I'm thinking about casting my own. If YOU were just getting into cast bullets... which would you choose for starting out in .38 SPL?

Or is it even worth it...... considering the good quality bullets commercialy available?

Not knowing what your personal shooting spectrum looks like I don't know if this will help, but here goes: I made the decision long ago to buy commercial cast bullets in bulk for my .38,9mm,.45 and even the 41 mag. I save my casting time and material for my rifles. There's only so much time.When I shoot handguns...it's generally a LOT of rounds in a day. I don't want to have to spend a lot of time, nor use up a lot of my supply of bullet metal when there are plenty of very decent commercially available supplies. There's not nearly the same selection available for my 250 Savage, .348 30/06, .308,.375 H&H and JDJ,45/70,.458 Win Mag,etc,etc. and I don't run through those rounds nearly as quickly. Your situation may differ....but that's mine.

I started my casting with 45 caliber bullets and after many years got in to doing 38 /357.
I joined a league that shot 38/357 rounds only at an indoor range and full wad cutters were not allowed.
I found a couple designs for accurate SWCs that I could cast for the matchs.. The most accurate was a nice little 140 grain from Saeco that's no longer made and a 150 grain made by Lyman. Both designs were plain based.I had Star, the sizer lube company, make a sizing die .3585. The bullets were sized to the cyclinder mouths.

Jim

I would try a box of 250 hollow based full wadcutters from Hornady or Speer. Myself I prefer the Hornady because their dry lube is less messy. A nice load that is very economical is 2.7 grains of Bulls Eye with at that 148 grain hollow base. See if you like them and then go from there.

If you are wanting to cast for the .38 SPL and haven't a lot of experience casting bullets then I'd suggest keeping it simple with a 2 cavity mould intitially. The Lee TL358-158-SWC is an excellent one to start with. It is inexpensive and with it you will learn the basics.

I do suggest you get Lyman #3 Cast Bullet Handbook at a used book store if you can. It is out of print and if you can't find one the new #$ CBH will do. Read and study the casting instructions up front carefully. It will teach you all the basics.

Also read the instructions that come with the Lee mould and follow them.

If you don't have a lot of the advanced equipment you can get by with a small cast iron pot and a dipper (Lyman & RCBS are better than the Lee). You can get a .358 Lee size/lube kit. Follow the Lee instructions for that also.

With that you can cast bullets easy enough, size and lube them for loading. Then if you find casting is not your cup of tea you won't have a lot of $s invested. If you like casting then you can get the more advance equipment. If that Lee bullet suits your 38 SPL needs for a general purose bullet (it does mine) Then you can get a 6 cavity mould (the 6 takes more experience which is why I suggest the 2 cavity to start with and learn) and really have at it. An electric pot, a lubrasizer and numerous other accouterments are then available to make it easier, quicker and allow for more variation in bullets and calibers you cast for.

In the 38 SPL or .357 Magnum you can then move on to some proven high performers like the 358477, 358429, 358156 from Lyman or sililar from a myrid of other mould makers.

You can also, with a bit of experience get a lot of help here.....but, you need to learn the basics first......welcome to casting.....

Larry Gibson

Thanks everybody for the information.

The double cavity 158gr. SWC seems like the logical way to go, but I like the accuracy of the 148gr. hollow base wad cutters in .38 SPL.

Are the hollow base wad cutters much more difficult to cast?

Hollow base is harder to cast and much slower because there is a plug involved that makes the hollow cavity. In all honestly as cheap as the factory hollow cavity wadcutters are from Hornady and Speer I'd go with those. You can buy them bulk too. Most who casts full wadcutters cast the solid ones and there are some called double end that doesn't make a difference which end you seat first as they are the same. Other type of solid full wadcutters have to be seated correct end first.

The hollow base wadcutters are not to be driven real fast. They are very soft alloy and if pushed hard you'll base the base of and in some instances blow hole through the bullet maybe leaving the hollow portion of it in the bore. Don't take that as they are dangerous, they are not. You will see loads devoted to hollow base wadcutters and that they are low velocity loads with fast burning powders such as the Bulls Eye I mentioned. I've shot thousands of them and nary a problem. They are extremely accurate and also very useful for small game hunting.

If your gun doesn't have any significant restrictions at the barrel/frame junction or the cylinder throats, a flat or bevel-based SWC or even full WC will work very well. The skirt on the Hollow base is like the cup on a blowgun dart, it makes up for a lot of dynamic fit problems and ensures a good gas seal from case to muzzle exit. Maintaining gas seal (obturation describes the action of sealing the bore with the bullet, not the expansion of the bullet to create that seal) is primarily responsible for eliminating 'leading' because positive obturation prevents high-pressure gas leaks/abrasion/cutting which deposits bullet dust in the bore, same as around the cylinder gap, frame, and cylinder face. The HB wadcutters are sort of like "cheaters" in a way, but I think they're best bought rather than cast unless you have one of the excellent MP Molds multi-cavity, brass, Cramer-style HB moulds.

If you think you'd like to cast your own, you can start on the cheap with a two-cavity Lee mould like the SWC described previously, and either tumble-lube with Liquid Alox or various other formulas, or pan-lube with a conventional, groove-filling lubricant. If you find you enjoy casting your own (like many of us do), you can invest in better tools, moulds with higher cavity count, and the biggie which is a lube/sizer machine. If you just want to plink with mild .38 loads, the tumble lube method will probably suffice.

There are a lot more details you will need to know if you choose to cast your own, probably beyond the scope of this thread, but if you decide to go that route we can get you up to speed very quickly.

One other consideration between the SWC and full WC has to do with the brass you plan to use. If you don't have true WC brass with the thinner case walls designed for deep-seated wadcutters, you can swage the base of your bullet undersized and that can cause leading problems with solid-base wadcutters. Maybe not with HB wadcutters, but I never tried them in regular brass.

Gear

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:In all honestly as cheap as the factory hollow cavity wadcutters are from Hornady and Speer I'd go with those.

I love the Speer 148 HBWCs for tack driving accuracy.

I haven't tried the Hornady HBWCs. They're probably good too.

I've tried some double base wad cutters. They're OK but not up to the accuracy of the Speer HBWCs.

quote:

Originally posted by rdharma:

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:In all honestly as cheap as the factory hollow cavity wadcutters are from Hornady and Speer I'd go with those.

I love the Speer 148 HBWCs for tack driving accuracy.

I haven't tried the Hornady HBWCs. They're probably good too.

I've tried some double base wad cutters. They're OK but not up to the accuracy of the Speer HBWCs.

Those factory hollow base wadcutters are swaged to they are dang near perfect bullets. Like I mentioned I use to shoot both and the accuracy was the same.

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
Those factory hollow base wadcutters are swaged to they are dang near perfect bullets. Like I mentioned I use to shoot both and the accuracy was the same.

Well, there go my hopes of duplicating those. And I see the Speer 158HPs are swaged as well.

quote:

Originally posted by rdharma:

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
Those factory hollow base wadcutters are swaged to they are dang near perfect bullets. Like I mentioned I use to shoot both and the accuracy was the same.

Well, there go my hopes of duplicating those. And I see the Speer 158HPs are swaged as well.

Don't get me wrong, with very careful good casting you can obtain some pretty good accuracy.

I don't see buying them when you can cast your own. I like RCBS molds.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
I don't see buying them when you can cast your own. I like RCBS molds.

Are any of the mold companies making a hollow base wadcutter mold? Slow as get out to cast them. You can buy them for like $40 per 500. Not worth the effort to cast them.

quote:

Originally posted by rdharma:

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
Those factory hollow base wadcutters are swaged to they are dang near perfect bullets. Like I mentioned I use to shoot both and the accuracy was the same.

Well, there go my hopes of duplicating those. And I see the Speer 158HPs are swaged as well.

There are swaging tools available. There also some very good WC moulds that allow very good WCs to be cast that can rival the swaged WCs. However, I still suggest a Lee 2 cavity TL358-158-SWC to get you started casting. Cast them of a quality 30-1 or even 40-1 lead - tin alloy, TL lightly in LLA. size at .358 and load over 3 gr of Bullseye will give you a very accurate load.

If you find you don't like casting you won't have much $s invested and can then just buy the swaged Speer or Hornady WCs.

Larry Gibson

Swaging can be very expensive, much more so then casting. CH and other companies make 7/8 thread dies for reloading presses that can swage bullet and are much cheaper then a whole swaging outfit. It's easier to buy swaged 38 hollow bases then to make them. Hollow base molds are complicated to use and getting good fill out in the skirt area can be a problem. This is not to say it can't be done. Those companies that sell swaged hollow base wadcutters also sell swaged SWC's. They shoot very well too, but I will add that you wouldn't want to push them to high velocity because they are very soft. With a 38 Special revolver you're not going to really be doing that, but in a 357 Magnum revolver it's a possibility.