I have been debating whether or not to buy a cowboy action type of 30-30 bullet and was wondering what sort of luck/experiences if any people have had with them?

Try to get ONLY true flat based..I've shot away thousands in 30/30s sans problems( I stay below 1500 FPS wiht plain based ) Idabull

+ another for staying below 1500 fps with them. I actually prefer them in the 1000 - 1150 fps range. I use Bullseye powder for such loads with no filler or wad.

Larry Gibson

I have fired many thousands of them during cowboy silhouette matches and in practice. The key for me is the Cream 'O' Wheat filler. This allows 1700 fps with very good accuracy. Either Lyman #311041, the NOE version of it, or Ranch Dog's 165 all use the same loads and shoot about the same.

For more power I paper patch them, which allows full power and even better accuracy. They're fine for 500M highpower silhouette then.

quote:

Originally posted by Nobade:
I have fired many thousands of them during cowboy silhouette matches and in practice. The key for me is the Cream 'O' Wheat filler. This allows 1700 fps with very good accuracy. Either Lyman #311041, the NOE version of it, or Ranch Dog's 165 all use the same loads and shoot about the same.

For more power I paper patch them, which allows full power and even better accuracy. They're fine for 500M highpower silhouette then.

Nobade, I'd be interested in seeing what your results would be substituting the COW with shotshell buffer.

You sure upped the velocity and with accuracy with your COW loads. Nice work.

Aren't Lymans 311041 moulds ,and the alternatives shown,all designed for use with gas checks?? ?? Accuracy at 1700 fps and several notches higher using a gas checked bullet is a lay up, WITHOUT FILLERS !! Idabull

Seems to be a good question; is the OP asking about a FB'd bullet, even with a GC? Or is he asking about a FB'd bullet as in plain based and no bevel based?

Larry Gibson.

Larry I was primarily curious about a plain flat based bullet, thinking something in the 150-170 weight range. I guess I should have clarified that a little better. As I mentioned, my primary purpose is for a 30-30 but I'll experiment with using it in a 30-06 eventually.

At some point in the future I might fiddle around with paper patching as well but that doesn't necessarily have to be with this particular bullet though.

What is your intended use going to be...that is just paper punching, hunting, etc?

quote:

Originally posted by Mark:
Larry I was primarily curious about a plain flat based bullet, thinking something in the 150-170 weight range. I guess I should have clarified that a little better. As I mentioned, my primary purpose is for a 30-30 but I'll experiment with using it in a 30-06 eventually.

At some point in the future I might fiddle around with paper patching as well but that doesn't necessarily have to be with this particular bullet though.

With the plain based bullets I stand with my 1st post; "+ another for staying below 1500 fps with them. I actually prefer them in the 1000 - 1150 fps range. I use Bullseye powder for such loads with no filler or wad." Unique will be an excellent powder for 1200 - 1500 fps.

Larry Gibson

Mark, this is a load that I've come to like for use in my NEF Handi .30-30 barrel.

Note: I've switched bullets to Hunters' Supply 165 gr. FPs sized to .311" (they mic closer to .3105") from the Mid-Kansas 165 gr. FP sized .310" because Mid-Kansas went out of business. But they are basically the same bullet design. Plain Base FP of almost same dimensions.

These bullets also shoot great in my various .308 Wins.

The OAL of the cartridge above is established using the crimp groove as designed (so good in tube mag lever actions).

In .308 Win. (probably also true for .30-06) I seat the bullet out further and don't use the crimp groove.

PS - The load above is very quiet.

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
What is your intended use going to be...that is just paper punching, hunting, etc?

Mainly just a cheap plinking round, I suspect the largest and most dangerous game will be rabbits and squirrels at 35 yards and probably the longest distance shot at everything else would be 75 yards.

quote:

Originally posted by Mark:

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
What is your intended use going to be...that is just paper punching, hunting, etc?

Mainly just a cheap plinking round, I suspect the largest and most dangerous game will be rabbits and squirrels at 35 yards and probably the longest distance shot at everything else would be 75 yards.

Yeah for that purpose no sense in adding to the cost with gas checks. You'll do fine with flat base bullets and you'll have a whole wide range of alloys you can use too.

quote:

Originally posted by Mark:

Mainly just a cheap plinking round, I suspect the largest and most dangerous game will be rabbits and squirrels at 35 yards and probably the longest distance shot at everything else would be 75 yards.

Mark, the plain based 165 gr. FPs at sub-sonic will work great out to about 100yds.

At 35 yards and under for plinking and small game, you might want to consider plain based lead pistol bullets or even round balls.

At this point I am just wanting a "one bullet for everything" approach. Something simple that I can teach my kids how to cast and load so they can eventually do it themselves without supervision if need be, in a gun they can carry into the woods instead of a 22 if they want.

a quick look at my lymans mold guide past and present.
and not looking too closely, showed about 30 different plain based molds suitable for what you want.
the magma mold that most commercial companies use is a good design except for the bevel base and the undersized nose they typically have.

the closest to that is the rcbs 150 fngc one of my favorite 30 cal molds but takes a gas check.
but i have pushed it to full velocity in the 30-30.
you could try it without the gas check at the 1k velocity as many have done well shooting g/c boolits without them.

quote:

Originally posted by Mark:
At this point I am just wanting a "one bullet for everything" approach. Something simple that I can teach my kids how to cast and load so they can eventually do it themselves without supervision if need be, in a gun they can carry into the woods instead of a 22 if they want.

My recommendation would be a 165 gr. LFP similar to the Hunter's Supply bullet.

Now, it's not a "one bullet for everything" solution..... but would work fine for plinking, small game, and varmints. ........It's a very practical and economical "trigger time" bullet.

For larger medium game I'd just switch to a full throttle jacketed bullet.

quote:

Originally posted by DaMan:


Mark, this is a load that I've come to like for use in my NEF Handi .30-30 barrel.

Note: I've switched bullets to Hunters' Supply 165 gr. FPs sized to .311" (they mic closer to .3105") from the Mid-Kansas 165 gr. FP sized .310" because Mid-Kansas went out of business. But they are basically the same bullet design. Plain Base FP of almost same dimensions.

These bullets also shoot great in my various .308 Wins.

The OAL of the cartridge above is established using the crimp groove as designed (so good in tube mag lever actions).

In .308 Win. (probably also true for .30-06) I seat the bullet out further and don't use the crimp groove.

PS - The load above is very quiet.

not that I like to agree with my 'best buddy' here.. but I have loaded this bullets for kids in 30/30 with a charge of 10 grains of Unique...several young boys have taken blacktails with them, bang/flops each time and distance of under a 100 yds or so...

In my old Sav. 170B 30-30 pump gun I shoot the Lee 170 gr. RNFP. cast from straight WW alloy with two light coats of Lee Alox/JPW lube It's a gas check design but I leave it off for my plinking ammo.

I use 7.0 grs. of Alliant Red Dot with NO FILLER that I throw with my RCBS Lil Dandy powder measurer using the #16 Rotor. MV average is 1250 fps. and it shoots a good as you can hold it at 50 yds. with the irons.

Mark I have been shooting the Lee170 GC and Ranch Dog 165 GC Minus GC in a Marlin 30 as and a 336 with straight W/W and 8.5 grns Unique at 50 yds irons so far with minimal leading and 10 grains Gas checked sized at .311 with no leading at fifty with irons moa with these 55 yr old eyes. Gotta scope it to see the full potential one of these days. I developed these loads for the 8 yr old grandson and he is a stick man that shoots these loads with no complaints.

An update-

I ordered a Lee 150 gr mould and it arrived yesterday, and on looking at the mould it has the most play of any lee mould I own, so I am going to send it back for a replacement. I looked that the lee website and there is a method for peening down the sides to tighten up loose moulds, but it is also suggested that if you hold the mould upside down it will close easier, which this one does not.

Anyway, I'll see how the replacement is and if it is no tighter then I will know that that is how they are now and I just need to fiddle with it. My idea is that I can machine the gas check off one of the cavities so I will have one GC bullet and one flat base bullet.

quote:

Originally posted by res45:
In my old Sav. 170B 30-30 pump gun I shoot the Lee 170 gr. RNFP. cast from straight WW alloy with two light coats of Lee Alox/JPW lube It's a gas check design but I leave it off for my plinking ammo.

I use 7.0 grs. of Alliant Red Dot with NO FILLER that I throw with my RCBS Lil Dandy powder measurer using the #16 Rotor. MV average is 1250 fps. and it shoots a good as you can hold it at 50 yds. with the irons.

That is a nice looking group there! This is pretty much what I am trying to accomplish as well.

Mark.
I well understand what you are after.

A number of years ago I had made up 308's for two of my nephews. I loaded up a BUNCH of lyman 311410, 130 RN Plain base bullets with about 10 grains of Unqiue. They shot the heck out of those loads, they even killed a couple of deer up to about 60 yards with it.
When they got big enough they then went to a load of 4895 under a Speer 165 spizter

Currently I am working on what cast bullet to use for my own son.

It will be either the lyman 311410 or a modified 311291, a 170 RN bullet, that I will remove the gas check on the mould, the guns will be either single shots or bolt actions.

My first choice of powder would be Unqiue, or 5744.

Good luck with your project.

J Wisner

Lyman 170 gr. flat nose, gas-checked, is doing ~1.25-1.50" at 100 yd. out of a rebarreled Highwall with 15 gr. of 4759.

Clarence

I've loaded several hundred for a nephew's 99 300 Savage over the years. He's terrorized the ground squirrels in the Baker, OR area for ten years. He just gets the 32-20 PBBB bullets from Oregon Trail by the 1000 round box. 3 miles from his house.

Rich

lyman used to make a mould 311241 that was plain base a 155 round nose if you can find one
it makes a great flat base bullet. in my 788 30-30i can get 2 in groups at 50 yds
notto good for you young guys with good eyes but for a 80 year it will do

I cast a 155 gr. plain-base bullet flat point from an NEI mould. Air-cooled WW's and lubed with home-brew lube, I use them in one of my Swiss K-31's for our local reduced course High Power matches. 8.0 grs. of Red Dot nets about 1150 fps, 6.7 B'Eye a little under 1100. Either load is superbly accurate and I can fired an entire match (80 rounds + sighters)without cleaning and never have even the slightest hint of lead in the barrel.
A few 100 yd. targets:






35W