Hello, I am having a problem F/L sizeing R-P cases. with the case lubed it runs up in the die easy but when extracted it comes out easy until the (expander ball) reaches the neck and then the force is so great(almost as if the BALL is too large for the neck)that i have had 2 case rims pull off in the shell holder and the case is stuck in the die! Also when the cases do come out, the neck looks like an oval,(not perfectly round). I am using a Lee 007 press, RCBS F/L die, adjusted to touch shell holder+1/8 turn. I have reloaded pistol cartridges and 30-06 and never had this problem before. Thank you for your time.

How are you going about "Lubing" the inside of the Case Neck?

Almost certainly the problem is insufficient lube for the inside of the case neck. Whatever lube you are using needs to be inside the case neck as well as on the outside of the case. Personally I like the Imperial wax lube.
ema39

Maybe thats my problem, As i do not lube the neck, Only the outside of the case. I have read several things that say not to lube the inside of the case neck, (right or wrong)thats what i've practiced. If i do lube the neck, what is the best way to remove lube as to not contaminate my powder charge?

The absolute best method of lubing the inside of the case neck is to wrap a piece of Armorall Protectant Wipe around a small caliber brass brush on a section of cleaning rod and wipe the inside of the case neck with it. Slicks it up real nice and does not have to be removed.

Thanks, I will surely give that a try. I am kinda new to the rifle reloads. I started with my grandfather when i was young and he passed when i was 18. We mostly did pistol for indoor range, Wadcutters and semi-WC for 38 and 357 as well as shotgun. I ran the lubrisizer so sorry for my lack of knowledge as i'm trying to learn. Thank you for your time. also would that cause the non-uniform necks? I assume so but doesn't hurt to ask.

What type of die are you useing? some dies have the expander high in the body (Forster for 1) and it could be too high and still in contact with the neck while it is being withdrawn. Lube the case mouths as suggested and make sure the expander is adjusted properly.

quote:

If i do lube the neck, what is the best way to remove lube as to not contaminate my powder charge?

Use Lee lube and you don't need to worry about contamination. Use it sparingly on inside neck. I use the appropriate size bore mop and Lee lube.

Never had a case even close to stuck. But I agree with Ol' Joe about expander being to high as well.

Lee lube is what i'm useing on the outside of the case so i'll try it on the neck. Thanks for your help, i'll give these a try and see how she goes. Thanks again.

Ok, after some investigation i think i found part of the problem. The .308 dies i have are from my wifes grandfather that passed away, and he was a wildcat fan and homebrewer. I have federal cases and Speer 165 grain grand slams which measure .308" right? Now i measured my (expander ball) in my 30-06 dies at .305", And the (ball) in my RCBS F/L .308 die is .309. Does this sound right or should i just go get fresh new dies?

I'm a little confused with this thread.

You say that it becomes hard to extract the case when the neck reaches the bushing.
I don't get this. The neck reaches the bushing on the up stroke. On the down stroke the neck will reach the expander ball.

You also say that the bushings of your dies measure .305 and .309 repectively. This is weird. The bushing in a .308 Win. die should measure something in the range around .334.

Or have you been talking about the expander ball all along? If this so, .309 does seem a wee bit too thick. It could be just .001 - .002 smaller. Just polish it down with some steel wool.

Yes, the expander ball, I misspoke and used the wrong term. Sorry for that. The expander ball is extremely hard to press in and out in my .308 brass. I do not have this problem in my 30-06 brass but i have new dies for 30-06. Also the ball in the .308 die looks different than any of my other RCBS dies in that the .308 is more squared off looking(more definite edges) and not gradually tapered to center in the case as my other RCBS dies.

quote:

Originally posted by icemanls2:
Now i measured my (expander ball) in my 30-06 dies at .305", And the (ball) in my RCBS F/L .308 die is .309. Does this sound right or should i just go get fresh new dies?

An expander diameter of .309" sounds excessive! Even with brass spring back, that would leave you with (almost) no neck tension to hold the bullet.

If the RCBS die is the one giving you trouble, I would either contact RCBS and have them supply a smaller expander, or polish your existing expander down - a diameter of about .305" sounds right to me.

- mike

I am not the original owner of the dies so i doubt RCBS will do anything, nor would i expect them to. My wifes grandfather may have been experimenting or somthing who knows what happened. I may just go buy a brand new neck sizer die and be done with it. The only rifle the .308's get fired in is my Sako 85 finnlight. Thanks for you guys's time. I'm learning and i wanna keep all my fingers.

quote:

Originally posted by icemanls2:
I am not the original owner of the dies so i doubt RCBS will do anything, nor would i expect them to.

Try it, though, you might get surprised. RCBS has the most amazing customer relations policies!

Besides, the expander itself is normally just a small "screw on" part, and even if they don't give you one for free, they will probably sell you one for a good deal less than it would cost to get a new die.

Btw, IMHO, it is better for you to stay with a FL sizing die (set up for PFL sizing - use search function here for that one), than a neck die. Unless you decide to get something like a Lee Collet die (possibly combined with a Redding Body die), neck dies have a nasty habit of producing a bunch of runout. Besides, even if you neck size, you'll need to (P)FL from time to time.

The die you have is likely fine, it just needs a smaller expander. Or as I mentioned above, stick your current expander assembly in a drill, and polish down your existing (oversize) expander with some emory cloth...

- mike

Thanks for all the tips. I will call them and see what happens. Maybe they have a few tips for me as well. Might as well try that first then spend money later if i need to. Thanks for your time.

Expander should measure about .306" Plus there is a difference in the expander/decapping unit over the years. Let RCBS know what date is stamped on the top of yourFLRS die. RCBS lube is applyed with a nylon brush of the correct caliber. Any excess lube is pulled out by the expander after sizing. RCBS lube will not contaminate powders. Even with normal dies, if the brass neck wall thickness is on the large side, it will take extra effort for the expander to pull out. This is why some use bushing dies to control sizing of the case neck.

I never lube necks, I do make sure my brass is VERY clean before I begin the process, but I never lube. I will polish a an expander ball down til I get smooth passage AND appropriate neck tension. I think you are on track with calling RCBS, and in the meantime, polish down your expander ball by chucking up the decapping/expanding assembly in your drill and spinning it on some emory cloth held in your hand. Lubing alone ain't your problem here, lube if you want to, but I know lots of folks who reload with utmost precision without lubing necks....

If I were to choose to lube, I would use a case neck graphite, you buy a little tin of pellets or bb's so to speak that are coated with the mica or graphite, and ocassionally refresh the powder....look on Sinclair or Midway and you will find what I'm talking about if you decide you have to lube.

Good luck

save that 309 ball expander.
someone was shooting cast boolits in their rifle and was no dummy.
just buy a new expander.
and if you don't want that 309 i'll pay postage and all.

Put a proper sized calibre bronze bore brush in your drill and brush out the neck of your brass. If you want to do a really good job, tease a bit of #0000 steelwool into the brush. That'll get rid of the crud.
I use a stamp pad to lube my brass and the way I do it is to roll my brass on the stamp pad and when I pick up each piece of brass, I turn it up and press the mouth of the case into the stamp pad like I'm trying to cut a biscuit out of the stamp pad. Not too hard. This puts just a slight trace of resizing lube on the inside lip of the case. Enough so that, in conjunction with the brushed necks, the resizing ball slides easily out of the case.
I then toss them in the tumbler and let them go. I've never made any special effort to remove any oil from the neck. I figure the media in the tumbler will take care of that and to date (lotsa years), I've never had a failure to fire doing it this way.
I think doing it this way helps reduce case stretch so's you don't have to trim as often.

quote:

Originally posted by icemanls2:
Maybe thats my problem, As i do not lube the neck, Only the outside of the case. I have read several things that say not to lube the inside of the case neck, (right or wrong)thats what i've practiced. If i do lube the neck, what is the best way to remove lube as to not contaminate my powder charge?

I tried this and it works like a charm.
SUPER DELUXE DRY NECK LUBE KIT
http://www.neconos.com/shop/index.php?cat=16&
I use it a lot on my 308 cases.

Call RCBS and tell them bet they will send you a new rod & expander ball the next day you don't need to send the whole die in.

Well I e-mailed RCBS about the expander ball problem and they mailed me a whole new unit including a pack of 5 decapping pins for free! That kind of service is unheard of today. Maybe my grandfather was onto somthing when he said long ago he only buys RCBS. Unless there is something that works a little better, i see no reason to buy anything but RCBS. They sold me!