At this point, the only dies I own are RCBS and Hornady. Both have given satisfactory performance, but I thought about trying a different brand like Forester of Redding for my recently acquired 223 rem just for the hell of it. Just wanted to get some input on what others thought of the currently available die sets.

Question:
What is your favorite reloading die manufacturer?

Choices:
RCBS
Hornady
Lyman
Lee
Forester
Redding

 

I voted for Lee, but whenever I pick up a new caliber I get a combination of manufacturers if available for that caliber:

Lee Collet Neck Sizer
Redding Body Die
RCBS Competition Seating Die
Lee Factory Crimp

I guess Lee got 2 out of 4 of those, so I voted for Lee.

all my new dies today are Lee.....and damn good stuff!

I voted Redding. Give the Redding Competition - Bushing Neck Sizing Die Set consideration.

Well, looks like Lee is the preferred die so far. Think I might know why. Just checked prices in Midway catalog and it appears you get 3 dies in a Lee set(full-length sizer, neck sizer, and seater die) as opposed to just a full-length sizer and seater die with others like RCBS and Hornady for roughly the same price. And after hearing veterans like vapodog and woods recommending Lee dies, I think I might just try them myself. The only feature I do not particularly care for is the lock ring which doesn't tighten. Does anyone know if RCBS or Hornady lock rings are interchangeable with Lee dies. Thanks.

I vote Redding.

quote:

Originally posted by molar1:
Well, looks like Lee is the preferred die so far. Think I might know why. Just checked prices in Midway catalog and it appears you get 3 dies in a Lee set(full-length sizer, neck sizer, and seater die) as opposed to just a full-length sizer and seater die with others like RCBS and Hornady for roughly the same price. And after hearing veterans like vapodog and woods recommending Lee dies, I think I might just try them myself. The only feature I do not particularly care for is the lock ring which doesn't tighten. Does anyone know if RCBS or Hornady lock rings are interchangeable with Lee dies. Thanks.

I use Lee almost exclusively. The Lyman locking ring, Hornady and RCBS do fit.

quote:

Originally posted by molar1:
The only feature I do not particularly care for is the lock ring which doesn't tighten. Does anyone know if RCBS or Hornady lock rings are interchangeable with Lee dies. Thanks.

Hey molar1

I actually prefer the lock rings on the Lee. Just make sure to thread the die in by turning the die with the lock ring only and use hand pressure to tighten, no wrenches. The rubber insert will be compressed the first time you tighten it and it will keep the setting. The rubber helps the die to "float" a little which may be one of the secrets to the low concentricity they yield. JMO

Lee are good enough for handguns.
I am a piss poor handgun shot, and dies will not make a difference.

But I have most brands of dies in .223, and I size with a Redding S die, and I seat with a Forster benchrest, and I decap with a Lee decapper.

Of the brands I have I like Redding the best

So far, of the 24 votes counted, there is only one for hornady. I am a little bit surprised. Hornady is the only one who uses an alignment sleeve on their seater die. Why no more votes for hornady?

quote:

Originally posted by molar1:
So far, of the 24 votes counted, there is only one for hornady. I am a little bit surprised. Hornady is the only one who uses an alignment sleeve on their seater die. Why no more votes for hornady?

email that question directly to Hornady and ask them!!! www.hornady.com

They made some very poor unhreaded spindle dies for a long time.....pure junk IMO

I understand they have returned to a threaded spindle but IMO the customer has walked away

I just bought a new Hornady Die set .25-06. As Vapodog stated they have returned to a threaded spindle. So far it's seems to be a great die.

I'll keep everyone posted how it works for me.

I picked Forster dies, although its their seater die I like best. Much better than the Hornady floating sleeve (although not a bad die). Sizers, I like the Redding neck sizers, but have used most body dies from either RCBS or Forster.

I just bought hornaday dies for my 9.3. They are different than im used to but worked good, Im not sure that seating die sleeve does any good. Ive only loaded 50 rds so far.

quote:

Originally posted by prof242:
I picked Forster dies, although its their seater die I like best. Much better than the Hornady floating sleeve (although not a bad die). Sizers, I like the Redding neck sizers, but have used most body dies from either RCBS or Forster.

Didn't know that Forster or Hornady had a floating sleeve in their seater dies. It's not evident from their description

Midway's Forster Seater die description
Forster's Seater die description

Midway's Hornady description
Hornady's Seater die description

How do they work? I use RCBS and it clearly says it has a floating bullet sleeve

RCBS Competition Seater die, note 5th paragraph

And the only body dies I've been able to find are Reddings

Redding Body Die

Hey Woods,
I have a set of hornady dies in 300 win mag and they do have a sleeve in their seater dies. Here is how hornady describes it.

Seating die features seater adjustment screw, built-in crimper, locking retainer spring as well as a floating bullet seater alignment sleeve and seating stem, which prealign the bullet and case before seating occurs

It's too bad LE Wilson is not on the list. Best seating dies out there. Redding Type S bushing sizer dies are my choice when it comes to FL sizing.

quote:

Originally posted by molar1:

Well, looks like Lee is the preferred die so far. Think I might know why. Just checked prices in Midway catalog and it appears you get 3 dies in a Lee set(full-length sizer, neck sizer, and seater die) as opposed to just a full-length sizer and seater die ...

It depends which Lee set you get. The ones I get have three dies -- a full length sizer, a seating die, and the Lee Factory Crimp Die -- for less than a 2-die RCBS set.

In my opinion the Lee Factory Crimp Die is a godsend -- crimping with it has been shown (see Saeed's tests) to give a small but definite improvement in accuracy.

http://www.accuratereloading.com/crimping.html

The only thing I do not like about the Lee dies is the round plastic box they are in. The flat RCBS boxes are much easier to stack.
___________

I just bought a new Hornady Die set .25-06. As Vapodog stated they have returned to a threaded spindle. So far it's seems to be a great die.

I'll keep everyone posted how it works for me.

I have not tried them all,but I like the Redding competition dies and the Wilson dies.

I am planning on neck sizing the 223 rem cases. My primary use for this rifle will be as a varmint gun. It seem that alot of people do not recommend neck sizing for hunting purposes. Anyone have thoughts on this matter? Also, what is the difference(advantages vs. disadvantages) between a bushing type sizing die, a standard neck sizing die, and the Lee collet die? Thanks.

quote:

Originally posted by molar1:
I am planning on neck sizing the 223 rem cases. My primary use for this rifle will be as a varmint gun. It seem that alot of people do not recommend neck sizing for hunting purposes. Anyone have thoughts on this matter?

The very first thought that came to my mind is this:


It's not recommended to neck size any cartridge meant for dangerous game. Just how dangerous are the varmints you're intending to hunt with a .223?

Dave,

I understand what you are saying and tend to agree with you. Groundhogs, coyotes, crows and such are not that dangerous, but at the same time, I do not want to be stuck with a cartridge that will not chamber when the time comes to blast those bastards. I am reloading for a bolt gun. In your experience, have you had any chambering problems following neck sizing only?

Check your fired cases in your rifle's chamber. If they chamber easily enough, you can get by with neck sizing. If the bolt won't close, you have your answer...NO necksizing.
I'm a lucky cuss and have two .223s that get by with necksizing and using each other's brass! My load right now is the 40gr V-Max or Nosler BT and sufficient powder for 3550fps.

I belive I have at least one die set from most of the major's some older no longer with us brands.

Then on top them I own a lot of lee dies.

I try and buy Lee dies when ever I can now days. Last check I had dies to load 50 plus cailbers.

Looks like there are alot of Lee fans out there. Their low prices kept me away in the past. Just figured you usually get what you pay for, but after hearing nothing but good things about them I think I'll give em a try.

quote:

Originally posted by molar1:
Dave,

I understand what you are saying and tend to agree with you. Groundhogs, coyotes, crows and such are not that dangerous, but at the same time, I do not want to be stuck with a cartridge that will not chamber when the time comes to blast those bastards. I am reloading for a bolt gun. In your experience, have you had any chambering problems following neck sizing only?

Like prof242 says, try them in your chamber. It also helps to understand (and measure) exactly what is going on with your brass. One of my most useful tools is the Stoney Point Head & Shoulders Gauge.

Typically new brass will have a headspace of .010" on an average. I have had as much as .0285". With the first firing the shoulder will move forward to within .005" of the chamber shoulder. The shoulder will move progressively forward until it becomes hard to chamber and you will have to size enough to push the shoulder back and make the brass easier to chamber. This usually take about 4 firings.

You can neck size only during the first 4 firings but after that you will have to FL or PFLR the brass anyway, unless you like grinding the loaded round into the chamber with the bolt.

There are many variable such as how hot your load is, what size your chamber actually is, size and type of brass, etc. Some calibers with low body taper (WSM's) get tight early and have to be fully sized to relieve the crush fit.

I just got a 22-250 and don't know for sure about varmint calibers but know that this is the progress in my 264, 270, 30-06, 300 and 338. So neck sizing is a temporary thing anyway, IME.

I voted LEE and thought I would be in the Minority much to my Surprise.

quote:

Originally posted by RugerNiner:
I voted LEE and thought I would be in the Minority much to my Surprise.

Welcome aboard Ruger... we are practically neighbors. Lee dies and Savage rifles are more popular than some would admit

Yes Lee dies and Savage rifles are popular but why do you think that is? $$$$ plays the biggest role in popularity contests. Thats not to say that either product is poorly manufacured, just that they represent a good value. Matter of fact, both Lee and Savage are known for good customer service as well. But for my money, Redding wins the contest of overall quality, versatility and overall value all day long. If you like collet dies, try a type S bushing die and see what you have been missing.

http://www.jamescalhoon.com/bonanza.php

quote:

Forster/Bonanza's patent has recently expired on the "BR" dies, and Redding has adopted many of the Bonanza features in their dies. RCBS is also using In Line seating systems in their fancy competition dies. Around here, the Bonanza "BR" Reloading Die Set has more than proven itself and will remain a favorite!

It sounds like Hornady may have started making sliding sleve seater dies now too.



http://www.forsterproducts.com/Pages/dies.htm

quote:

More than twenty years ago, Forster/Bonanza obtained U.S. Patent #3,440,923 for the design of the original Bench Rest® Seater Die. That patent covers the use of a specially machined, close fitting chamber that holds the case, the bullet and the seating stem all in perfect alignment. This innovative chamber design is still the hallmark of our Bench Rest® Seater Dies, because it's the premier system of all the so-called "in-line" seater systems that actually supports the entire outside diameter of the sized case rather than just the bullet and case neck.

The shiny part on the bottom is part of the sliding sleeve and goes in and out of the body as the case pushes in. It is spring loaded to come back out.

What is the difference between a lee collet die, standard neck sizing die, and bushing type neck sizing die? More importantly, will there be a discernible difference in accuracy between ammo produced with a bushing or collet die and standard die when shot out of a standard production rifle?

quote:

More importantly, will there be a discernible difference in accuracy between ammo produced with a bushing or collet die and standard die when shot out of a standard production rifle?

NO

First of all, IMO neck sizing isn't the best sizing option anyway, but especially in a factory rifle. In most factory rifles, the chamber isn't cut all that concentric with the bore. So if all you do is neck size, then it stands to reason that if you have a tight fit with the chamber, your loaded round will be canted, or not lined up with the bore. If you FL size every time however and you are able to touch the lands with the bullet upon chambering(not all factory rifles will allow this), then the bullet will start off on the right path. When I set up a FL die for sizing, I use a few times fired case that is a little tight on chambering. I run the ram of the press up as far as it will go. I then screw the sizing die onto the case until it stops. I then make minor adjustments to the die(screwing in down further in the press) until the case will chamber easily. You will need to pull the case from the shellholder and chamber it in the rifle quite a few times until finally, it chambers with no "feel". I'm talking 1/8th of a turn at a time. When you find the right spot, lock the locking ring in place on the die. I have most of my FL sizing dies set up to "bump" the shoulder of the case back .001"-.002", for easy chambering without working the brass too much. The other thing that keeps the brass from being sized to much is the bushing. Measure a loaded round. I have one here. its a 6mm Ackley winchester case. With a Berger boatail bullet it measures .270". The amount of neck tension I need is usually .003 for a hunting rifle. So I would choose a .267 bushing. Now intead of pushing my case into a reagular sizing die which would squeeze the neck down to .260 or even less, Ive limited the amount the brass is sized. Also in a regular sizing die since the neck has been choked down so much, it must be pulled across an expander ball to bring it back up to the size where it will accept a bullet. When this process occurs, nothing is supporting the case as its expanded back to size, creating runnout(crooked brass). The other advantage to using fl bushing dies is that your brass will last longer.

I should explain...

If accuracy is the goal (as it should be) the place to spend your efforts are:
1. the rifle itself...bedding and sighting
2. you...your personal habits in shooting
3. your ammo but primarily which bullet you use and then which powder

When you can actually say you're shooting real no baloney 1.00" groups at 100 yards quit wasting your time trying to improve as it's not worth the effort.

If you really want to do better than that become a benchrest shooter...the game changes and you can be as finnicky as you want!

Hey Vapodog,

My rifle is a ruger 77mkII stainless laminate. It loves factory hornady 55 gr v-max moly ammo. It will consistently shoot .4" 5 shot groups at 100 ys. At $16 per box, it is getting quite expensive and so I am thinking about reloading for it. Just worried that I will not find a combo that produces this accuracy level and was curious as to the effect that various dies would have on accuracy. BTW, does anyone have a 223 rem load worked up using a 55 gr v-max?

vapodog, I fully agree that a proper beddng job and quality optics are nessecary as well as a good bullet, but I disagree that a reloader/shooter shouldn't try to improve on 1" groups on a factory gun. While some of them aren't capable of that kind of accuracy, some are. And if you are satisfied with 1", then why not just buy factory ammo. After all a deer rifle capable of 2" accuracy is plenty good to kill deer at most hunters max ranges. To me, the whole purpose of reloading is experimentation to find what that the rifle wants to eat. I shoot competitive BR and most all of my rifles are custom made by me, but back in the days when I started reloading, I did everything possible to make my factory guns shoot, and I had lots of them that would better 1" at 100yds, and I still have a few.

Molar1, you wont have a problem finding a good load in 223 for the V-Max. Those little bullets just shoot.

quote:

Originally posted by pointblank:
Molar1, you wont have a problem finding a good load in 223 for the V-Max. Those little bullets just shoot.

Yup..that's for sure.

I like BL(C)-2 in mine

BTW my comments above pertain only to hunting rifles!