This cast bullet page is staggering along like a gut-shot Confederate. What's wrong? Remember how the talk shooter cast bullet site used to rock? Is there any hope? Where's everyone gone? Got any ideas?

I wouldn't call this page lame, but a lot of the action has gone over to: http://cast_boolits.aimoo.com/

There's another pretty good cast bullet forum at: http://handloads.com/

The old group is all spread out.



Rather-- why don't you start a thread and contribute something?



The Accurate Forums have NO advertizing, NO censorship, NO moderator a-holes [Thanks Paul]... butt, in the cast forum we have a short supply of good natured de-bate.



Now I'm gonna post a drawing of an 'improved' version of the 311041 soon... IMO- there's two basic ways to flesh out something like this.



--you get the emmotional responses 'it'll never work' sans any rational input. The ol' reinventing the wheel comment..



--then ya get the Q's. Why so? Looks 'different' and why'd ya do that? This is fine. Gives a chance to explain the idea's behind such.



Cast shooten is so locked into old traditions and lore of yrs ago. Alot of this is purely well composted garden matter. True the concepts are the same-- but there's alot of ways to maximize the results for the better.

It's also not the greatest time of year. Hard to think of how your cast bullets are shooting with snow up to your butt. Not that I have that problem in south Texas. But I know some of you do.

Cast bullet shooters will always be in the minority. We are keepers of the flame, the lost art of early bullet making.

Most of the shooting world only thinks of bigger and faster, having forgotten simple cast bullets have killed most of the animals on earth, and probably most of the men!

We are priviledged to know the old ways and must always pass on our crafts to those willing to learn and follow.

That's my philosophy on cast bullets.

I've been poking around in the talk shooters archives and was struck by what I guess could be called a community-feel to it. I found a thread that went on and on about cat litter and using it for casting. I thought I'd try the response here. Look at the responses I got. The respondents must have been semi-euthenized, our spirits have been broken.

For instance here is a question to carpetman that got 65 responses:

Quote:

---

32887: Carpetman & Cats
04/19/01-6:12 PM Posted by: ultramag44
Carpetman,

Wife's out of town for the week, and the cat's annoying me. Do you have a
recipe for house cat? I know you really like them :-)

Ah..well..maybe I will just get a bucket of warm, soapy water and give him
a nice bath. Then a rinse in a bucket of warm clear water. He will really
appreciate that!

ultramag44

---

Is there anyone anywhere that could bring even a small percentage of that to this forum?
I like it here, I'm fascinated with guns, hunting, tight-fisted stuff. Go on over to the African forum and look up JudgeG in the archives and be amazed at his writing. And the same can be said for Saaed's hunting stories (stay out of the political forum if you are squeamish).
This isn't the only forum I'm disapointed with. Check out the horse forum. Six or eight threads with the personalities on the AR. I am chicken to post there after reading some of the posts that are there I'm afraid I'd get stomped writing about rodeo bulls, breaking horses in a swamp or deep snow. So I am guilty too. The big bore forum has it's own problems- they've got self-appointed assasins trying to track down "trolls" like they do any harm if they aren't publishing dangerous loading data or something.
I guess I'm the only one around that can see the potential of some of these forums.

AW you guys and your fancy pants shaped boolits. Nobody needs anything more that a plain old round ball of pure soft lead.
Sides, this time of year most folks are suffering from SAD. lol derf

"AW you guys and your fancy pants shaped boolits. Nobody needs anything more that a plain old round ball of pure soft lead.
Sides, this time of year most folks are suffering from SAD. lol derf"

I make that one vote for round balls...

I got no problem with round balls as long as they start a three inches and go up.
Jim

"I've been poking around in the talk shooters archives and was struck by what I guess could be called a community-feel to it. I found a thread that went on and on about cat litter and using it for casting. I thought I'd try the response here. Look at the responses I got. The respondents must have been semi-euthenized, our spirits have been broken"

Your whining about what? Not talking cats on the cast forum?

Contribute something other than carping. This ain't 'Outdoor Life' and last I looked there's no charge GB.

And responses like that are exactly what Ted was talking about.

He's right. These threads have lost their "feel" of community. No joking allowed. No bantering. Anything other than serious talk is either ignored or pounced upon. Just not fun like it used to be.

I believe most of it is the lack of any type of chronological reading. When you are able to read all the conversations going on without clicking on each individual topic, you get more of a flow. With Carpetman posting pretty regular on the Aimoo site again, things are getting pretty much back to "normal" for the old Shooters page there.

I visit the Aimoo threads every now and again, and I agree that they're more friendly than here.

45nut has put a lot of effort into making that site go, so I'm reluctant to criticize. What I dislike about Aimoo is the site. It's intrusive. When logged in, it causes my firewall to crash my computer because of the frequent probes from Aimoo. If I log in and log out again, I still get those probes. I also dislike the "cutsieness" of the site, with all the superflous pics and graphics -- I have a dialup connection, and changing pages takes a long time because of all the extra stuff that has to load. I donated some bucks to the site when things were getting started, but I don't spend much time there.

And C-man's presence isn't much of a selling point for me either.

Hello Mr. Aladin, Sir. You nailed it--"all spread out". This is likely the largest part. Another big part is the loss of cumulative synergy due to the demise of Shooters and the long term history of interactions. It's like all strangers at your hunting camp this year. For myself, with some moderate experience, but lots of dedication and willingness to profit, part of it is like going to Delphi but the oracles are on vacation or rarely seen. Yet another part is timing: i.e., winter doldrums. Therefore, I would like to offer a 31141 squashed down to about 120 grains, gas checked or no, .30 cal. and 31 cal., regular and fat, for everything from 30 carbine to patched for 8mm for consideration, all in one 4-banger, what do ye think? ned

I think the biggest reason is that all the hunting seasons are over. Some guys blame the snow because they must be older then me??? Hardly possible though. I still shoot no matter what the weather unless it is pouring rain. I also enjoy pulling someones chain for fun and everyone here has been good about it. Nothing better the a little discussion now and then.
Some of the other sites are deader then dead and I wonder how they keep going. They are only busy close to hunting season.
We have to face facts though, many guys have varied interests as far as the calibers they shoot and what they shoot at and the response will only be from those with the same interests.

G Ned Ludd,
You certainly got that right!
The 311041 or 31141,as it was origionally called,is my favorite 30 cal bullet.
I had a custom mold made, smoothe and undersized for paper patching.
It's adjustable in length,and I intend to use the short bullet in my 30 Carbine and the longest ones in my Krag and 300 Savage. I already have the mid sized bullet(173 grain)developed for my 30/30 Winchester.
I've got bullets cast and bullets wrapped and bullets loaded,but I'm stuck in neutral until the Weather lets up.
Frank

Aladin. I am an avid caster and cast shooter but I have a problem, can't shoot enough to really try anything I've loaded. Two years ago I managed to get squished under a falling blower chute on a wood chipper (I was on my hands and knees) and I am not mobile enough yet to do much at all without pain. The Drs. say I'll get better but I'm not now, I'm disabled. So I have every case I own reloaded and am stacked to the gills with cast ammo ready to go. I just don't have much to offer except stories. I just don't know if you guys want a lot of bullshit.

I do have a pristine Colt Officer Model Special target pistol that I managed to jam three jacketed bullets one behind the other in the barrel. I had loaded 125 grain Berry bullets behind 4 grains of Unique and was firing them wearing heavy gloves and ear muffs. I knew something was wrong when I stared at the target in the falling snow with no holes in it! There was no difference in sound or recoil just three rounds in the barrel one behind the next! The barrel doesn't appear to be bulged.
I always check all cases for missed powder before I seat the bullets, with a flashlight if I have a bottleneck case, I even shake the cases after I'm finished to doublecheck for a missed load. I just don't understand how I managed to ruin a priceless,to me, pistol. Now, can anyone help me on this one? Besides telling me I'm a dumbass.

Well, I wouldn't say you're a dumbass. Probably no more of one than the rest of us. methinks if all of us were totally honest, we'd have stories no to dissimilar to your's in one way or another.
Have you taken that revolver to a gunsmith to see if the bullets can be removed? He'd probably have to remove the barrel, drill most of the center part of the bullet out, then drive the rest out with a close fitting rod. I saw an old gunsmith, now long dead, do that with a .45 ACP barrel from a 1911.
hell, as long as we're being honest about our screwups, here's mine. I was loading light loads for an early New Model 1895 marlin with Lyman #457191 300 gr. bullets and 10.0 gr. of Unique. To hold the powder against the primer, I seated 410 shotgun over powder wads against the powder charge. Ringed the barrel twice. I suppose I could get Marlin to put a new barrel on, at whatever price they charge, but damned if that rifle don't shoot better with the two rings in it that before I goofed.
Want another? I once cut down 410 shotgun shells to fit i the chamber of a 1917 S&W. IIRC, 5.0 gr. of Unique and the over powder wad, then the shot, (I forget just how much I put in.) and an over shot wad made from an over powder wad that I split in two with a knife. it worked too, but after about two or three loadings, the cases would split at the rim.
Now, I'll let some one else commit to their faux pas.

Since there are 3 bullets, you might want to consider something like this. Clamping in a milling machine - make it very stable. Drill the first with a large drill, the second with a smaller drill. That will allow you to press the bottom one out by using a rod that will pass through the first two. Then continue by pressing the mid one out with a larger rod. That leaves the last one to be pressed out with a large rod.

Pre-treat with Kroil before pressing.

Here is one I did that could have been bad. We were driving deer in Minnesota when I had a branch slip into the trigger guard of my 500 Mossberg shotgun and fired it off! Luckily the slug went sailing off somewhere. I was a little concerned about abuse from the other hunters but mostly they had the "I'm glad that wasn't me look". My shotgun had the plastic safety slide that had broken the year before and I hadn't gotten it replaced. I was using the screw sticking out but had fallen into the habit of not using it. (The shotgun flew a long way behind me, I bet the look on my face was priceless!)

Well, since you are carrying a shotgun in a hunting party with no safety, that had been broke for a year, I know I NEVER want to hunt with you. I will add on my dumbass appelation.

a friend stacked some bullets in his single action Colt. He unscrewed the barrel, wrapped wet rags around it, and put the acetylene torch to the lead bullets. Melted out fine, and didn't seem to hurt the barrel. It was only used for BP loads, however. YMMV.

nelsonted, I used to enjoy the old shooter's dot.com site, and met a lot of nice folks there. I attended the first 4 Nevada Cast Boolit shoots and had a good time at each one. When Shooter's went down, a lot of the old bunch scattered to various boards. A lot of them are on Aimoo I have heard. The Aimoo people have made it impossible for me to post there, for reasons unknown to me. There are two posters over there that may be part of the problem, and they have both been mentioned in this thread. I don't know where the lack of spirit comes from on this board, but it is there. I see the same old boring questions asked, and when someone replies everyone has to jump in to try to one up the previous poster. There was for a time an honest exchange of ideas on the old Shooter's CB site, and we all learned a lot, I know that I did. I miss that here.

Best regards from Nevada duke, formally duke on the old Shooter's CB board.

The screw sticking up actually was a much better safety than the the original. It was very accessible, was stiff enough that it wouldn't accidentally be released and at the time the newer steel replacement hadn't come out. It wasn't a problem with the mechanics it was a problem with me not putting it on. Nice thing about AR there is an ignore list- we don't have to take abuse- just delete them completely out of our lives, I wonder if people realize that?

No you don't have to worry about hunting with me.

I'd sooner go hunting with someone who's learned (especially learning it the hard way) to keep the safety on. Personally I don't use the safety. The action is EMPTY until needed.

Like a gut shot Confederate, hmmmmmm ??



Now, please take this as "constructive criticism" if you can back off a bit and gain enough perspective to do so.



This is the synopsis of several e-conversations with Paul Hale (our Cast Bullet list Moderator) over the last few months on this very subject (conversations which predated this thread and had no roots here -- the roots go back a good bit further and cover a much longer span of time).



My conversation with Paul had to do with individuals who basically were (and had been for some time) acting like they were "unoffical" list moderators and acting like this list "belonged" to them. These individuals would pounce on persons and using "their authority" would attempt to discipline them for various things which were considered infractions of their standards by these individuals.



Penalties mentioned during these self-appointed "moderation/disciplining" disagreements went up to and included physical violence being offered to the offending party (pretty outrageous, huh? I thought so, too. If you could find him around here any more, Starmetal would agree.)



Mind you, these persons were NOT list moderators and had no authority but what they had usurped from the real moderator.



And the real moderator let them get away with doing this.



Yes Paul, you possibly should have stopped folks from acting like "informal jr. moderators" or you could have possibly wound up with what you've got now, a "sick" list.



Paul's comments were to the effect that the other list members were expected to challenge such behaviour when it took place.



Well, surprise -- nobody wanted to escalate such disagreements to that highly heated personal level, one(1) because it is very destructive to the list's mood and cohesiveness and two(2) to participate in such very heated discussions would result in your behaving in the exact the same fashion as the sort of "moderation" stuff you were currently disagreeing with.



A bad outcome either way. Lose-lose, big time. You'd wind up with "a pair of bullies" slugging it out in public to see who is the biggest bully -- a very poor situtation.



The REAL moderator can do this sort of stuff very effectively and quietly off-list with a simple e-mail, HE has the authority and the responsibility to do so and he can enforce it if needs be very quietly.



Not you, not me -- Paul Hale. This is not Shooters (an endless free-for-all at times) this is a moderated list.



So, what can you do? You tend to post facts. You keep jokes and emotional content at a minimum to keep from being sniped at by the "self-appointed". You do ignore any sniping activites from misguided individuals and you try to avoid potential conflict situations.



And in the end you wind up not caring very much about the list and you wind up moving on to other activities and places that are of more interest to you. That is just human nature, (especially if you keep getting occasionally "invited to move on" by the unoffical jr. moderators).



In case you haven't noticed, this list is staggering around like a gut-shot Yankee (sorry, I'm a North Carolina boy).



Perhaps this a viable potential reason or valid potential cause of the degradation that seems to have occured on this list?



=========================================================



Now, since this absolutely no name "generic" shoe has been placed up on the table -- let's see who is dumb enough to jump up on the table and force their foot on down into it.



You see, you got to volunteer to be an "unoffical jr. moderator" and to get laughed at and teased at for doing it.



<g>



Oldfeller

I thought it was great when all the cast boolit boys joined AR. I learned about beagleing (sp?) and saw that some were really excited about using cast boolits. That's great, however...

I think the troll wars have slid into or affected other forums. To avoid the gratuitous cussin', name callin' and stupid or dangerous recommendations I am one who's glad to have the ignore feature here that didn't work at the old AR forums. I noticed really quickly that when I quit reading the self-serving posts of those multiple personality freak(s) my blood pressure went down and I could see the individual trees again. Much more pleasant.

Posting runs in cycles. I know that my available time slides up and down the scale as I go through the week. Right now I'm at work, where I generally actually have more time to peruse the forums. My boss has no problem with this, but I wonder how many others have bosses who do. Maybe their just getting their frustrations out!

As to casting, I started in 1973 but mostly I buy commercial bullets now due to time constraints and because I'd like to try different bullets without spending the money on molds.

Your safety problem apparently isn't unique. I've read of some really dangerous activity mostly rationalized by the poster.

When that shotgun went off the hunter closest to me walked up and stood next to me as I stared at the shotgun laying on the ground (I was thinking I could have killed someone) and finally asked me if I'd seen a deer. I told him a branch had brushed the trigger firing the round off. I told him I was so ashamed of myself I couldn't get going again. He asked me if we needed a story, I said no. I told everyone what I'd done and we went off to lunch. We wound up spending a couple of hours talking about the stupid things each of us had done. I'm of the belief that we learn more by the disapointments and the stupid mistakes we make than from our successes.

'afternoon fellas,

Two votes for round balls- but I'll include the 162 caliber kind made of rubber and coated with surlyn- can't cast 'em though, so not as interesting.....

Lots of us Shooter's participants are scattered around on various sites. I think a Shooter's type board takes quite some time to build a following such as the one we enjoyed. Time will develop these sites- and in the meantime, each is taking on it's own personality.

Duke, I'm suprised to learn that you've been made to feel unwelcome at Cast Boolits. I post over there as well as here- and that site needs involvement/participation too. Certainly not the way to build a following!

Oldfeller, Hope all is going well with yoour family. I don't think I'll try that non-branded shoe on- you make great and valid points. Regardless of which forum I enjoy your imput.

Guess what? Great thread!

Regards.......