bullet shape.

As dpcd suggested if you want to see book loads based on pressure go with a faster powder.

The point of the post is to see the variation from one manual to another over the years.
Unless noted otherwise with an asterisk*, 150 grain bullets using H4831 or H4831SC is assumed.
So, far.....

Hornady 1973 51.1gr *154gr
Sierra, 50th 52.7
1996 Lee 52
1998 Hodgdon 48
Nosler Online 49
1966 Ackley 51 *154gr-IMR4831

Not as much maximum spread as I thought. Hmmm.

You are seeing very little variation for 4831 because you are at a volume limit not pressure. Lawyers have no impact.

If you want to test variations go with a faster powder that is not volume limited.

Simply comparing the two manual I mentioned and Hodgdon and Nosler online the ranges for 4895, 4320 and 4064 vary by 5-6 grs. With the 1973 Hornady manual being the highest and the Hodgdon online being the lowest.

I think my point was well made based on the responses. Not all max loads are the same in every book. A 4.7 spread may not be as much as I thought, yet it is substantial. Thanks to all who participated. I appreciate the input.

I have a lot of reloading books, been buying the damn things for years...I read them a lot and compare and it will sure confuse you..best to start with the books minimun load suggestion and work up to your guns max and forget the books..

Um, don't 'forget the (reloading) books' unless you want to be known as the 'three fingered reloader'. Kind of like advising to 'forget the speed limits' when driving and 'work up to your vehicles maximum speed'. Both recipes for disaster....

A chronograph is almost mandatory IMO.

I usually look at about 4 different manuals at least, and then pick a starting load based on an average.

This has come up a million times, as this caliber, great as it is varies so much in throat length, you have to use your head and work up a load. Years ago, probably 30 years ago, I had a 7x57 Model 70, loaded 51.5 gr IMR 4350 with a 140 grain, it chrono'd 2875 in it. Somewhere along the way, it got sold, and I bought my current Ruger, which is long throated, found a box of those old loads to sight it in with and they went 2675 fps in it! Of course, I seated them out, loaded 53 gr H414 ultimately and they went right at 3000 fps. I had a pressure trace, and these were if I remember 62000psi, hot but no problem. They would have probably been 70000 psi in the old Winchester. There are no rules for this cartridge except use a chrono, pressure trace and common sense.

Firstly I own a 280 AI & a 7mm08. I have been shooting the 280 AI for over 15 years & the 7mm08 for about 10 years. The principles apply for the 7X57 as well. I would not use any powder slower than H4350, N160 or Re19 - in the 7X57.

I have Ken Waters' Pet Loads and also Bob Milek's loads for the various 7mms. Milek's loads are a bit on the hot side. Waters' research is incredibly detailed.

Comparing that info with the actual manuals (particularly Lyman) was easy & gave me a good understanding of the max pressures for each load in my rifle.

I always chronograph my new loads and check for usual pressure signs - shiny case head or brass shaving from ejector port on bolt face, tight extraction, brass flow & need for trimming etc. I even stared measuring the fired primers on a micrometer & was surprised to see hat brims from loads I thought were totally safe.

Final conclusions - no free lunch. Push for that extra 50 fps at your own risk!

quote:

Originally posted by Shootshellz:
Um, don't 'forget the (reloading) books' unless you want to be known as the 'three fingered reloader'. Kind of like advising to 'forget the speed limits' when driving and 'work up to your vehicles maximum speed'. Both recipes for disaster....

You missed Ray's point entirely, a point which I happen to fully agree with. Ray is saying use the book or books to get a starting load then work up to a maximum in your particular rifle with the components you are using. This is pretty standard reloading practice. Throw the book/s away when trying to determine a maximum load for your rifle.

A reloading book only gives maximum loads in the particular rifle or test barrel that is being used, with the components that are being used, no different than what a handloader himself does. Yes a chronograph is always used by the company doing the testing for their book but they are not always pressure testing all their loads as most do not publish pressures for all of the cartridges they load and test for.

As most who have done any amount of reloading know, every rifle is different and a load in one rifle that locks the breach may function perfectly fine in another and give good case life. We have all heard stories some in posts here, where factory ammo has shown high pressure signs in some rifles to the point of hard extraction at times.

The point being that even though factory ammo is supposedly loaded to certain standards for pressure and velocity, in some firearms this can be more than maximum.

So like Ray, I say use the books to help choose a powder that is better suited to your cartridge, begin at the recommended starting loads and work up to a level you are happy with in terms of accuracy and velocity (if you have a chronograoh) and one that functions in your firearm without showing any adverse pressure signs and gives good case life.

If one does not know what those signs are or does not know what case life/primer pocket tightness is, then they need to seek advice and learn from someone with that experience.