Recently, I ran a test on some 30-06 brass.

In looking for brass which had neck thickness of .001" or less I found 44/100 for Lapua and 41/100 from Winchester.

For an apples to apples comparison I ran through Midway's web site for the current cost of 100 each of Lapua ($68.99) and Winchester ($29.98).

The basic cost per piece of brass would be $.6899/Lapua and $.2998/Winchester. If I wanted to break it down for just the pieces of brass which were .001" or less in neck thickness diameter, it would be $1.57 each for Lapua and $.73 each for the Winchester; or more than twice the cost for Lapua.

If I were to set my standard at .002" or less in the necks then...

89/100 Lapua and 95/100 Winchester. That's $.775/each for Lapua and $.315/each for Winchester.

Don't know gang, when Winchester can be made to equate to Lapua. Let's see where that statement get me!

I tested a buch of rem 375, 338 and 300 ultra brass and it was all under .002 most under .001 so i gave up on the trim the necks Idea.

If neck thickness was the only factor in brass quality you might have a point. If all winchester brass was as consistant as your 30-06 you would also have a good point.
Problem is that there are a lot more factors in brass quality than just neck variation. Last year we tested some WW 375 H&H brass that had up to .008 of variance in neck wall diameter.
To bad all of thier brass isn't as good as the lot of 30-06 you have. Some of thier brass is pretty good. Some of it isn't...........................DJ

When you can get a large lot of once fired WW brass for .05 each it becomes harder to justify the Lapua brass for many uses.
Lapua's offerings are so meager I don't see how they stay in the brass business.

GSSP, There are indeed a few things more than just a single case measurment, the most important measurment would be of group size! I have had very good results with both brands, and prefer the Lapua for several applications basically because of the primer pockets being drilled and not punched.

Also I feel or think that it may be better therefore it is... or not!

And it really comes down to what do you plan on dong with the brass?? If its a hunting appliction, then I don't think the difference in group size would justify the extra cost --except for the feel-good as noted. If its competitive target shooting, then its another story. Finally, if it is target, then the amount of time you have to spend prepping the WW brass to Lupua standards has got to be worth something. The "sweat equity" you have in the WW might make it more expensive than Lapua.

quote:

Originally posted by 308Sako:
GSSP, There are indeed a few things more than just a single case measurment, the most important measurment would be of group size! I have had very good results with both brands, and prefer the Lapua for several applications basically because of the primer pockets being drilled and not punched.

Also I feel or think that it may be better therefore it is... or not!

I just wonder how much group size we're talking about here? As for punched or drilled flash hole's, I've finally started giving it a try. I use a drill bit mounted in a dowel for a handle. Yes I can feel the burr inside. But what I can't see is a lot of improvement in accuracy. I think that unless your benchrest shooting, quite a bit of this accuracy stuff is just a bunch of mental masterbation. But I does give us something to talk about doesn't it?

quote:

Originally posted by ireload2:
Lapua's offerings are so meager I don't see how they stay in the brass business.

Obviously the quality of their brass keeps them in the brass business.

The BR guys at our range all use Lapua others are just die hard Lapua. They don't make my caliber so I don't worry with them.
I have always had good luck with Rem brass in my 7mm08s and my hunting rifles will shoot in the .3s so why try anything else.
My 300SAUM is another story. I found a big difference in groups between two batches so ordered some Norma brass just to see the difference. It was the prettiest brass that I have ever receieved. 100 neck diameters measured .336 and not a single ding in any of them. I loaded up some for this past weekend and saw no runout, they all shot nice and all the necks had a very uniform smoke on them as they sealed. I think I will invest in another 100 of Normas.

All you guys that think Lapua brass cost too much are fooling yourselves. I have Lapua 220 russian and 6mmBr cases that have lasted well over 100 firings. I use them for match shooting for the first 25 or so shots and then retire them to varmint and informal target shooting. I load both cartridges to 60000-65000 psi. I've used my share of Winny and Remmy brass too. That kind of pressure ruins most brands in 10 shots or less, most of the time less. Load them down a bit and you may get 20 firings.

Yeah and Winchester doesn't make 9,3x62 brass, how can they stay in business? Fortunately I don't think I've been able to wear out a single Lapua 9,3x62 case.................DJ

Their commercial operation is too small to make any money. I am sure they make their money off of military contracts. They sure as heck are not going to make any money off of benchrest shooters that make a case last 100 rounds. You will not get that life with a standard factory chamber.

Most folks would/could not shoot if they had to depend on Lapua.

I have heard the same talk about Norma for decades and the all time worst lot of brass that I ever bought came from Norma.

As far as cost goes, compare Lapua that is not available to $.05 each once fired brass that is actually available.

or
22 Hornet
218 Bee
6MM Remington
25/06
7X57
30/30
303 British
7.65 Mauser
8X57
35 Remington
375 H&H
45/70

ireload2, The list is far longer than the one you posted. There is no question that Lapua isn't trying to meet the needs of all shooters, just the discerning ones. Says it right on every box you buy from them. If you wish to buy brass that has already been fired in some other gun, then I would have to put you in a different category than the typical Lapua customer. I shoot with a guy who pulls used patches out of the range trash can and takes them home and washes them. He doesn't use Lapua brass either.

quote:

Originally posted by pointblank:
ireload2, The list is far longer than the one you posted. There is no question that Lapua isn't trying to meet the needs of all shooters, just the discerning ones. Says it right on every box you buy from them. If you wish to buy brass that has already been fired in some other gun, then I would have to put you in a different category than the typical Lapua customer. I shoot with a guy who pulls used patches out of the range trash can and takes them home and washes them. He doesn't use Lapua brass either.

Your brass is going to be once fired after the first time too. In addition the discerning customer angle is irellevant when there is no supply for that customer's wants. They just have to put an excuse on the box. Marketing you know....

The tooling to make brass is expensive. You have to be able to sell a certain amount of brass just to pay back for the investment in tooling. Sorry but there's just not a big enough market for 218 Bee and 35 Remington for most brass makers to invest in the tooling required to produce it. It's simple economics, if they thought they could sell enough of a given caliber to make a good profit Lapua would be making it just like anyone else. But sometimes it a good idea to do a few things well than everything just so-so.........................DJ