I have two .22-250 rifles. One a CZ American and one a Howa 1500.

I FL resize each cartridge, trim accordingly and load a "standard" middle of road recipe and it acts like a high pressure load in my Howa but shoots fine in my CZ.

By high pressure, I mean I'm having difficult extractions with the Howa but the CZ extracts them fine.

I've even used the Hornady C.O.A.L. tools and created specific loads for the Howa but for some reason, some relatively light loads don't extract very easily.

When I do find a recipe it likes, it works like magic, but for some reason, I can't seem to shoot the same "generic" load in each gun.

Is there a reason or explanation as to why the Howa would require "lighter" loads? Seems very odd to me especially when I am no where near pushing the pressure limits for the recipes I'm using.

quote:

I can't seem to shoot the same "generic" load in each gun.

And you would be lucky to be able to do so. All rifles are different. What the difference between the two rifles is is anyone's guess, but that's not an uncommon experience. You wouldn't want it simple would you?

LWD

LWD - One would assume that if the brass is FL resized, trimmed within spec, loaded with a WLR primer, a 50 Gr Sierra bullet and ~35 gr of Varget, with a OAL of 2.350", that this would NOT act like a hot load in ANY rifle, correct?

We're talking recommended published loads that shoot just fine in the CZ but won't always extract easily in the Howa.

Its not that big of a deal because I'm now reloading specifically for each rifle. I just find it extremely odd that a "standard" middle of the range load acts "hot" in one rifle but not the other.

Any chance the barrel might be "fouled" real bad? Occasionally a barrel will look clean when in reality it is pulling a clinton on you.

I don't think so. It's a stainless model (if that matters at all) and it has been kept pretty spotless. I'm anal about keeping my guns clean.

What's weird is that I can switch to another load mid stride, all extract fine, when I come back, it gets sticky again.

I've read on various forums that the Howas "like" lighter loads and I've found a very accurate one with a 36gr Barnes Varmint Grenade but I should be able to shoot heavier without much issue IMHO.

Is the velocity of the "Howa" load about par with book max? If so you are at max.

bama

quote:

LWD - One would assume that if the brass is FL resized, trimmed within spec, loaded with a WLR primer, a 50 Gr Sierra bullet and ~35 gr of Varget, with a OAL of 2.350", that this would NOT act like a hot load in ANY rifle, correct?

Here's the "hedge" answer.

Yes, that's a very light load. .5 gr over minimum if I read the Hodgdon website correctly. And I sure wouldn't expect a problem.

But, I will not call it safe in any rifle merely because it is within spec and a close to mininal charge. Assuming anything with reloading is potentially hazardous.

Depending on the shape of the bullet, you could be jamming into the rifling. I once loaded some 100 grain Sierra Gamekings for my A-Bolt .243 to the SAAMI COL and they wouldn't chamber. The bullet came out with rifling marks on it from where I had tried to force it in. (Bad idea, I know, not to load a dummy round first and then force the issue when a problem was apparent.) I had to see the rifling marks on 2 different cartridges before I would accept or conclude what the problem was. Every other load (5 different bullets, I think) I had every run through the gun had been loaded to the spec COL with no problem, but this bullet shape just didn't work for that chamber.

This, of course, may not be your problem.

When you say switch to another load do you mean powder or bullet? If different bullets work, then the shape of the bullet might be the issue.

Are there any other pressures signs?

LWD

I don't know the velocity but I would assume it has LESS since it's a smaller sporter model vs. the longer length of the CZ.

The rounds chamber flawlessly and with minimal effort although I will chamber one and see if I can find any land marks. Although, when compared to the rounds I made with a comparator and O.A.L. gauge, the "generic" rounds are definitely shorter so I doubt that is the issue but you never know.

The "Howa specific" rounds are definitely another bullet. Again, same ease of chambering and extraction is effortless.

From what I can tell, no other pressure signs. Primers aren't flattened, no noticable damage to the case...

I don't know, I'm at a loss on this one.

I think that you will want to find out about the velocity of those two rifles. If the velocity is at acceptalble levels for you application you might just have two rifles with a wide differnce in chamber size, amount of freebore, and the actual cut of the barell bore being undersized/oversized. Is one of the guns newer than the other one? Sometime after use some of those difference melt down a little. But you might just have ended up with two different shooters!!!!!

quote:

I think that you will want to find out about the velocity of those two rifles. If the velocity is at acceptalble levels for you application you might just have two rifles with a wide differnce in chamber size, amount of freebore, and the actual cut of the barell bore being undersized/oversized. Is one of the guns newer than the other one? Sometime after use some of those difference melt down a little. But you might just have ended up with two different shooters!!!!!

+1

You may not ever know the reason for this. But it is odd that other loads seem to work without problem.

LWD

I agree, could just be "one of those things".

The guns themselves are both fairly new. I would say easily less than 300 rounds down the pipe of each.

At least they're both accurate. That's all that matters right?

What do the primers look like out of the Howa?

Are they showing any signs of pressure?

quote:

Originally posted by mgoodrich:
What do the primers look like out of the Howa?

Are they showing any signs of pressure?

They look fine. In fact, when I put them side-by-side to compare with other loads, you can't tell the difference in the two.

I just re-read your post, and presure signs to me usaully show up in my guns as follows:

Flattened primers, next the primers fire pin hole starts to protude into the bolt, after that the bolt becomes slightly hard to turn open, and last the bolt is really hard to open and the shell will not extract and the lettering on the brass has flattened as well.

The only time I had problems with shell extractions only with normal loads, the extractor was malfunctioning.

Is the Howa a new gun? I would take it back to the dealer and have them look at the extractor, or take it to a gun smith and show them the problem. I bet they would fix it fairly quickly.

quote:

The only time I had problems with shell extractions only with normal loads, the extractor was malfunctioning.

Is the Howa a new gun? I would take it back to the dealer and have them look at the extractor, or take it to a gun smith and show them the problem. I bet they would fix it fairly quickly.

Good point. No other pressures signs seems odd. I have a Hungarian-made Hi Power clone that had a chamber so rough it had to be polished out to make it function properly. SO may be that's a problem as well.

LWD